Let's argue: If you're awake - everyone is. If you're not - no one is.

[ivankiss]

By 'argue' I mean discuss politely, of course.

I'm looking for honest opinions; backed up with actual experience. Not the usual 'there is no I or other' type of comments.

I'm obviously speaking of relative matters here.

So if the above mentioned statement is true; you becoming awake should result in an awakened collective, instantly. The moment you're enlightened; everyone is enlightened. Flawless, real-time synchronisation.

On the other hand; the idea is that once you awaken; the game continues on another level. Your job now is to spread your Light, your love and your wisdom and assist in the awakening of the collective.

I myself am kinda neutral here atm. Maybe leaning a bit more towards the second idea.

I've had experiences where it seemed as if me being super conscious meant that everyone around me was too. It seemed as if everyone knew damn well exactly what was going on. They did not use words to tell me directly that they're all God, but it was as if they were conscious of it. No matter what was being said or done.

Then again; I've also had experiences where it seemed as if I was far more conscious than everyone around me. This would imply that there are levels and degrees to consciousness. Which many disagree with. 

Would you say that we live in a 'enlightened world' right now? Apparently; there are many enlightened beings on our planet. How come the collective is not there yet then? How come there are teachers/gurus who teach others about all this awakening stuff? Wouldn't that be unnecessary if all they really needed was to wake up themselves? Or could it be that they are not truly awake? Is it perhaps how they keep on waking up themselves? By seemingly assisting the awakening of others? 

I think these are some very interesting thoughts to entertain.

Let me know where you stand.

...Unless there is no you, no other and no world. In that case rest in eternal silence.

Thanks.

 

 

 

 

[mandyjw]

 

Have you ever had one of those weird experiences, like an accident or disaster, where everything went REALLY wrong, but it was like you were sort of disconnected from it all, but at the same time completely immersed and you acted just how the situation required you to? It's not like you were unaware of the disaster, but you were unaffected in a deep way, and that is exactly what gave you the ability to act quickly and do just what needed to be done. From observing teachers in their element I think that's exactly what's going on there. It's because of their deep knowing beyond knowing that everything is fundamentally OK that they even have the power to align another with his own Okayness. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mason Riggle]

 

[allislove]

Just an analogy. Imagine you can have a dream where you dream "through" an infinity amount of characters simultaneously. If there is a self realization that this character is being dreamed by you, there is a lucid dreaming "through" this particular dream character. Lucidity is aware of itself, that there is only dreaming, there are no "other" characters, everything is you. If we take a relative perspective of another character: "Why I am not enlightened if that dream character is enlightened?". There is still a self veiling by identification with a character, there is no character.

"As life is, it is enlightened." – Osho
 

Quote

On the other hand; the idea is that once you awaken; the game continues on another level. Your job now is to spread your Light, your love and your wisdom and assist in the awakening of the collective.

Yep. Just an analogy.  Imagine you have an infinity amount of kids and you start to play with them in a sandbox and somehow kids forgot that they are yours kids. They start to fear playing in a sandbox alone, but you kinda naturally want to remind them that nothing to fear, they are always loved, safe. 

[Slizzer]

Man i really want to know this too.

[ivankiss]

Lovely. Thanks everyone.

I'm thinking; due to our interconnectedness, it is very possible to share certain information, plant seeds - if you will - that could trigger an awakening in others.

One may not be able to awaken another directly, but inspiring them to look deeper within themselves can surely be done.

I am at a point where duality and nonduality interplay constantly. I cannot deny the appearance and/or experience of individualism. Nor can I deny that it's all One, infinite and eternal. The boundaries are made out of the very same substance as all else is. Consciousness. But that does not mean that these boundaries are an error or serve no purpose.

Imo; an individual - call it a 'dream character' - can gain access to Source and 'channel' information into the realm of many. He acts as a vessel - in that sense. A conductor.

That is why I'd argue that spreading Light - from that standpoint - is indeed possible. One is forever complete and whole. But many may not know they're One.

Ultimately; the only thing that can change is experience. And I don't see why we wouldn't want to experience Heaven - Together as One.

[Mannyb]

@ivankiss I’m experiencing heaven right now with you, I acknowledge your “finite mind” as integral to our shared being, our shared love for awakening.

Namaste brother ?? Let’s radiate more love with beautiful threads like this one ☝? Thank you dear! 

Edited February 8, 2021 by Mannyb

[Consilience]

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

I'm thinking; due to our interconnectedness, it is very possible to share certain information, plant seeds - if you will - that could trigger an awakening in others.

I think this the case yes. It is amazing how indirectly this path can affect those not "walking it" merely by being in the presence of someone who is. I also have this gut feeling that these planted seeds may not necessarily sprout from one lifetime. In other words, even if the people you're surrounded by go their whole lives without awakening, this doesn't mean there isn't a "karmic aftershock" in their successive lives from the momentum of what you've shared. Of course this gut feeling cannot be verified... It's just something I've felt the deeper I've gone down the rabbit hole and with some of my own past life experiences. Perhaps I'm wrong. Perhaps it is both true and false haha. 

I'd also like to say - I think both of your perspectives in the original post are correct. We are the whole, and therefore when we awaken so too does every corner of the whole. But yet, we see that even ignorance, delusion is enlightenment. Simultaneously, we may find a deep yearning to help alleviate the suffering of others, to help others awaken, even though we've seen into the perfection, the nirvana of samsara.

[ivankiss]

@Mannyb Beautiful, thank you. Care to say a bit more about these words;

On 2/8/2021 at 10:10 PM, Mannyb said:

shared being

 

On 2/8/2021 at 10:10 PM, Mannyb said:

shared love for awakening.

Thanks!

On 2/8/2021 at 10:24 PM, Consilience said:

I think this the case yes. It is amazing how indirectly this path can affect those not "walking it" merely by being in the presence of someone who is. 

Definitely can relate. I'd say it's something one can become directly conscious of. I'd also say that that is the essence of our communication. Not so much on a verbal, as much as on a energetic/soul level. It is an exchange of information that - more often than not - goes completely unnoticed. 

On 2/8/2021 at 10:24 PM, Consilience said:

We are the whole, and therefore when we awaken so too does every corner of the whole. But yet, we see that even ignorance, delusion is enlightenment. 

Would not say that ignorance and delusion is enlightenment, but it's definitely a part of the whole.

On 2/8/2021 at 10:24 PM, Consilience said:

Simultaneously, we may find a deep yearning to help alleviate the suffering of others, to help others awaken, even though we've seen into the perfection, the nirvana of samsara.

Yes. I'd describe it as something natural once one starts seeing The Self in others. It comes down to Love towards the totality of Life. Simply put; the game one's played 'internally' in order to liberate themselves; now continues on a grander scale - a higher level. Everyone and everything is The Self now. The One. 

I'd also add that the realization of this is not nearly the same as the actual practice of consciously loving and helping everyone. It's one thing to have a brief glimpse of The Self in all...and another to relate to everyone as to The Self that they are - in real time.

It is the difference between an enlightenment experience and an enlightened being/living - I'd say.

Much love to you!

Edited February 10, 2021 by ivankiss

[Byun Sean]

Obviously not everyone is awake to the True Self if you just take one look at what is happening on the planet lmao.

 

Those unconscious people that you see is God pretending it is asleep and dreaming of what it's like to be asleep so it can experience duality from 

a higher spiritual point of view you might say.

 

When you wake up your perspective changes but you still operate within the relative just like everyone else as your human self.

The key is is that nothing changes other than your perspective. Everyone and everything was always you you just didn't realize it

because you were busy dreaming up separation.

 

Spirituality doesn't mean reality around you changes. It means you are finally starting to see life the way it is and the way it's always been.

 

Forget what it means to be enlightened. Too many fantasies on this forum of what enlightenment is with no direct experience. 

If you haven't experienced what your nature is for yourself I can tell you your in for the biggest mindfuck of your life.

Right now it's just a belief.  

 

Forget about enlightenment as an ultimate goal and just pursue more consciousness wherever that leads you.

[DrewNows]

Not everyone KNOWS their consciousness is the only consciousness, and so we have descriptions like "parallel realities/timelines/universes", some are more attuned to what the 5 senses reveal, this is fine 

so absolutely this is a valid perspective, of a higher order than most lol. There's an ongoing expansion of consciousness and metamorphosis of the human experience, inversion/ascension collapsing in on itself. imagine some beings incarnate already aware of who and what they are, it's no longer needing discovering, it's of resonance, if you will, naturally attuned to the higher frequencies of consciousness. The metamorphosis process is unique to the individual, it relates to what's able to be perceived/interpreted/created. It's very comfortable/normal after awakening to revert back and pretend life is actually the me vs world dynamic because it's also a valid perspective, however, born of illusion, it's disconnected (ego regains control) and so we find ways to reintegrate/balance/harmonize who and what we actually are, putting the ego in it's place, rather than being controlled by it 

Edited February 15, 2021 by DrewNows

[Vibroverse]

If you're in alignment with the Self, then only what you deem to be good can come to you. 

[Heaven]

If everyone was enlightened God couldn’t fully experience himself and creation will go back to the origins.

Life is perfect the way it is but paradoxically undeniably work in progress. 
It’s the game of life.

I don’t believe you can help the ego mind without it to give up/understand that his way just doesn’t work. But from my experience your presence can awake people without you “do any activity”.

 

 

 

[VeganAwake]

Yes no one is awake ?

[blackchair]

i set people free, that's enough for me in this lifetime. what happens to me doesnt matter. people/world matters.

Being awake (for me righ not) is so silly little game....

[Quantum Toad]

How i see it is that you become aware that everyone is already god, already enlightened, already a master in themselves, but not all of them are 'aware' of it as you are. Goes back to the Buddha, the greatest master of all. Awareness is everything.

Edited February 16, 2021 by Quantum Toad

[blackchair]

1 minute ago, Quantum Toad said:

How i see it is that you become aware that everyone is already god, already enlightened, already a master in themselves, but not all of them are 'aware' of it as you are. Goes back to the Buddha, the greatest master of all. Awareness is everything.

[ivankiss]

This one time; I was tripping balls on shrooms and had a full-on nondual conversation with a friend. The content had nothing to do with enlightenment. But it was in pure Light. It literally felt like I was speaking through her mouth. It was as if I already knew exactly what she was about to tell me. Word for word. It felt super in-synch. Everything was perfect and inevitable. 

God was having a conversation with itself.

So there's that.

But that's not where we as a collective are atm -imo. Not consistently. We do not operate on those highly synchronized levels. We're not conscious enough - simply put. 

Whether or not that is something that's directly linked to how conscious I am...is yet to be discovered.

 

[seeking_brilliance]

Kind of like when I'm drunk? 

[WaveInTheOcean]

You may want to read https://www.amazon.com/Living-Classroom-Collective-Consciousness-Transpersonal/dp/0791476464 

In his book Chris Bache talks about how it seemed like his level of consciousness affected his students with all sorts of synchronicities.

Consciousness is contagious, no doubt;)