Fear of death and the unknown

[Tal]

Hi,

I am 20 years old and i started meditating at 15 y/o, and became interested in enlightenment very early. i had many mystical experiences. two years ago i felt like i am dying and losing myself when i was sleeping. i was very frightened and and i became depressed and i was so hopeless that i accepted to take psychiatric drug to to deal with this. This drug completely suppressed my spiritual development and lowered my consciosness by a lot. Now after stoping the drug i am so fearful that i will die , i am very afraid of letting go and allowing myself to heal. i have traumatic memories of being so helpless and so confused and feeling that i am losing myself and disociation of my body. like i cannot feel safe inside myself. i wanted to ask for advice if anybody knows or had a similar experience. How do you heal yourself and develope spiritualy if you are so panicked of letting go ( because in the past i have let go and that led to very good experiences and also hell of experiences which freaked me out and made me traumatized). 

[Kyle Gjerseth]

I'm by no means an expert, but I would suggest seeing a professional psychologist, or one thing that helped me tremendously was a half tab of LSD. I can certainly relate to a fear of letting go, almost like a fear of happiness. Find some friends who make you feel comfortable and talk with them. I hope this helps and I wish you the best on your journey

[Tal]

@Kalo  Thanks. I just don't see it as practical advice. I am literaly panicked of letting go by myself being alone, because that's what iv'e done up to this point. And also once you feel you are dying you think this is the end and you are losing yourself forever( at least that was my experience.) I really want to find some sort of mentor/ teacher who can help me surrender and heal in all was because now i am feeling terrible, my whole body hurts,i am fearful, i am not conscious. i have memories of ecstatic experiences and a sense of real happiness from the past, and that is what i want to go towards.

[Tal]

@Kyle Gjerseth  Thank you, this is very kind of you. I thought psychedelics are not reccomended at this young age. i saw a psychologist for a year on and off and it helped a bit. but it's hard for me to express myself so i do not benefit from it that much now.

[Breakingthewall]

When something scares you so intense, it is necessary to face it, if not your life will be miserable, sooner or later you will have to do it, so the sooner the better. The faster and less risky way that I know are the psychedelic

[Nahm]

12 hours ago, Tal said:

Hi,

I am 20 years old and i started meditating at 15 y/o, and became interested in enlightenment very early. i had many mystical experiences. two years ago i felt like i am dying and losing myself when i was sleeping.

The relief is in the truth, and in truth you chose a belief rather than truth. Not a problem at all, but is why you’re still believing in death, fear & sleep. 

If it don’t resonate with the creator - wise creator stops creating “it”. 

Quote

i was very frightened and and i became depressed and i was so hopeless that i accepted to take psychiatric drug to to deal with this.

A prescription has yet to be written to God - only to I’s. Big Pharma is a false icon.  

Quote

This drug completely suppressed my spiritual development and lowered my consciosness by a lot.

Blame is a natural though false deflection. In response-ablity, a thought in discord with feeling isn’t focused upon in the first place. 

Innocent to fear though, don’t make that the new narrative which doesn’t resonate, truly, wholly, holy - let it go, and it exists not. 

Quote

Now after stoping the drug i am so fearful that i will die , i am very afraid of letting go and allowing myself to heal.

‘I’ won’t, can’t die, because ‘I’ and ‘die’ are thoughts, you’re aware of.  Maybe talk to someone whom profit of fear & scripts isn’t feeding their family, in addition to the academic medical ‘care’. 

Quote

i have traumatic memories of being so helpless and so confused and feeling that i am losing myself and disociation of my body. like i cannot feel safe inside myself.

“I” can not be inside of self. Of course that’ll feel meta off. 

Quote

i wanted to ask for advice if anybody knows or had a similar experience. How do you heal yourself and develope spiritualy if you are so panicked of letting go ( because in the past i have let go and that led to very good experiences and also hell of experiences which freaked me out and made me traumatized). 

By no longer pretending something is wrong with you. Let go of thoughts which don’t feel good, and you’re on the path, awakening, already. Don’t fear the release of the belief in fear. 

Not tryin to ‘knock ya’, definitely been there. You got a notion to say when something don’t feel right. Stay ‘there’, let it be that simple, it’s the ‘great sought after awakening’ in and of itself, veils are the beliefs, not fear (that’s just another belief about yourself). 

Recognize thought attachment to stop traumatizing yourself for God’s sake. 

Notice those around you experiencing as such. Notice their psychology is self defeating. Notice conditioning, the apparent inheritance of said conditioning. We inherited garbage, so to speak. Stay with you, your notion of what doesn’t feel right, to you, don’t sell yourself short, ever. Don’t fall for the douchery.

[Inliytened1]

16 hours ago, Tal said:

How do you heal yourself and develope spiritualy if you are so panicked of letting go ( because in the past i have let go and that led to very good experiences and also hell of experiences which freaked me out and made me traumatized). 

Right now the panic and anxiety is due to a fear of the unknown and lack of certainty.  To fill this void of uncertainty your mind is imagining all types of horrible scenarios that might occur..  But realize this for what it is: imagination -  illusion.  It is all self deception.   When you actually find the inner strength to face the fears head on - feel through them fully - the illusion will be lifted and seen for what it was..  Once it is seen as illusion the gig is up.  You'll feel liberated - free from the shackles of your own mind.  They may try to come back but will no longer pack the same punch as they will be void of substance this time.

[snowyowl]

Hi, letting go can bring up fears of losing control, losing grip, losing yourself. My old Zen teacher Myokyo-ni used an analogy of learning to swim. It's fear of the unknown, of being swallowed up by the water, drowning and dying. The separate ego feels out of its depth and out of its element. 

The practice is to 'give yourself to the water', relax into it and learn to float.  As beginners we learn in the shallow end, so when the fear kicks in, our foot goes down onto solid ground and we feel safe again. We practice over and over again until the fear subsidies, we trust, relax, float. 

The sages tell us there is no solid ground to anchor ourselves, the depth goes on and on. Whoa, I'm not there yet either! The moral is, to find a practice which suits your level, gives you room for development, but not too scary and traumatic. Take care, keep safe and good luck. There's a huge variety of practices, so feel free to experiment if your current ones don't feel right. 

[Tal]

 

Thank you to all of you! It makes me cry to read it, because I suffered so much( It's hard for me to believe that other people suffered as I did, but I don't really know) I can't hold it anymore. 

@Nahm

On 2/1/2021 at 5:29 PM, Nahm said:

The relief is in the truth, and in truth you chose a belief rather than truth. Not a problem at all, but is why you’re still believing in death, fear & sleep. 

I feel you are talking to me not at my current level, but thank you for the insight.

I really wanted practical advice for my level. Like talking to a therapist, doing some kind of yoga, breathing, healing etc.

On 2/1/2021 at 5:29 PM, Nahm said:

If it don’t resonate with the creator - wise creator stops creating “it”. 

 

By creator you mean what? 

On 2/1/2021 at 5:29 PM, Nahm said:

A prescription has yet to be written to God - only to I’s. Big Pharma is a false icon.  

The tragic is that I went not too long ago to a psychiatrist that also has interest in spirituality and he told me that the drugs given to me were like the opposite of psychedelics, meaning they make your ego stronger and smaller. I can't agree with that more, The amount of suffering I experienced was insane. Imagine that not only you erase your meditation progress, but you actually make it worse than before you even started to meditate, your ignorance and attachment to ego, thoughts, self-image, selfishness increases. Because I experienced some ups and downs in life, I now do really appreciate the suffering of some people, life is tough until you get to the 'very top'. 

On 2/1/2021 at 5:29 PM, Nahm said:

Blame is a natural though false deflection

I'm not blaming the drug, I'm just saying the effects it had on myself.

On 2/1/2021 at 5:29 PM, Nahm said:

Maybe talk to someone whom profit of fear & scripts isn’t feeding their family

what do you mean by profit of fear & 'scripts' , what people are you referring to, is it modern clinical psychologists?. Also ,then who should I talk to instead? 

 

On 2/1/2021 at 5:29 PM, Nahm said:

“I” can not be inside of self. Of course that’ll feel meta off.

 The definition of "i" is self/ ego, and it's natural to be attached to your self, and what happened to me is that I was not feeling safe because my whole reality was vibrating and I lost touch with my 'original regular self'. From there I reacted impulsively, avoiding it and trying to feel my body by touching it and 'remembering' my old connection to my body and reality as this finite self- body- identity.

 

On 2/1/2021 at 5:29 PM, Nahm said:

By no longer pretending something is wrong with you. Let go of thoughts which don’t feel good, and you’re on the path, awakening, already. Don’t fear the release of the belief in fear. 

Thank you! what do you mean by the fear as belief? Fear is a real feeling like joy, isn't it? so are you saying that joy is also a belief? or are you saying that the content of the thought associated with the fear is not true? and do you mean that I should let go of the fear, and let it disappear on it's own, or to detatch from the fear and observe it ?

 

 

[Tal]

@Inliytened1 First of all, thank you I do appreciate your helpful comment. I was asking because I am really affraid that my fears will come up again and I will lose control of my life again. I want to recognize the truth of the situation, but I feel like I need a 'right' environment for that, like someone supportive being with me when I let all the trauma out. I do want to feel liberated. Do you know or anybody else of some form of therapy of trauma that let's you express your self freely without judgment. I feel like if I'm gonna start crying and releasing emotions in my house with my family, they just would not understand me and judge me for that. Do you think it's still ok to just let everything out by myself or go to a 'right environment'?

 

[Tal]

@snowyowl Thank you I like what you said about the fear subsiding and feeling safe again so you can relax and float. I do need to modify my practice because I am sometimes terrified of meditating. But Always after I feel more relaxed and clear.

[Tal]

@Breakingthewall Yes I do need to face it next time it arises, thx too

[WelcometoReality]

@Tal If you're not ready to let go it's best not to push yourself to let go. Connect to that which is unwilling to let go that's the way to heal.

[Nahm]

The relief is in the truth, and in truth you chose a belief rather than truth. Not a problem at all, but it’s why you’re still believing in death, fear & sleep. 

•      I feel you are talking to me not at my current level, but thank you for the insight.
•      I really wanted practical advice for my level. Like talking to a therapist, doing some kind of yoga, breathing, healing etc.

Blame is a natural though false deflection

•      I'm not blaming the drug, I'm just saying the effects it had on myself.

 

Not blaming the drug, I meant the ‘lowered my consciousness’ part. Consciousness is not some thing people have nor do. Attributing what you’re actually experiencing in feeling, to the ‘lowering of your consciousness’, acts inadvertently as a smokescreen. Without the smokescreen, it’d be practical... “I don’t like how I feel, and I want to feel better, asap”. The orientation here is directly toward feeling, not ‘raising your consciousness’. 

In this trajectory, you’d naturally look to understand & lift the very emotions you’re experiencing, finding that some perspectives feel good to you, and some don’t. Since you’re oriented toward feeling better, you’d be inclined to choose the better feeling perspectives. This ‘path of feeling better’ leads directly to truth, which is the greatest possible feeling. It is the very ‘better feeling’. 

Feeling ‘itself’ is guiding you. But (purely-innocently) rather than listening to ‘it’, you are inadvertently hijacking your own guidance out from under yourself, by claiming it as some thing you have or do.  This is ‘conditioning’.  You learned this perhaps, from the muggles & sleepers. Sorry you had to go through that. Excited you can choose otherwise, and will be feeling better in the guidance of your true nature. 

Imagine you’re in college and what you want more than anything is to pass the class you’re in, which happens to have the greatest, wisest, most loving teacher in the history of the universe. But you’re hardcore believing it’s your teaching...even though something about this feels very ‘off’. Imagine that teacher happens to be mute... and so you listen, via feeling. The more you listen, the more you understand & recognize the feeling language. Just like sign language. All happens in silence. Then imagine that teacher turns out to be the truth you were seeking in the first place, and that teacher was within you all along...super practical, perfectly reliable, literally always there for ya, always loving ya...just... you were focused on nonexistent “stuff” that doesn’t feel good to you. You’d been looking the ‘other way’ for a while.  

Abiding by feeling, is what ‘letting go’ is all about. Letting go of thoughts, perspectives, interpretations, misunderstandings, misidentifications...as they arise...that feel ‘off’. Every time you let a not-good-feeling thought go...more good feeling is uncovered. That’s the same better feeling you’d actually wanted in the first place. Perspectives wise, “if feeling says no, it gots ta go”.    Imagine brushing some lilies away, and seeing yourself more clearly in the water as you do, and feeling refreshing, clearer, looser, not so ‘practical’, more wavelike, flow, naturally concentrated & energetic, a mellow yet strong vitality of life. 

 

 

If it don’t resonate with the creator - wise creator stops creating “it”. 

•      By creator you mean what? 

 

What’s practical is what’s actual. You’re present, and experiencing the momentum, the unfolding, of your choices & what you give attention to. You’re creating what’s experienced next, now. Presently the focus is on fear, death and the unknown, and you don’t like how you feel. Your focus is on three things that don’t exist. That would feel ‘off’ to any one.  

The “unknown”, is literally feeling! Listen to feeling. Let it be known! Let it guide & lead you, joyfully. 

“Fear” is a label, being put upon that feeling-guidance, which doesn’t fit. Utilize the emotional scale instead. 

“Death” is some “thing” no one has ever seen, heard, or directly experienced. It’s a collective belief, rooted in misunderstanding and identification. As you use the emotional scale, you realize this via directly feeling this more & more. 

Take the wheel of focus, relish in the guidance of feeling, and make a dreamboard to co-create the life in your heart, of your dreams, with your source. 

Thought coagulates. You pick a good feeling thought, and more good feeling thoughts are already being pulled to it. Notice there is no actual effort, in picking a better feeling thought. It actually just feels, better. And better. And better. And better. And better. You’ll be feeling so good you’ll have to sit down and catch your breath. 

Between the dreamboard, daily morning meditation, a clean diet, using the emotional scale, and letting go of anything that does not align with feeling & what is on that board...you’ll have no use for the Nahm’s of this place. You will recognize this place, as your place. Your creation. 

 

 

 

A prescription has yet to be written to God - only to I’s. Big Pharma is a false icon.  

• The tragic is that I went not too long ago to a psychiatrist that also has interest in spirituality and he told me that the drugs given to me were like the opposite of psychedelics, meaning they make your ego stronger and smaller. I can't agree with that more, The amount of suffering I experienced was insane. Imagine that not only you erase your meditation progress, but you actually make it worse than before you even started to meditate, your ignorance and attachment to ego, thoughts, self-image, selfishness increases. Because I experienced some ups and downs in life, I now do really appreciate the suffering of some people, life is tough until you get to the 'very top'. 

 

I feel for ya man I really do, I’ve been there, pills, therapy, emotional roller coasters, etc, my story was also terrible. From using that emotional scale, changing perspectives, letting go, there wasn’t any more suffering. A mystically delightful day came, and it was realized no one else experiences ‘my suffering’, nor I ‘theirs’. It blew ‘my mind’ in a more literal than figurative manor, like oodles of goodness filling up the noggin day after day, again & again. Even, and especially right now as I type this to you.

 

 

Maybe talk to someone whom profit of fear & scripts isn’t feeding their family

• What do you mean by profit of fear & 'scripts' , what people are you referring to, is it modern clinical psychologists?. Also ,then who should I talk to instead?    

People who choose to sell you a solution, a product, a substance, rather than people who help you to align with our source. People who innocently just do not know, because they have not ‘done the work’ themselves. 

 

 

“I” can not be inside of self. Of course that’ll feel meta off.

• The definition of "i" is self/ ego, and it's natural to be attached to your self, and what happened to me is that I was not feeling safe because my whole reality was vibrating and I lost touch with my 'original regular self'. From there I reacted impulsively, avoiding it and trying to feel my body by touching it and 'remembering' my old connection to my body and reality as this finite self- body- identity.

All definitions are actually fluid connotations. 

 

By no longer pretending something is wrong with you. Let go of thoughts which don’t feel good, and you’re on the path, awakening, already. Don’t fear the release of the belief in fear.

• Thank you! what do you mean by the fear as belief? Fear is a real feeling like joy, isn't it? so are you saying that joy is also a belief? or are you saying that the content of the thought associated with the fear is not true? and do you mean that I should let go of the fear, and let it disappear on it's own, or to detatch from the fear and observe it ?

Fear is a word, a label, and is not an emotion one consciously creates, nor is it indicative of who you are, which is precisely why joy feels, like, joy. Joy is much more than even your true nature. Joy is the best of ‘both worlds’, joy is consciously co-creating this life with our source. There’s really nothing you need to do, not work for you to do, on fear, because it’s a belief you can let go of. This will happen quite naturally as you utilize the dreamboard & emotional scale.  There are no levels in nonduality my friend, just this love. Rather than claim it or attribute it to me, know it for and as yourself. 

[Tal]

@Nahm Thank you very much for the long comment, I am already feeling optimistic. I started reading your story but will finish by tommorow. Very interesting and I can very much relate to your transformation but I have a long way ahead of me. Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

[Tal]

By the way Always meditation made me feel bliss, I just have to connect more to feeling and guidance and stick to it with love to myself as I should

[Nahm]

@Tal ?? 

[Loving Radiance]

19 hours ago, Nahm said:

Imagine you’re in college and what you want more than anything is to pass the class you’re in, which happens to have the greatest, wisest, most loving teacher in the history of the universe. But you’re hardcore believing it’s your teaching...even though something about this feels very ‘off’. Imagine that teacher happens to be mute... and so you listen, via feeling. The more you listen, the more you understand & recognize the feeling language. Just like sign language. All happens in silence. Then imagine that teacher turns out to be the truth you were seeking in the first place, and that teacher was within you all along...super practical, perfectly reliable, literally always there for ya, always loving ya...just... you were focused on nonexistent “stuff” that doesn’t feel good to you. You’d been looking the ‘other way’ for a while.

Now I can understand how intelligence, being, goodness and God knows what else is not coming from me. Thanks for clearing that up.

[Nahm]

@Loving Radiance And This. ?

[Tal]

9 hours ago, Nahm said:

And This. ?

@Nahm wow! good video. I am not familiar with the work of Abraham Hicks but seems like you have been influenced by him a lot. I like this approach but I know that from ken wilber's work he says that meditation alone and in Hick's language the practice of feeling good will make your response to a situation where you are neurotic worse. The thing is when you ignore all the bad feelings and focus on the good feelings you certainly change a lot for the positive but sometimes you are becoming very very neurotic and with toxic psychology. At least that's what I have experienced, because I was in this path for a few years, and I reach a very 'good ' feeling consistently and saw beauty all day long and I was like you said "feeling refreshing, clearer, looser, not so ‘practical’, more wavelike, flow, naturally concentrated & energetic, a mellow yet strong vitality of life". But the thing is I was having bigger social anxiety and thus because I was focused on feeling good I stopped almost entirely to interact with people. I was all day with myself, basking in the good feeling and doing my work, which was at that time a degree in computer science and playing the piano. But It all backfired as you can see. I was bullied in school and I was having trauma from childhood and I was really suffering in the social environments and I just found a way out for a couple of years, but I still didn't heal fully. Life is just so complex