The External World Does Exist: Reality is more than Consciousness

[Nivsch]

@Nahm I am 100% sure that the "alone" i think of it is not at all the same as the "alone" Leo think of it.

Because if the consciousness is different - the word has different meaning too.

Thats why its so hard to understand what exactly is being spoken.

But what I sure is that I am not lonely at all.

This is something else I feel i understand to some extent but not fully obviousely.

I will read once again what you wrote as I go back from work.

This issue makes me nervous lol

Edited February 1, 2021 by Nivsch

[abrakamowse]

2 hours ago, Nivsch said:

Because if the consciousness is different - the word has different meaning too.

You are talking rom the POV of egos... every person give different meanings and realities depending on their beliefs. But that is only seen from the POV of an ego, of a person...

 

2 hours ago, Nivsch said:

But what I sure is that I am not lonely at all.

The problem is you don't see that the whole thing is a "bigger" consciousness, and it has to be only ONE.

All these smaller "consciousness" that you talk about appear in this "big consciousness" (call it reality, God, cosmic consciousness, Brahman, That, Allah, etc...)

and you are not that smaller consciousness inside a body, that ego is not you.... you are the big consciousness, you are the whole thing.

And to be everything, you must be only ONE. That's why Leo says you are alone. In reality alone is just another concept, he is just pointing to the fact that there cannot be two "everythings" in the world. Only you...

In Christianity Jesus said "Me and the Father are one" 

I will translate it to you... You and the father are ONE!"

Edited February 1, 2021 by abrakamowse

[vladorion]

Alone is a concept too. If there are no others, then there is no alone.

[abrakamowse]

16 minutes ago, vladorion said:

Alone is a concept too. If there are no others, then there is no alone.

Great point.

[Nahm]

3 hours ago, Nivsch said:

@Nahm I am 100% sure that the "alone" i think of it is not at all the same as the "alone" Leo think of it.

The same, in that they are your thoughts. 

3 hours ago, Nivsch said:

Because if the consciousness is different - the word has different meaning too.

Have you experienced ‘two consciousnesses’?  Consciousness is infinite. Actual. Meaning is the appearance of consciousness, like all other ‘things’. 

3 hours ago, Nivsch said:

Thats why its so hard to understand what exactly is being spoken.

‘You’ & ‘your friend’ are thoughts. We all experience these thoughts. Some believe thoughts, some don’t. 

3 hours ago, Nivsch said:

But what I sure is that I am not lonely at all.

This is something else I feel i understand to some extent but not fully obviousely.

I will read once again what you wrote as I go back from work.

This issue makes me nervous lol

Great to hear you’re not feeling loneliness. That’d be silly. And there’s nothing to be nervous about. ??  If a thought doesn’t feel good, let it go. ? You’ll end up Truth. 

[Nivsch]

3 hours ago, abrakamowse said:

 In reality alone is just another concept, he is just pointing to the fact that there cannot be two "everythings" in the world. 

"I" have now direct experience of an emotion and a thought, and "you" also have one right now.

Even is we are interconnected because we are all one deterministic organism there are still billion of experiences right now.

Edited February 1, 2021 by Nivsch

[Nivsch]

21 hours ago, vladorion said:

Alone is a concept too. If there are no others, then there is no alone.

100% so there is also no a first person to be alone. Nobody is alone.

Full circle. Lets go the circle till its end without cherry pick.

Edited February 2, 2021 by Nivsch

[Nivsch]

2 hours ago, Nahm said:

The same, in that they are your thoughts

yes. the thing I imagine when I think about "aloneness" its probably not the same thing Leo meant.

2 hours ago, Nahm said:

Great to hear you’re not feeling loneliness. That’d be silly. And there’s nothing to be nervous about. ??  If a thought doesn’t feel good, let it go. ? You’ll end up Truth. 

Thank you ?

This topic triggers my anxiety and I am also in withdrawal and healing process please Leo be gentle with me. a hard topic for my sensitive nervous system.

Edited February 1, 2021 by Nivsch

[Nahm]

@Nivsch

I think you got Leo on the brain a little too much brother. Maybe give ‘spirituality’ a break for a while, and find some deep relaxation. Take some regular old great care of yourself! ? Sending all the love & healing vibes I can muster your way. 

[abrakamowse]

4 hours ago, Nivsch said:

"I" have now direct experience of an emotion and a thought, and "you" also have one right now.

Even is we are interconnected because we are all one deterministic organism there are still billion of experiences right now.

Being experienced only by ONE

[Leo Gura]

11 hours ago, The Buddha said:

There is no point about salvia except absolute delusion and non-sense, it's just an insane mind-fuck, that's it

There is definitely a point to salvia.

Nothing will show you how deep consciousness goes like salvia.

The problem is, can you handle it? A human mind cannot handle the full range of what consciousness can do.

[The Buddha]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

There is definitely a point to salvia.

Nothing will show you how deep consciousness goes like salvia.

The problem is, can you handle it? A human mind cannot handle the full range of what consciousness can do.

@Leo Gura For sure there is a point to salvia but not gonna be me who finds out. It's not for the general public, that is what I was saying. Don't think much humans are even able to handle a middle salvia dose, imagine a strong or wild one. Other psychedelics are insane but salvia is one of those that is itself it's category and cannot be compared to anything. Salvia is literally the door to: I don't know shit and wtf is even reality.

I've never tried it but always been so amazed about this substance because honestly, wtf is on with salvia??? Does anyone even truly know what goes on in a high dose salvia trip? Not to mention the wild ones, that is when things get even more interesting...

[Nivsch]

12 hours ago, Nahm said:

Maybe give ‘spirituality’ a break for a while, and find some deep relaxation. Take some regular old great care of yourself! ?

You are right.

12 hours ago, Nahm said:

Sending all the love & healing vibes I can muster your way.

❤❤❤

Edited February 2, 2021 by Nivsch

[Nahm]

@Nivsch

Nature is best, screen is worst. ♥️

[abrakamowse]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

There is definitely a point to salvia.

Nothing will show you how deep consciousness goes like salvia.

The problem is, can you handle it? A human mind cannot handle the full range of what consciousness can do.

I read some stories about Salvia at Erowid and man, those are crazy!!! Lol...

One of them said that he become a garden hose, he was a lake, the spirit of his father... hahaha... crazy!

Here it is if someone is interested

https://erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=38234

[wesyasz]

On 30.01.2021 at 5:16 PM, Adamq8 said:

 

And she acted exactly as I predicted and when I moved she moved and then she became me, I could not tell the difference, it was like she was so real up to that point and then her way of acting changed as GOD woke up.to it self and she said she had been waiting for me to wake up, she is not even into spirituality! This is the most radical mindfuck EVER.

 

I absolutely love this one 

[SourceCodo]

I've done a ton of Salvia. Was my first psychedelic aside from weed and I've experienced the ride of up to 80x concentration. Both hilarious and terrifying... And ego shattering... I'm not sure where to draw the line on that one. Somebody here can relate. 

PTSD inducing and life changing. And...Humbling? Maybe.

Edited February 2, 2021 by SourceCodo

[SourceCodo]

4 hours ago, abrakamowse said:

I read some stories about Salvia at Erowid and man, those are crazy!!! Lol...

One of them said that he become a garden hose, he was a lake, the spirit of his father... hahaha... crazy!

Here it is if someone is interested

https://erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=38234

These are low level experiences too. Usually 10-30x concentrate. My being unified with the river and I watched it fade away. Another time I fell down to the ground and couldn't move. An instant later my body had become the new home for a circus (I could perceive and see it without looking) and there were hundreds of little fellows operating independently within me and on top of me. When the high faded, they faded. 

80x was reality shattering. Ego shattering.

[The Buddha]

9 minutes ago, SourceCodo said:

These are low level experiences too. Usually 10-30x concentrate. My being unified with the river and I watched it fade away. Another time I fell down to the ground and couldn't move. An instant later my body had become the new home for a circus (I could perceive and see it without looking) and there were hundreds of little fellows operating independently within me and on top of me. When the high faded, they faded. 

80x was reality shattering. Ego shattering.

80x??? Brief trip report? that is insane, lol

[SourceCodo]

3 hours ago, The Buddha said:

80x??? Brief trip report? that is insane, lol

Redacted. 

I'd just say that I learned it's important to tread carefully in our life and with the people we interact with. Especially the ideas we entertain and propagate... I live my life more like the video below these days. 

 

Edited February 2, 2021 by SourceCodo