The left exploiting & politicizing storming of the capitol

[Mason Riggle]

13 minutes ago, Animal2692 said:

it's automatically framed as "Trump caused it. His 75 million supporters are for the storming of the capitol as well."

is this a direct quote, or, in this one instance, are you able to understand that you can impart meaning without being explicit?   

[Nanana]

First off, these dems Biden´s leading are no real left AT ALL... They're just not Trump and that's it! that's the only thing they can truly brag about.

With that said, just please don't fall into the trap of sanctifying Biden just because he ain't Trump. Please be vocal about his bullshit just as y'all love being vocal about how much Trump sucks. That's my only wish.

I really get upset about how dick sucking people get with Obama, knowing the bad things he did, but hey, he is polite, I guess... 

No, I'm not pro Trump, he's an idiot, but that has already been thoroughly discussed in this website, I'm just anti bs. I acknowledge Biden being superior in the spiral, but don't let that fool y'all that he's the next messiah or something. Hold everyone accountable!

[Rilles]

7 minutes ago, Nanana said:

First off, these dems Biden´s leading are no real left AT ALL... They're just not Trump and that's it! that's the only thing they can truly brag about.

With that said, just please don't fall into the trap of sanctifying Biden just because he ain't Trump. Please be vocal about his bullshit just as y'all love being vocal about how much Trump sucks. That's my only wish.

I really get upset about how dick sucking people get with Obama, knowing the bad things he did, but hey, he is polite, I guess... 

No, I'm not pro Trump, he's an idiot, but that has already been thoroughly discussed in this website, I'm just anti bs. I acknowledge Biden being superior in the spiral, but don't let that fool y'all that he's the next messiah or something. Hold everyone accountable!

I dont think anyone here is very excited about Bidens presidency, hes more of a placeholder and peacekeeper. I think we all know Bernie is what we really wanted. Its a "Atleast its not Trump" kind of deal. 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Rilles

[Forestluv]

A mob leader is not going to call someone and explicitly say “Ok Jimmy, you used my weapons to rob the First National Bank in Los Angelos, California on September 7th at 2:47 pm. You got away with 2.3M dollars, yet haven’t paid me my 1.5M share. Meet me at Pier 23 tomorrow at 5:00pm with my money or my goons will break your daughter’s legs”.

It just doesn’t work that way. Mob leaders are not that explicit and they don’t overtly orchestrate. They try to add in some plausible deniability. For example, the mob leader may tell Jimmy “I hope you are responsible and pay the money you owe me. . . . And Oh, how’s your daughter doing? She is a freshman at at college, right? Let’s hope she stays safe and nothing bad happens to her”. And if Jimmy doesn’t pay up and his daughter ends up with broken legs, the mob leader has plausible deniability and can say “No, I said I hope she stays safe. I never said I would break her legs”. Only gullible suckers fall for con men like this.

Implicit / explicit is on a spectrum. In Trump’s case, he has been fairly explicit with the Ukraine, GA election officials, Pence and his MAGA / Qanon supporters. 

Leo did a great video on explicit and implicit

 

[Forestluv]

Just now, Rilles said:

I dont think anyone here is very excited about Bidens presidency, hes more of a placeholder and peacekeeper. I think we all know Bernie is what we really wanted. 

We wanted a Ferrari and ended up with a pair of roller skates. Yet better than being in quicksand.

[Rilles]

4 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

We wanted a Ferrari and ended up with a pair of roller skates. Yet better than being in quicksand.

Atleast roller-skates get you somewhere

Even though Biden isnt exactly radical, I think he atleast understands Orange/Green America which is important so he doesnt strip them of rights. 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Rilles

[Consept]

I guess a question for you is, 'without trumps input, how likely would it be that the capitol was stormed?'. 

The implication in your text is that Trump was well within his rights to contend the decision (I dont necessarily disagree), and that he undertook perfectly innocent actions, the fact that the capitol was stormed is because of a few extremists who took trumps words and ran with it. 

Trump had set things up before the election, he stated many times that he was not going to concede if he lost and if he did lose it would be because of some kind of fraud, most likely mail in. This is what you call a priming his supporters, before the election is even confirmed they are already convinced that there will be fraud. His supporters tend to believe whatever he says in a religious manner and I would guess he's aware of this. 

Then after he lost the election he claimed multiple instances of fraud, all of which were completely thrown out, a lot of which by republican judges. On top of that his team sent numerous emails to supporters claiming the election had been stolen and they needed to support by donating money. In the minds of the supporters their reality is that there is fraud and that its a conspiracy to get rid of trump. This is a complete fabrication conducted only by trump and furthered by his team. 

His supporters obviously would be riled up as he puts pressure on any officials that don't want to go along with his story. Then finally he says at a rally that everyone should march to capitol Hill to protest this stolen election. 

Now he may not have thought the rioters wouldve got in, but he's fed them with months of misinformation, outrage, conspiracies, all of which they believed completely. He would've known something would happen, if he didn't that is sever and dangerous levels of incompetence so either way he would be a threat to America.

All of this was further exacerbated by the fact that he took so long to denounce them and when he did he said he 'loved them'. If someone was just incompentant or unaware they would definitely do their best to put out the fire, this was absolutely not done. So you may chose not to call it a coup but at best it's dangerously reckless, incompentant behavior, at worst its planned, manipulative and targeted behavior, either way he's at fault. 

[Animal2692]

I've made my point. It's only one point out of the millions that are out there. Everyone has their own opinion and my point can be heavily argued against and debated which is fine. I'm just saying this as a heads up as it takes a lot of energy to respond to each and every individual here every time. 

Is MAGA a cult? Yeah, it can be seen that way. I can also see "Orange man bad" as a cult too. So many people voted for Biden all because, "Well, it's not Trump." And they think it's valid enough. To each his own. All I can say is that with the banning of Trump, it just opened up a whole new can of worms. Hell, even Merkel from Germany said it was a bad move. There was also an article about Idaho removing Twitter and Facebook from their internet servers. 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Animal2692

[Animal2692]

27 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

A mob leader is not going to call someone and explicitly say “Ok Jimmy, you used my weapons to rob the First National Bank in Los Angelos, California on September 7th at 2:47 pm. You got away with 2.3M dollars, yet haven’t paid me my 1.5M share. Meet me at Pier 23 tomorrow at 5:00pm with my money or I my goons will kidnap your daughter”.

It just doesn’t work that way. Implicit / explicit is on a spectrum. In Trump’s case, he has been fairly explicit with the Ukraine, GA election officials, Pence and his MAGA / Qanon supporters. 

Leo did a great video on explicit and implicit

 

I'll give it a whirl.

[Animal2692]

23 minutes ago, Rilles said:

Atleast roller-skates get you somewhere

Even though Biden isnt exactly radical, I think he atleast understands Orange/Green America which is important so he doesnt strip them of rights. 

My problem with orange and green is that it promotes globalization and central government in a way. 

[Rilles]

Just now, Animal2692 said:

My problem with orange and green is that it promotes globalization and central government in a way. 

Globalization is inevitable. 

Whats wrong with government? Are you a libertarian?

[DocWatts]

Seems like OP doesn't understand thr concept behind Political Dog Whistles.

It's political shorthand for a phrase that may sound innocuous to some people, but which also communicates something more insidious either to a subset of the audience or outside of the audience’s conscious awareness — a covert appeal to some noxious set of views

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/the-big-idea/2016/11/7/13549154/dog-whistles-campaign-racism

Basically political dog whistles are used when someone wants to advocate for things like racism ans violence, while also maintaining plausible deniability.

 

[Animal2692]

11 minutes ago, DocWatts said:

Seems like OP doesn't understand thr concept behind Political Dog Whistles.

It's political shorthand for a phrase that may sound innocuous to some people, but which also communicates something more insidious either to a subset of the audience or outside of the audience’s conscious awareness — a covert appeal to some noxious set of views

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/the-big-idea/2016/11/7/13549154/dog-whistles-campaign-racism

Basically political dog whistles are used when someone wants to advocate for things like racism ans violence, while also maintaining plausible deniability.

 

Political dog whistles is just a concept like anything else. In this situation though with the capitol I think it's propaganda from the left. It's just another avenue for the left to explain what happened to fit their own narrative. Trump called for state of emergency for DC and of course the left will find a way to dismiss that as well to fit their narrative. "Oh he knew he fucked up, he's doing it to save his ass." The orange man bad cult will take that and run with it. Why? Because another reason to hate on Trump. End of the day, 75 million Trump voters going to resist these next 4 years just as the left. What goes around, comes around. 

There was a point where the left and right had similar goals, and only disagreed on the how. But the left has become so radicalized that the right can't relate to it anymore. That is what I see happening. The right still wants pizza and the left wants poison, and no longer pineapple on pizza.

 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Animal2692

[Animal2692]

26 minutes ago, Rilles said:

Globalization is inevitable. 

Whats wrong with government? Are you a libertarian?

Yeah I'm more libertarian than anything. I think not one ideology works by itself and we need a mix of ideologies such as capitalism and socialism. However I'm not fully libertarian, I just want less government than what we got. 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Animal2692

[Rilles]

6 minutes ago, Animal2692 said:

Yeah I'm more libertarian than anything. I think not one ideology works by itself and we need a mix of ideologies such as capitalism and socialism. However I'm not fully libertarian, I just want less government than what we got. 

I see!

Less government in what? In the markets? Less government is kind of a broad statement... 

[Forestluv]

18 minutes ago, DocWatts said:

Seems like OP doesn't understand thr concept behind Political Dog Whistles.

It's political shorthand for a phrase that may sound innocuous to some people, but which also communicates something more insidious either to a subset of the audience or outside of the audience’s conscious awareness — a covert appeal to some noxious set of views

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/the-big-idea/2016/11/7/13549154/dog-whistles-campaign-racism

A good read, with details and nuances. I particularly liked how the author created three distinctions of semantic, contextual, and stereotype-dependent.

9 minutes ago, Animal2692 said:

Political dog whistles is just a concept like anything else.

That mindset will keep a mind unaware of implicit communication and makes the mind vulnerable to subconscious manipulation. This maintains the mind’s contraction within a particular ideology and creates distorted perceptions. You stated your views are “just another opinion”, yet each opinion does not have the same resolution, scale, sophistication and clarity. 

If you are interested in expanding your consciousness, I recommend reading the above article to become more aware of implicit communication. 

[Animal2692]

1 minute ago, Forestluv said:

A good read, with details and nuances. I particularly liked how the author created three distinctions of semantic, contextual, and stereotype-dependent.

That mindset will keep a mind unaware of implicit communication and makes the mind vulnerable to subconscious manipulation. This maintains the mind’s contraction within a particular ideology and creates distorted perceptions. You stated your views are “just another opinion”, yet each opinion does not have the same resolution, scale, sophistication and clarity. 

If you are interested in expanding your consciousness, I recommend reading the above article to become more aware of implicit communication. 

I'm not against concepts. The reason I said earlier about what that guy said as "Just another concept" is because people use concepts as an excuse a lot and get hung up on it without using their common sense and taking context into account. Conceptually it makes sense, but intuitively, that's not how I feel about that particular situation.

[Forestluv]

10 minutes ago, Animal2692 said:

Conceptually it makes sense, but intuitively, that's not how I feel about that particular situation.

That’s how implicit communication often operates. Many receivers are not consciously aware, yet are impacted subconsciously through feelings. It is a key component of implicit communication. 

When Giuliani yells to a mob that the election was stolen from us and when need to take back output country with “trial by combat”, the enraged people in the mob are not rationally thinking “Is Giuliani using the term term ‘combat’ literally or figuratively”. It’s not a communications class with rational thinkers, it’s an angry mob that had been conditioned to be angry over months. When they here that rhetoric it fuels rage a d a “Let’s get those bastards!!!” response.

[Seraphim]

Yes the establishment have been using such tactics for a long time in European countries. It's unfair when the mainstream media hide things because it affects the elections, like the scandals about Biden before the election, if people had been made aware of it maybe Trump would have won. And now with the censorship on social media, the narrative is completely in the hands of the mainstream media. That's obviously not democratic. But I don't think they will get away with it much longer, Poland has already founded a law that prohibits the tech companies from censoring people, I hope other countries will do the same.