Is investing in Crypto just a get rich quick scheme?

[andyjohnsonman]

On 13/01/2021 at 7:33 AM, Leo Gura said:

See, when you take $1000 and turn it into $1,000,000 via BitCoin, you've just figured out how to turn a few teachers, farmers, and retail clerks into your wages slaves. That is literally what you are doing, but you've masked it as something else so you can sleep well at night.

I dont get how it turns teachers, farmers and retail clerks into slaves? Are you saying that by investing you are giving money to large corporations that can enslave "real workers"? You could always invest in a conscious company although they might not be as profitable.

[Guest SirVladimir]

Become filthy good at trading and name yourself Robin Hood. Study how probability distribution works and execute trades based on the data's distribution. Then, fund DMT pet snails development and conspire against the oppressors of psychedelics. Fund a vaccine that injects LSD into the innocent lambs' veins along with the covid antidote. Plan. Build. Laugh like a madman. Awaken the world. Spank them - hot witch girlfriends - along the journey. Descend into madness, and then fade away like a star into the cosmic dust.

 

[Leo Gura]

27 minutes ago, andyjohnsonman said:

I dont get how it turns teachers, farmers and retail clerks into slaves? Are you saying that by investing you are giving money to large corporations that can enslave "real workers"? You could always invest in a conscious company although they might not be as profitable.

No.

Think deeper about what money means.

To hold a $1 million dollars means that you can not work for several years while others serve you.

That is wage slavery. The slavery is baked directly into the dollars. The only reason a million dollars seems like a lot is because it means a dozen people are forced to serve you.

If wage slavery didn't exist your million dollars would not be worth so much.

[JosephKnecht]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Think deeper about what money means.

Think broader of what Bitcoin is.

While you hold $1 million dollars, and the government prints $3 trillion dollars in one year, it makes your $1 million dollars worth less (or worthless). 

Fiat money is an open system, and politicians/bankers can expand the money supply as they wish. 

Bitcoin is a closed system, and no actor in the system can manipulate the supply.

In every game-theoretical system, scarcity wins. 

[Leo Gura]

9 minutes ago, JosephKnecht said:

Think broader of what Bitcoin is.

While you hold $1 million dollars, and the government prints $3 trillion dollars in one year, it makes your $1 million dollars worth less (or worthless).

That is true, inflation happens. But inflation has been held pretty well in check for the last 30 years.

Quote

Fiat money is an open system, and politicians/bankers can expand the money supply as they wish.

But that it part of it's power.

Quote

Bitcoin is a closed system, and no actor in the system can manipulate the supply.

That's true, except you can manipulate the BitCoin supply and market extremely easily, which happens all the time, making BitCoin so volitile it is basically unusable as actual currency. And there are 100s of competing crypto currencies and you have no clue which one will end up on top in the end and which ones will become worthless.

BitCoin's privacy features have virtually evaporated now since all exchanges require ID verification and are monitored by the feds.

One of the most important fratures of a currency is to be stable, which crypto is not.

[Preety_India]

Money is the root cause of evil. 

 

[LfcCharlie4]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You're not going to predict the value of BitCoin because you have no clue what it's true value is.

At least with a company like Google you know it will be around creating new products and services.

 

Yeah, this just isn't true. 

There are plenty of predictions of BTC's long term value based on the value it provides, as I mentioned if it matches the same market cap as Gold, then each coin will be valued at around $500k 

Then if you compare BTC to gold, you can compare ETH to oil. 

Have you ever looked into Blockchain & Cryptocurrency at any length? From how you're speaking here, it seems you haven't. 

'At least with a company like Google you know it will be around creating new products and services.' 

This is like saying precious metals have no value either, when they are stores of Value. 

 

[LfcCharlie4]

@Leo Gura  Bitcoin won't a daily currency, that I agree with. 

Why would anyone ever use BTC for transactions, it's like the famous story of the person who used BTC to buy pizza, and that BTC is worth Millions today. 

@datamonster  Couldn't agree more, All Covid has done is FastTrack the mainstream adoption of Crypto, the Stimulus & things like 'Furlough' over here are going to skyrocket inflation over the next few years. I've even heard plenty of people say it's riskier to not buy Crypto at this stage, it's going to be a ridiculous transfer of wealth, especially now Institutions are getting involved. 

[Character kill]

Investing in sustainable funds works for me now. It’s the future. Can’t wait to see my huge return long after I am gone. 

 

[LfcCharlie4]

8 hours ago, Joel3102 said:

Nah I don’t really see it as thieving, depending on what you’re specifically trading.  One person wants to sell stock in a given moment and one person wants to buy.

Although I wouldn’t recommend day trading however. There’s better things to do. Also most traders probably make less return than just investing in the S&P500. I personally only passively invest in ETFs. It’s the safest option and generally outperforms most people who try to “pick” stocks 

 

Yeah, I agree that should make up a good % of your portfolio. 

Oh, for sure, unless you're going to dedicate your life to trading, it isn't worth it, and even then there's HUGE risks, DCA is the way to go for normies. 

If you're young, I would defo look at putting a % in 'riskier' assets like Small Cap stocks, 'future industry' funds like Biotech & of course Crypto. The book 'How To Own The World' sets great foundations for a long term portfolio & the fund he created off the back of the book is a VERY steady worldwide fund that won't make you big gains, but is unlikely to incur the losses you get if you're 100% exposed to stocks, it's a great baseline for a retirement / long-term portfolio. 

[LfcCharlie4]

@datamonster  You actually think BTC will ever be used as a widespread currency? 

I personally think that role will belong to a different coin & BTC will be the store of value that backs the Blockchain. 

[LfcCharlie4]

@datamonster Yeah I agree with you, I just can't see the majority of HODLers ever wanting to transact in BTC, just like people don't send each other Gold. 

BTC will be the first to go mainstream followed by ETH I imagine just because they are the first 2 everyone talks about, thinks about & are listed on all the major exchanges. 

But, like you said other coins have HUGE potential with the tech & projects they are working on, gonna be a very interesting year like you said.

[tsuki]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You're not going to predict the value of BitCoin because you have no clue what it's true value is.

There is no such thing as "value" that exists outside of social consensus that is quantified in USD on a day-to-day basis by traders.

Something is valuable because your mind decides that it is useful. It is a belief and it's entirely relative. There is no "true" value of anything.

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

That's true, except you can manipulate the BitCoin supply

This is factually wrong. Bitcoin supply is decided by the protocol implemented in client software. To manipulate supply, you would have to force all users to download new software with updated protocol. This would create a hard fork, which would potentially create two versions of bitcoin. Something similar happened in the early days of ETH.

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

and market extremely easily, which happens all the time, making BitCoin so volitile it is basically unusable as actual currency. And there are 100s of competing crypto currencies and you have no clue which one will end up on top in the end and which ones will become worthless.

Bitcoin is volatile because people's beliefs about its usability are unstable. If you think of value of crypto money in terms of fiat money, as in: BTC is worth X USD, then you are wrong. If BTC was widely adopted and you could perform transactions in it as easily as in USD, then USD/BTC rate would be meaningless. 

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

To hold a $1 million dollars means that you can not work for several years while others serve you.

That is wage slavery. The slavery is baked directly into the dollars. The only reason a million dollars seems like a lot is because it means a dozen people are forced to serve you.

This is interesting. I see where you are coming from. So, you are basically saying that the very fact that some people can amass money and live without providing value is wage slavery? This is very interesting, thank you for this thought.

Does the same line of reasoning extend to retirement, for example?

Edited January 14, 2021 by tsuki

[JosephKnecht]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

That is true, inflation happens. But inflation has been held pretty well in check for the last 30 years.

Quote

Inflation happens because politicians/bankers inflate the money supply.

Fiat money has value as long as people trust their politicians/bankers. But unless you are blind, you can see how shaky the current political system is.

A weak political system always leads to weak currency because both are predicated on trust. 

Some examples: 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation_in_the_Weimar_Republic

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation_in_Zimbabwe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation_in_Yugoslavia

Once the economy opens up again, and people are allowed to spend their stimulus money, stock gains, etc, you will see a much higher inflation rate.

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

That's true, except you can manipulate the BitCoin supply and market extremely easily, which happens all the time, making BitCoin so volitile it is basically unusable as actual currency. And there are 100s of competing crypto currencies and you have no clue which one will end up on top in the end and which ones will become worthless.

You can't manipulate the supply of Bitcoin. The supply of bitcoin is predictable 100% and cannot be manipulated. You can only manipulate the price, not the supply.

1 BTC = 1 BTC.

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

One of the most important fratures of a currency is to be stable, which crypto is not.

Another feature is to be a store of value, and Bitcoin fulfills this function much better than any fiat currency. 

[lmfao]

6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

At least with a company like Google you know it will be around creating new products and services.

 

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

And there are 100s of competing crypto currencies and you have no clue which one will end up on top in the end and which ones will become worthless.

Good points tbh.

My guess though is that bitcoin is the most stable out of all the cryptos currencies and will rise in the long term, just because it has the most public clout. 

[integral]

People are buying in this market in the equivalent way of shoveling money into a fire. 

Studying the charts reveals we are in a low consciousness market, where the masses have access to investing for the first time. 

An amazing opportunity to anyone day trading, because this is the easiest market to predict. 

[integral]

@lmfao All the major companies, amazon, Microsoft, google... have blockchain technologies complete and ready to go. That outperform wtv is happening in the decentralized space. 

Cardano hasn't even released yet and its market cap is in the billions... this is all stupid pump chasing investing, also i know the software space, and very few developers are going to use cardano because its purely functional.

This entire space is dumb investing and a golden opportunity. 

Edited January 14, 2021 by integral

[Tim123]

@Leo Gura firstly playing the crypto game isn't just all about gambling and wild speculation, there are ways to invest in this market in a smart and strategic way by evaluating the market cap of a coin, it's volume, the liquidity, how many are using the coin vs holding, how active is the coding updates on github? who is the team behind it and do they have previous experience in crypto? dose the coin actually have an important use? have they made any meaningful partnerships? dose it have any important interoperability features? is the coin scalable? how secure is their blockchain? how advanced is their technology stack comparison to their competitors? who are their competitors? what use cases dose it have? what is their future road map?  by taking all these things into account you can weed out many of the shit coins and make some good investments if you do your research diligently and ignore the hype. But obviously your crypto prophets wont last for ever which is why one should cash them out into more stable assets such as fine art, land, gold / silver, real estate, oil, water, renewable energy etc.  Call it leaching value of wage slaves, I dont really care, I'd rather have all these assets rather than be a wage slave myself since I will have more time to go deeper into myself as God, I dont care about providing value to the world I just want to meditate and sniff 5meo 

Edited January 14, 2021 by Tim123

[vinc3nc]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You're not going to predict the value of BitCoin because you have no clue what it's true value is.

At least with a company like Google you know it will be around creating new products and services.

That's the value.

[ChickenFeathers]

Bitcoin, like gold and silver will likely be a store of value over the long term and not as a currency IMO. This is especially true since it is taxes as property in the US. Exchanging it as currency causes many tax tracking issues if you don't have the right software. Inflation has certainly taken place, particularly in the stock market, precious metals, and crypto. This will likely continue. Inflation is only good for the wealthy and has gone on for years.