Are lies and manipulation sustainable in the long run?

[somegirl]

Let's say hypothetically you live in a system that is entirely based on: corruption, lies, criminal activities and mafia, incompetence and stupidity, lawlessness, devision and hatred between people (us vs them), glorification of one man (the president, for instance), manipulation, self-interest, intimidation, blackmail... Just evilness in its purest form. 

Is it sustainable in the long run? Is it doomed to crack at some point? 

If yes, why do you think so, if no, why not?

 

I mean, it's pretty tough to keep up this system without accidentally slipping somewhere, right? 

 

 

 

 

 

P.S. This place exists, without exaggerating. 

 

[No Self]

Nothing lasts forever. Human systems seem to last for a few years, decades, centuries or millennia. In geologic time, even a million years is not very long.

In a more practical sense, there is a lot of not-nice things in the Catholic Church, and it has sustained for 1,700 years and counting. Yet the most dysfunctional political movements of the 20th century - Maoist China, Stalinism, etc. - all lasted decades at most. 

[Moksha]

In the dream dimension, everything is duality, and balances itself. Chaos and Order are equally necessary, and each ebbs and flows to achieve this balance. One cannot exist without the other.

[aurum]

1 hour ago, somegirl said:

Let's say hypothetically you live in a system that is entirely based on: corruption, lies, criminal activities and mafia, incompetence and stupidity, lawlessness, devision and hatred between people (us vs them), glorification of one man (the president, for instance), manipulation, self-interest, intimidation, blackmail... Just evilness in its purest form. 

Can't imagine where you'd find such a place

1 hour ago, somegirl said:

Is it sustainable in the long run?

Not at all.

Either humanity will evolve its consciousness or it will destroy itself. Those are really the only two options.

But either way, it's not sustainable.

The good news is that there seems to be more awareness of the fact that things aren't sustainable. Which leads me to believe that we are heading for evolving our consciousness and rebuilding these systems.

The worse things get, the more shadows get exposed.

[somegirl]

@aurum Eh, I can. I live in it. ?

Well, I'm glad none of it is sustainable. Question is how long it would take for change to take place.

[somegirl]

@Moksha Is it possible for there to be more chaos than order within one system? 

[Thought Art]

@somegirl Personally, I don't think so. I would imagine that the best and most sustainable systems are built upon truth, systems thinking and ecology. Does the sun and moon lie to the earth? No... It just holds it in place and has done so for billions of years.  I think that evil, lies and manipulation can likely last a relatively long time, however not forever or 'long' when compared to what a society can do with the right foundations of 'Truth' in place. I think that life on the planet wants to evolve its consciousness and in the long run humanity wants order and justice because it wants to survive. (though corruption is also created by low conscious survival needs).

Lies and corruption wear away at the stability of large systems, words lose their meanings, mental health declines... Of course its case by case...

In order for any group of people to successfully get along there needs to be some coherency in their world views. Different situation call for different types of survival strategy.

Also, it might not be obvious to the people are are doing the manipulating and lying that they are even doing so. Take certain religions and secular views that are cognitively dissonant and. Who is to say what is evil and what is good when things end up in a grey area? 

From what you described I would say that that kind of system wouldn't last long. A system with no balance isn't going to be able to last compared to one based on truth.

Edited January 7, 2021 by Thought Art

[zeroISinfinity]

9 hours ago, somegirl said:

Let's say hypothetically you live in a system that is entirely based on: corruption, lies, criminal activities and mafia, incompetence and stupidity, lawlessness, devision and hatred between people (us vs them), glorification of one man (the president, for instance), manipulation, self-interest, intimidation, blackmail... Just evilness in its purest form. 

Is it sustainable in the long run? Is it doomed to crack at some point? 

If yes, why do you think so, if no, why not?

 

I mean, it's pretty tough to keep up this system without accidentally slipping somewhere, right? 

 

 

 

 

 

P.S. This place exists, without exaggerating. 

 

Serbia during 90s.

? Just Serbia you described almost every country. 

Edited January 7, 2021 by zeroISinfinity

[James123]

5 minutes ago, somegirl said:

@Moksha Is it possible for there to be more chaos than order within one system? 

It will last long as long as you think about it. 

[somegirl]

@zeroISinfinity and Serbia today. 

Not much different than before..

[zeroISinfinity]

8 minutes ago, somegirl said:

@zeroISinfinity and Serbia today. 

Not much different than before..

Different dictator same story. 

[somegirl]

@Thought Art Beautifully written. I think so too. Too much energy goes into sustaining a system like this, I would imagine. It HAS to end. Fundations it is based on is not strong, it holds no noble value.

I mean even shortcuts in business (get-rich-quick schemes) is not good for the long run business. 

And, if I'm not mistaken, some of the past civilizations got destroyed and disappeared because of lack of culture and laws in it.  Roman Empire maybe? Not sure, correct me if I'm wrong.

[somegirl]

6 minutes ago, zeroISinfinity said:

Different dictator same story. 

I really wonder if people from this part of the world are just mentally constructed in a way that they do not want to progress like any other civilization... Like, you see people willing to sell their dignity and soul for a little bit of comfort and "power" over and over again. This is a breeding field for dictatorship and opression. 

[zeroISinfinity]

@somegirl I agree + have to say a lot more. But will skip that for now. 

 

Edited January 7, 2021 by zeroISinfinity

[Leo Gura]

In the long run we're all dead. Death = Truth.

See how elegant God's design is?

[zeroISinfinity]

45 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

In the long run we're all dead. Death = Truth.

See how elegant God's design is?

Oh you.... ?

Black thing is always on. ?

Edited January 7, 2021 by zeroISinfinity

[zeroISinfinity]

@Leo Gura I do agree about death /actual enlightenment. 

What everyone else is doing they just mentaly masturbate for the most part. 

Admire your patience. 

[Ibgdrgnxxv]

Truth will be dead. 

[tsuki]

12 hours ago, somegirl said:

Is it sustainable in the long run? Is it doomed to crack at some point? 

A system that is built on falsehood is at best, random, and at worst, parasitic.
In both cases it is doomed to fail eventually, either by chance or devastation.

[zeroISinfinity]

5 minutes ago, Ibgdrgnxxv said:

Truth will be dead. 

Truth can never die. Truth is Love.