Trump Supporters Storming The Capitol! - MAGA Coup Mega-Thread

[DocWatts]

3 minutes ago, Etherial Cat said:

Once Trump is out of office, it will be easier to compel him to appease his base. The Biden administration could "negotiate" with Trump a deal where his collaboration soften to blow to what is to come for him.

But the MAGAs will live poorly the personal losses of power that come from the end of this presidency. They'll go from the "the very special ones" who owned the libs through being the state power in place back to what they perceive as oppression.

I feel sorry for them, though. Even if they are unhinged, idiotic and dangerous people, their suffering is real. And they are exploitated by those who brutalize them in the first place. It's really a pathetic situation. Those are real life zombies.

I could also see a situation developing where the radicalism Trump helped to ferment becomes something he's unable to reign in, even if by some miracle he were so inclined. You saw this exact same dynamic happen with Fox News, who's to say it has to stop with Trump?  That's the problem with demagogues, the radicalization they ferment has a way of spilling out beyond the bounds of what people benefiting from it intended.

I don't see this sort of thing going away until we evolve our Society to the point that it's not creating so many embittered, alienated people, and come to grips with the democratization of media that provides fuel for the spread of dangerous ideologies.

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Etherial Cat said:

Trumpism was a symptom of it, and now the party will need to reorganize itself. But it's going to be hard to do so in a climate where they'll try to distance themselves from the capitol terrorists and the other sore MAGA losers. I think there is no way they'll remain unified when a fringe of the Reps are jumping the ship (elected and civilians).

At this point, any violent acts from MAGA will have amplified bad optics. Especially since Trumper politicians are half-assing it. 

Trump is on the decline, yet Trumpism will be re-branded. Similar to how the "Tea Party" morphed into Trumpism, Trumpism will morph into something new. Hopefully that creature won't be as harmful. 

14 minutes ago, Etherial Cat said:

I feel sorry for them, though. Even if they are unhinged, idiotic and dangerous people, their suffering is real. And they are exploitated by those who brutalize them in the first place. It's really a pathetic situation. Those are real life zombies.

Yes, there suffering is real and they have been given scapegoats for the suffering (immigrants, minorities, socialists, welfare recipients), when most of their suffering can be traced to extreme wealth inequality. 

And their suffering is getting grifted by devilish opportunists - those wanting to exploit them for their own ambition and greed. "Stop the Steal" fundraising has raised 100s of millions of dollars - those struggling to pay their bills are donating their last dollars to those that manufactured lies and fear. They prey on vulnerable people. There are a lot of people terrified that Venezuela stole the election and will turn the U.S. into a horrific communist collapse. 

Ironically, to heal from this we would need to invest into social programs to help those that have been traumatized by Trumpism. As well as their children. There are 10s of millions of children exposed to toxic Trumpism everyday in their homes. That conditioning can't simply be let go of. They are going to carry that into adulthood, yielding repressed anger, fear, unhealthy relationships, maladjustment to life etc. that will need various types of therapy to heal. I hope that therapeutic methods will advance fast enough to treat it. 

[Sempiternity]

27 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

Will the national guard be armed?

"Army Secretary Ryan McCarthy tells The Associated Press that any changes will be determined by the intelligence gathered in the coming days about the evolving threats. But he said they are looking at allowing troops to carry their M-4 rifles or 9 mm Berettas, and he will know more in a day or two."

https://www.king5.com/article/news/local/dc/national-guard-troops-dc-inauguration-day/65-261e7f47-44cc-4387-8778-c1197faf363d

[Forestluv]

The NYT is reporting:

Senator Mitch McConnell is said to believe that the impeachment effort will make it easier to purge President Trump from the party. And Representative Kevin McCarthy has asked other Republicans whether he should call on Mr. Trump to resign in the aftermath of the Capitol siege.

If this is true and McConnell publicly comes out against Trump to purge him from the party, there would be a wave of republican support and I'd predict a senate conviction. Those are still big IFs though. If there is another riot with violence - that would push McConnell. 

I'm also unsure about the technicalities of conviction and disqualification. Conviction requires a 2/3 senate majority and disqualification is a simple majority. There is easily a simple majority to disqualify, yet I read that the votes are sequential. First a president needs to be convicted by 2/3 vote and then they vote whether to disqualify by simple majority. If that is true, disqualification essentially requires a pre-ceding 2/3 majority. 

[Talinn]

It's looking increasingly likely that we could get a Senate conviction on Friday or Monday. Especially as Congressmembers continue to see the federal government's response amplify and ramp up. 

[Forestluv]

10 minutes ago, Talinn said:

Especially as Congressmembers continue to see the federal government's response amplify and ramp up. 

The federal response still seems somewhat tepid to me. It's been six days and finally the FBI gives a press brief. Six days! And they didn't even send FBI leadership. They sent out an assistant director in charge of the Washington field office and an acting U.S. attorney. That seems like a tepid response to me.  

I find the leaked news about McConnell supporting impeachment to be much more influential. That would open floodgates to republican support. Yet it is still unconfirmed and McConnell would need to make a public statement. Yet it's encouraging that McConnell has denied the reports

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, mmKay said:

@Leo Gura what's the very root cause of what's going on with the radicalized people? would you say it's ideology, dense ego, lack of purpose in life and low levels of consciousness?

We are going through a stage Orange >> Green transition. But right-wingers don't understand this transition, they demonize Green and refuse to change their ways. Which necessitates that they create their own toxic alternative-reality bubble. The more they try to deny the validity of Green, the more delusional and ideological their worldview must get. And they must blame someone for all this other than themselves. So of course they project their delusion onto Green.

An entire media industry has been built over the last 5 years for the demonization and scapegoating of Green to cater to the insecurities and paranoia of the right. This industry is extremely profitable so it's not going away any time soon, yet it needs to be discredited and dismantled because it sows paranoia and delusion across tens of millions of people.

[Leo Gura]

21 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

That would open floodgates to republican support.

I don't see that happening. The Republicans are completely spineless and at least half of them have drunk the Kool-Aid. It's clear now that their responses will be as tepid as possible for them to get away with. They will do as little as humanly possible to keep their jobs.

[Forestluv]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

We are going through a stage Orange >> Green transition. But right-wingers don't understand this transition, they demonize Green and refuse to change their ways. Which necessitates that they create their own toxic alternative-reality bubble. The more they try to deny the validating of Green, the more delusional and ideological their worldview must get.

I see a lot of right wingers trying to equivocate violence within Blm protests to violence within MAGA protests. Do you think that average Orange is starting to see the differences between underlying motivation? Even though Blm has pockets of violence, the underlying cause is to overcome systemic racism and move toward equality (Green). In contrast, the underlying motivation of MAGA extremists is to overturn a fair election and move toward authoritarianism (Blue). Given the choice, average Orange seems to be transitioning toward Green.   

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Forestluv said:

Will the national guard be armed?

They better be armed in full combat gear. MAGA will be armed with assault rifles and wearing body armor. 9MM pistols will not be enough. They all need rifles and SWAT teams standing by.

[Leo Gura]

7 minutes ago, Etherial Cat said:

Should we start a heal a MAGA hug a MAGA campaign?

There cannot be healing without their admission of wrongness.

When the German Nazis were defeated, the only way to heal that was for everyone in Germany to recognize and acknowledge that Nazism was wrong and toxic.

[Forestluv]

5 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I don't see that happening. The Republicans are completely spineless and at least half of them have drunk the Kool-Aid. It's clear now that their responses will be as tepid as possible for them to get away with.

That assumes a declining Trump / MAGA still has more influence on republican lawmakers than a declining McConnell (who will have much less power as the minority leader). 

Now that I think about it, I could see McConnell giving tepid support of impeachment and a nod to "vote your conscious" - without having much of an effect - perhaps giving cover for another 3-4 senators to vote to convict, bringing the total to about 8. Getting to 17 may require McConnell to strongly support impeachment and whip his colleagues (unlikely) or more violence in MAGA to erupt (perhaps more likely). 

[Leo Gura]

@Forestluv I think the impeachment will be entirely one-sided. It will be like the last impeachment. Which is still good, but I am not going to sit here and hope for Republicans to kick Trump out of office. Not realistic at all.

[Forestluv]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

@Forestluv I think the impeachment will be entirely one-sides. It will be like the last impeachment. Which is still good, but I am not going to sit here and hope for Republicans to kick Trump out of office. Not realistic at all.

Even with a failed conviction vote, at least Dems tried to hold Trump accountable and it would put republicans on record. 

[Freakyboo]

I've been reading along with this entire thread, and it's the best forum I've seen anywhere for discussing the situation. Leo, I am always 100% on board with your political views and like that you take a balanced approach. Agreed that mantras such as "defund the police" and screaming about the police being racist as a whole does nothing to further the left's agenda and sows further division. 

Also enjoying this forum much more since Q-supporters have been banned. It's too difficult to have an adult conversation about anything when you're spending most of your time trying to explain basic facts to people who don't like facts. 

So thanks ?

[Forestluv]

2 hours ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

I’m going to have to be honest here, I do think it’s highly unlikely that the MAGA people are going to be back to attack for Inauguration Day, very unlikely. I think these people are well aware of the heightened security due to their stunt and the consequences they will face if they try anything.

Keep in mind that half of MAGA sincerely believe that the election was stolen and communists are coming to take over. It is a life or death situation for them. And a considerable number of MAGAs have weapons and have been preparing for years for an armed rebellion against against the evil communists. And some are professionally trained. There are some ex-military and special ops guys that got radicalized into MAGA.

[Girzo]

@Husseinisdoingfine All the normal people won't come, but I wouldn't be so sure about the psychos.

[Abdelghafar]

After a long Politics Abstinence, there's nothing like American Politics to let me re-dive into the political wormhole again. I swear to god, I have no interest in politics, but this is just mind-blowing. 

Edited January 12, 2021 by Abdelghafar
Word Edit.

[abrakamowse]

For @Leo Gura

 

[Shunyata]

https://youtube.com/shorts/R8LdgCyI62o