Why is Brexit bad?

[ADVAIT]

Can anyone please explain to me why is Brexit bad? It is about individuality. If you say Brexit is bad then does that mean we should not go individual and be other's slave and not have own freedom? 

 

I am from India thats why I don't understand why high conscious people are against it. 

Thank you.

[Claymoree]

It seems to be guessing game, at least for people who actually have solid reasons for why they want in, or out, Brexit can be great for UK, staying in EU has potential to turn out to be great choice as well. 

I can't come up with any real reason besides there being more power in group, to back up staying EU, rest are just assumptions of what route things might go. 

Well you could also add that it boosts less developed countries, but I don't see how exactly it is benefit to UK as country.  

 

Biggest reason for going out is as you said few countries, Germany in general controlling EU as they want. 

[ADVAIT]

Life is such a complicated game, isn't it? I mean Brexit is actually harmful because  Britain are being clearly selfish here to not want to pay the taxes to EU or help them in all those deals which were going on for all these years. Because of Brexit, Britain will also not get the perks of being in a big UNION. Now they are on there own. I guess give and take is better than this. You have to be dependent on so many things in this life. Complete autonomy is a myth.

[Blackhawk]

Brexit will make UK poorer.

EU makes the world a better place in all aspects. Without UK EU will be a bit weaker, so the world will become a little bit worse.

UK wont be able to influence EU anymore.

Edited December 30, 2020 by Blackhawk

[Blackhawk]

1 hour ago, ADVAIT said:

Can anyone please explain to me why is Brexit bad? It is about individuality. If you say Brexit is bad then does that mean we should not go individual and be other's slave and not have own freedom? 

It's not true that you lose your freedom if you are in EU.

You are stronger and safer together than alone.

EU gives you safety, for example article 42.7 (mutual defence clause, etc. But Nato is better for that, but still.

 

Edited December 30, 2020 by Blackhawk

[Parththakkar12]

What I'm gathering from this situation is that the EU is wanting to remove the UK. The UK is getting isolated as a country. More separation in the world. That's what I'm gathering from the people who don't like the idea of Brexit.

Edited December 30, 2020 by Parththakkar12

[Rilles]

I heard it could reignite the Troubles. 

[Hulia]

Because it´s against the Zeitgeist. Our world is getting interconnected as it has never been before. This is where the development goes to with all the advantages and disadvantages, whether we want it or not. THe best thing to do is to direct this flow into the right channel and not try to stop it. It won´t work in the same way as you cannot return into the past. The more resistance the more proplems.

[RedLine]

It is bad because globalist cannot impose their agenda frome the UE. That´s why all mainstrain media is against brexit. Because they don't like that people can have sovereignty to decide the policies of their nations.

[snowyowl]

Everything is a balance of union and difference. A single sovereign country is in effect a union of cities and regions, the UK has been a closer union for 300 years than the EU, but there's always ongoing debates about independence vs togetherness. The USA, Russia, China, Spain, everywhere you look there's tension between federal and local government. Each country is also unique culturally, so England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland all have their preferences and agendas which partly overlap with France, Germany, etc. But our UK relationship with the EU has always been fractious, with exemptions and rebates that created a compromise which never quite satisfied anyone completely. Now at least we can have multiple agreements to create a better bespoke relationship rather than feeling bulldozed into a future we never asked for (United States of Europe). 

Another issue is the invisibility of EU politics vs domestic politics. We vote for our Euro MPs, in a very democratic proportional way, only to never hear from them till the following elections (compared with Westminster Government), Perhaps this is more a fault of the media than the politicians, but it does create an impression of decisions being made behind closed doors. 

Edited December 30, 2020 by snowyowl

[Danioover9000]

@Hulia @RedLine

5 hours ago, Hulia said:

Because it´s against the Zeitgeist. Our world is getting interconnected as it has never been before. This is where the development goes to with all the advantages and disadvantages, whether we want it or not. THe best thing to do is to direct this flow into the right channel and not try to stop it. It won´t work in the same way as you cannot return into the past. The more resistance the more proplems.

   Whether we want to or not, it is the will of God that decides the direction of where the future of the world is headed to, aka infinite intelligence.

4 hours ago, RedLine said:

It is bad because globalist cannot impose their agenda frome the UE. That´s why all mainstrain media is against brexit. Because they don't like that people can have sovereignty to decide the policies of their nations.

   This time, division in this part of the world is probably better, for example the UK government can now enforce stricter bounderies on fishing channels, in Brittish waters that the EU trawlers traverse to, take fish closer to the UK and damage our coral reef ecosystems. Why? Because the EU has over fished in their territory, and nearly wiped out their majority of corals.

[Danioover9000]

@ADVAIT

13 hours ago, ADVAIT said:

Can anyone please explain to me why is Brexit bad? It is about individuality. If you say Brexit is bad then does that mean we should not go individual and be other's slave and not have own freedom? 

 

I am from India thats why I don't understand why high conscious people are against it. 

Thank you.

   It's bad only from the EU'S perspective. With enough time and adjustment, both sides will settle down.

[Consept]

I would say its stupid decision, the EU isnt perfect but now the UK dont have say in it, so they cant help steer that ship but they will still be affected by the choices the EU makes. UK has made a lot of money and experienced a lot of growth in the last 40 or so years and this is partly due to the free trade that has been enjoyed as a member of the EU. We will still have trade with this deal but it adds a whole heap of red tape and tariffs that will just make it impossible for a lot of businesses to keep trading with the EU. Youll find it very hard to find an impartial economist who thinks the UK will be better off, at best it will be a slight hit on gdp. So if thats the case then whats the point? 

https://www.oxfordeconomics.com/brexit

When people voted for brexit i guarantee you they had no idea what they were voting for, the main reasons i saw were 'sovereignty' which i guess is being able to set your own laws, and also immigration. The fact is we can set our own laws which we do and we can set a stronger immigration policy like other EU countries, which we dont. Most people can not name a law that we wanted to change and couldnt but now can because we're out of Europe. The UK is heavily reliant on EU migrant workers, especially in the NHS, restricting freedom of movement is going to be heavily damaging for the UK, not just for workers coming in but it limits British residents living and working abroad, which obviously is restriction of freedom, there are about 3 million brits living in Spain atm. 

The people pushing and backing Brexit are rich people who stand to benefit from less EU regulation, it means that they can have a direct line and easier time getting to MPs and prime ministers to make changes to benefit them, rather than the mammoth task of trying to effect change in the EU.  UK already has a problem with this as conservatives favour trickle down economics which basically encourages rich people from around the world to invest money into Britain, however it doesnt help the average person in anyway, Brexit is really the next step of that. 

The average person who voted for Brexit has basically been duped and mainly voted for it on immigration basis, but they will get a shock when things get harder for them and prices go up due to extra tariffs and tax. 

 

[Claymoree]

5 hours ago, Consept said:

I would say its stupid decision, the EU isnt perfect but now the UK dont have say in it, so they cant help steer that ship but they will still be affected by the choices the EU makes. UK has made a lot of money and experienced a lot of growth in the last 40 or so years and this is partly due to the free trade that has been enjoyed as a member of the EU. We will still have trade with this deal but it adds a whole heap of red tape and tariffs that will just make it impossible for a lot of businesses to keep trading with the EU. Youll find it very hard to find an impartial economist who thinks the UK will be better off, at best it will be a slight hit on gdp. So if thats the case then whats the point? 

https://www.oxfordeconomics.com/brexit

When people voted for brexit i guarantee you they had no idea what they were voting for, the main reasons i saw were 'sovereignty' which i guess is being able to set your own laws, and also immigration. The fact is we can set our own laws which we do and we can set a stronger immigration policy like other EU countries, which we dont. Most people can not name a law that we wanted to change and couldnt but now can because we're out of Europe. The UK is heavily reliant on EU migrant workers, especially in the NHS, restricting freedom of movement is going to be heavily damaging for the UK, not just for workers coming in but it limits British residents living and working abroad, which obviously is restriction of freedom, there are about 3 million brits living in Spain atm. 

The people pushing and backing Brexit are rich people who stand to benefit from less EU regulation, it means that they can have a direct line and easier time getting to MPs and prime ministers to make changes to benefit them, rather than the mammoth task of trying to effect change in the EU.  UK already has a problem with this as conservatives favour trickle down economics which basically encourages rich people from around the world to invest money into Britain, however it doesnt help the average person in anyway, Brexit is really the next step of that. 

The average person who voted for Brexit has basically been duped and mainly voted for it on immigration basis, but they will get a shock when things get harder for them and prices go up due to extra tariffs and tax. 

 

You are talking as if everyone who is out of EU are broke, believe it or not , people in UK had way better life before EU, I do not want to go in the list of people who got better part from EU, but it was not your regular citizens and I highly doubt that it is rich people who want out of EU , as they are the ones who have most reasons to stay, maybe some are not happy with strict regulations, but that is only and not that big of a problem for them. 

Edited December 30, 2020 by Claymoree

[Consept]

No i didnt say anyone out of the EU i broke, also keep in mind the countries that youre talking about have trade deals and some are even in the customs union, so they do still benefit from the EU. 

In terms of whether people have been better off in the UK - since joining in 1973 the UK has experienced 103% per capita gdp growth which is more than the USAs 97%. If you compare to the time when England basically ruled the world between 1872 and 1914 the growth was 0.9% per year compared to the EU time of 2.1% per year. Median income is up 79% compared to the USAs 16%, ratio of trade to economic output has gone up from 48% to 67% and 45% of all UK exports go to EU countries. 

Regarding rich people wanting Brexit, obviously its not all rich people, my point is that the campaign was funded by some rich people for financial interests, 5 of the richest businessmen in Britain funded the majority of the leave campaign - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-leave-eu-campaign-arron-banks-jeremy-hosking-five-uk-richest-businessmen-peter-hargreaves-robert-edmiston-crispin-odey-a7699046.html

If you have other statistics or any ideas on what the actual benefits of brexit are im happy to hear

[Claymoree]

7 minutes ago, Consept said:

No i didnt say anyone out of the EU i broke, also keep in mind the countries that youre talking about have trade deals and some are even in the customs union, so they do still benefit from the EU. 

In terms of whether people have been better off in the UK - since joining in 1973 the UK has experienced 103% per capita gdp growth which is more than the USAs 97%. If you compare to the time when England basically ruled the world between 1872 and 1914 the growth was 0.9% per year compared to the EU time of 2.1% per year. Median income is up 79% compared to the USAs 16%, ratio of trade to economic output has gone up from 48% to 67% and 45% of all UK exports go to EU countries. 

Regarding rich people wanting Brexit, obviously its not all rich people, my point is that the campaign was funded by some rich people for financial interests, 5 of the richest businessmen in Britain funded the majority of the leave campaign - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-leave-eu-campaign-arron-banks-jeremy-hosking-five-uk-richest-businessmen-peter-hargreaves-robert-edmiston-crispin-odey-a7699046.html

If you have other statistics or any ideas on what the actual benefits of brexit are im happy to hear

Listen talk with people, ask them, how much they earned before, how much better were benefits, how better was work environment, how easy it was to find work, how cheap it was to get house, how you didn't finish school with debts.

You are bringing out numbers that are good only on surface and probably in whole to elevate other parts of world, but if we are talking about citizens, they have it way worse.

[Danioover9000]

@Consept

7 hours ago, Consept said:

I would say its stupid decision, the EU isnt perfect but now the UK dont have say in it, so they cant help steer that ship but they will still be affected by the choices the EU makes. UK has made a lot of money and experienced a lot of growth in the last 40 or so years and this is partly due to the free trade that has been enjoyed as a member of the EU. We will still have trade with this deal but it adds a whole heap of red tape and tariffs that will just make it impossible for a lot of businesses to keep trading with the EU. Youll find it very hard to find an impartial economist who thinks the UK will be better off, at best it will be a slight hit on gdp. So if thats the case then whats the point? 

https://www.oxfordeconomics.com/brexit

When people voted for brexit i guarantee you they had no idea what they were voting for, the main reasons i saw were 'sovereignty' which i guess is being able to set your own laws, and also immigration. The fact is we can set our own laws which we do and we can set a stronger immigration policy like other EU countries, which we dont. Most people can not name a law that we wanted to change and couldnt but now can because we're out of Europe. The UK is heavily reliant on EU migrant workers, especially in the NHS, restricting freedom of movement is going to be heavily damaging for the UK, not just for workers coming in but it limits British residents living and working abroad, which obviously is restriction of freedom, there are about 3 million brits living in Spain atm. 

The people pushing and backing Brexit are rich people who stand to benefit from less EU regulation, it means that they can have a direct line and easier time getting to MPs and prime ministers to make changes to benefit them, rather than the mammoth task of trying to effect change in the EU.  UK already has a problem with this as conservatives favour trickle down economics which basically encourages rich people from around the world to invest money into Britain, however it doesnt help the average person in anyway, Brexit is really the next step of that. 

The average person who voted for Brexit has basically been duped and mainly voted for it on immigration basis, but they will get a shock when things get harder for them and prices go up due to extra tariffs and tax. 

 

   I'm not sure how the video you provided connects with what your point is. Could you please explain?

[Consept]

33 minutes ago, Claymoree said:

Listen talk with people, ask them, how much they earned before, how much better were benefits, how better was work environment, how easy it was to find work, how cheap it was to get house, how you didn't finish school with debts.

You are bringing out numbers that are good only on surface and probably in whole to elevate other parts of world, but if we are talking about citizens, they have it way worse.

Im from the UK born and bred, in some ways it is worse, some of the things you mentioned like getting a house is definitely harder but that isnt due to being in the EU, im not sure thats your argument, the reason why its harder for younger people is because of things like recessions, austerity, trickle down economics, wages stagnating etc. But this is all due to bad economic policy that favoured the rich. Again if you want to link these things to joining the EU im happy to hear your theory on it. Whats funny is that its mainly older people that voted to leave, these older people have benefited the most from the economy during the EU, theyve managed to own their houses and get full pensions, whereas the young people who mainly voted to stay are the ones that will not benefit from the EU and also will not be able to freely travel. There are even British people who enjoy their retirement in Spain but voted to leave. 

 Again can you point to what will be better after we leave the EU?

 

26 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Consept

   I'm not sure how the video you provided connects with what your point is. Could you please explain?

Nothing just showing the reasoning behind the publics vote, and also i thought it was funny

[Claymoree]

1 hour ago, Consept said:

Im from the UK born and bred, in some ways it is worse, some of the things you mentioned like getting a house is definitely harder but that isnt due to being in the EU, im not sure thats your argument, the reason why its harder for younger people is because of things like recessions, austerity, trickle down economics, wages stagnating etc. But this is all due to bad economic policy that favoured the rich. Again if you want to link these things to joining the EU im happy to hear your theory on it. Whats funny is that its mainly older people that voted to leave, these older people have benefited the most from the economy during the EU, theyve managed to own their houses and get full pensions, whereas the young people who mainly voted to stay are the ones that will not benefit from the EU and also will not be able to freely travel. There are even British people who enjoy their retirement in Spain but voted to leave. 

 Again can you point to what will be better after we leave the EU?

 

Nothing just showing the reasoning behind the publics vote, and also i thought it was funny

I am one of the people have benefited the most from EU too, as I am not UK citizen and came here thanks to EU, I didn't vote, but if I would vote , I would vote exit, as I  think that this country has to recover, I just feel that it is right direction,

I can't point to what will be better, as it could go either way, from point of trade it seems UK will be fine based on article I read like week ago, they have already made huge amount of trade deals with possibility of improving them, also EU is not closed, or non-option to improve trade agreements with.

Also do not see problem with traveling besides current situation with Covid, or that opportunity for qualified people moving within EU disappearing. 

What I hope for is that housing and wage will be able to catch up with restrictions on immigration, wages are very hard to predict, as it depends on how industries will be able to cope, grow and if they don't decide to move, if that happens then we will have bad few years

Overall will have to be more competitive and innovative, find niches where this country excels, if it does then it will be great and make it better for everyone in UK.

 

 

[Willie]

Brexit is a separation, which is the opposite of unification. Whether or not either of those ideas is good or bad depends on one’s perspective.