The danger of Mysticism is it makes too much sense.

[Endangered-EGO]

The story of everything being a story. The paradox of existence. Everything has a base in consciousness. The certainty of uncertainty. Knowing to not know.

There is no way out of that is there? Confirmation bias and self deception. I noticed that everything can be viewed and argued differently. 

The bases assumptions of what we are doing is truth "from inside". But we are not really looking for truth, we are just in a way constantly proving to ourselves that we are wrong until we are certain that we are uncertain.

Always finding traps with introspection, and inquiry might be the biggest trap. The core assumption is Consciousness. But for consciousness, truth is not something tangible.

I noticed that everyone is so deep within what they are doing, that they just confirm what they want to believe from inside their believe system. "There are no mistakes in the bible, so we will try to 'correctly translate it', because the mistake cannot be from the prophet it has to be in the translation."

So I (and everybody else) looks down at people and think "oh look how stupid and full of shit they are"

But aren't we doing the same thing, in a meta-way? certain of uncertainty and the story of everything being a story. The deception of self deception.

It kind of has positive aspects to it, because I believe I can put myself in "consciously lower" (See how I look down on them, like they do) people's perspectives.

What we are doing is practical in one sense, and impractical in an other. There is no such thing as "truth". It is just a word. We are basically just "doing something" and "things happen".
I'm both curious and practical. Sometimes reality is that story I was told(/tell myself) and sometimes it isn't. And I am going to stay practical with that.

I (again) just wanted to share my thoughts, no questions. I just enjoy hearing your thoughts on that.

[Gesundheit]

That's the ego-mind, not mysticism. Too much theory, very little practice.

What you mean by mysticism here is the refined version of it after years of reading, learning, and contemplation. What it actually is like is total insanity, and the opposite of making sense. It's only after the ego-mind hijacks the process that you become grounded in reality.

[seeking_brilliance]

5 hours ago, Endangered-EGO said:

I noticed that everyone is so deep within what they are doing, that they just confirm what they want to believe from inside their believe system.

I identify with this

5 hours ago, Endangered-EGO said:

So I (and everybody else) looks down at people and think "oh look how stupid and full of shit they are"

But not this, I actually enjoy the banter. It's refreshing. I am guilty of ignoring the things I don't resonate with, but that's more universally typical. I think what's important is to either shut out all the noise and focus, or invite it in for growth, then shut it out. Even growth is ultimately a story, no? 

I don't think either way is necessarily wrong. Some roads to Rome are longer, but with some interesting scenery as well.

 

In my opinion, there's way too much distaste for 'wrongness' around here, instead of replies which redirect with an exercise of introspection. Too much explaining around here, no one needs to hear all the best details. They should be guided towards inquiry, IMO

Edited December 14, 2020 by seeking_brilliance

[SourceCodo]

What if it's just like this?

[How to be wise]

@Endangered-EGO What was the point of this thread? How did it help you?

You're only wasting time.

[Haumea2018]

Of course mysticism <> postmodernism.  The story of everything being a story IS a story, a metanarrative itself.  At the highest level of awakening is Only Don't Know state, the daisy fresh Buddha mind that draws no metaphysical conclusions.  That's what many people here don't get -- if you've come up with a Story Of It All and believe it to be real, then you're not really present to what is -- you're filtering reality through the prism of that story.

Edited December 14, 2020 by Haumea2018

[Moksha]

If to enjoy even an enjoyable present we must have the assurance of a happy future, we are “crying for the moon.” We have no such assurance. The best predictions are still matters of probability rather than certainty, and to the best of our knowledge every one of us is going to suffer and die. If, then, we cannot live happily without an assured future, we are certainly not adapted to living in a finite world where, despite the best plans, accidents will happen, and where death comes at the end.

Seeking security in insecurity is insanity.

[Emerald]

I think a big part of this is to recognize that the end game is not to gain absolute insight into the things. Truth does not equal insight.

The mind cannot conceptualize of Truth. It can only receive insights that lead it either closer or further away from the Truth.

Terrence McKenna has a great quote that goes something like, (paraphrased) 'Don't expect the brain of a primate to be able to understand the full depth and complexity of infinite reality.'

Insight is a practical tool that the mind can use... not an end game. 

And when we realize that all our collection of insights and knowledge are things we can never know for sure and we have no attachment to any of it being true, we can get into a space where we can experience the reality without the mind coming in trying to "know" everything.

And we can also use the tools of our insight much more effectively because we're holding onto them much more loosely. 

The point of the contemplation is to get into that space of consistently realizing that we know nothing... because emptiness of knowledge is where we can experience what's true beyond the attempts of the left side of the brain to analyze and deconstruct things into abstract "bite-sized" meaning. 

When we can bypass that meaning-making function of the mind and experience the reality separate from our insights about it, we can experience Truth. But we can NEVER understand or know Truth. We can only experience.

The mind is a bit like a computer program that can only read a certain kind of document. Like Microsoft Word can only read Microsoft Word documents. And files that are in a different format cannot be opened and integrated with that program. 

So, the infinite complexity of reality cannot be accurately compressed into a Microsoft Word document in the same way that the infinite complexity of reality cannot be accurately known/understood/conceptualized of by the human mind. 

And once the conceptual mind really realizes this, it may surrender and withdraw its meaning-making functions enough to catch a glimpse of the reality.

[Someone here]

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

I think a big part of this is to recognize that the end game is not to gain absolute insight into the things. Truth does not equal insight.

The mind cannot conceptualize of Truth. It can only receive insights that lead it either closer or further away from the Truth.

Terrence McKenna has a great quote that goes something like, (paraphrased) 'Don't expect the brain of a primate to be able to understand the full depth and complexity of infinite reality.'

Insight is a practical tool that the mind can use... not an end game. 

And when we realize that all our collection of insights and knowledge are things we can never know for sure and we have no attachment to any of it being true, we can get into a space where we can experience the reality without the mind coming in trying to "know" everything.

And we can also use the tools of our insight much more effectively because we're holding onto them much more loosely. 

The point of the contemplation is to get into that space of consistently realizing that we know nothing... because emptiness of knowledge is where we can experience what's true beyond the attempts of the left side of the brain to analyze and deconstruct things into abstract "bite-sized" meaning. 

When we can bypass that meaning-making function of the mind and experience the reality separate from our insights about it, we can experience Truth. But we can NEVER understand or know Truth. We can only experience.

The mind is a bit like a computer program that can only read a certain kind of document. Like Microsoft Word can only read Microsoft Word documents. And files that are in a different format cannot be opened and integrated with that program. 

So, the infinite complexity of reality cannot be accurately compressed into a Microsoft Word document in the same way that the infinite complexity of reality cannot be accurately known/understood/conceptualized of by the human mind. 

And once the conceptual mind really realizes this, it may surrender and withdraw its meaning-making functions enough to catch a glimpse of the reality.

Wow! ?

[Nahm]

On 12/14/2020 at 0:24 PM, Endangered-EGO said:

There is no way out of that is there?

The finite mind can not dispel the illusion of itself via it’s own activity. Brought to rest, again & again & again & again, it ceases in the awe & illumination of it’s source. 

Meditation. 

Letting go. 

Only truth remains, and not even. 

[Scholar]

There is not one way to think about reality, because reality is not one thing. You created a Story, notice this. All that you told us was a story. What is the nature of this story? It is complete, it is real, it is Truth. But even falsehood is Truth. Because all things are Circle and Circle is Truth.

 

Mystery means Circle. Mystery is the means by which reality is created, upheld and dissolved. Really, Creation does not exist. Creation is an illusiory effect of the Circle. There is no cause and effect.

 

What is the Circle? If every point on the circle created the adjacent point, what would this mean? It would mean that the first point was created by the last point, but the first point is the one who created the point that lead to the point that lead to the point (...) that created the last point that created the first point. This is impossible, yet this is what Mystery is. It is precisely what Reality is. This is how anything can manifest into existence. Including any possible framework for understanding reality. You could understand reality in Infinite ways.

Reality is self-justification.

 

But even this is just a story, and yet it is not a story. This is what Groundlessness means. Groundlessness is all Grounds.

 

You live in a fairy tale. Ask yourself, what would be left of this fairy tale if you would let go of the story? If you let go of this fairy tale, what awaits are all other fairy tales. You can abandon and create new fairy tales forever. You little fairy-tale creation machine!

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mF1TvW4KDtA

 

 

Edited December 15, 2020 by Scholar