can we connect with dmt entities without psychedelic ?

[Raven1998]

can we connect with dmt aliens without any psychedelic substance, and using only meditation.. ? in this country, psychedelics, and substance like that are so rare, and so hard to acces? do anyone know a practice or a meditation for tap in to mystical experience ? see some psychedelic like visualization and effects? see entities? 

[GreenWoods]

Yes for sure:

 

• Do a dark room retreat for 2-6 weeks (results in natural DMT) release + hard core DMT breathing practices (see on youtube). A few weeks ago I did a very intense version of shamanic breathing for around 40 minutes. I also was on day 3 of a dark room retreat. I saw faint but very noticiable DMT imagery and and a very bright light appeared, which I believe could have turned into the tunnel if I breathed for longer. On the breathhold, my consciousness altered so much that I was sure the universe would have collapsed and I would have been in that void without body or anything (only temporary, definitely not mahasamadhi), or at least had an very intense OBE, if I had breathed for longer. (The DMT imagery and the white light was thanks to the dark room retreat, but the altered state of consciousness was purely due to the breathing, I believe.) You can also do fasting during a dark room retreat (also produces DMT) to really supercharge it.

 

• Or get good at having OBEs and try to visist them from there. Taking NN, DMT results in an OBE. These OBEs are usually different from normal OBEs because of the DMT.  You would have to be a very experienced OBE traveler for that though, otherwise it is likely that you just see imaginad rather than the 'real' dmt entities. Though it really makes no difference either way. To have OBEs, read that post .

 

• If you have good intuition, you can just try to communicate with them telepathically. But this is very subtle and has a high likelihood of bsing yourself

 

 

 

 

[GreenWoods]

1 hour ago, Raven1998 said:

.. ? in this country, psychedelics, and substance like that are so rare, and so hard to acces? 

If you do enough research you will probably find psychedelic plants which naturally grow in your country and thus are legal.

[Proserpina]

Become sensitive to very subtle changes in state.  Use anything that even slightly induces a psychedelic like state frequently. Be open-minded as to how they 'come through' and be willing to deal with the consequences (possible madness).

[Raven1998]

1 hour ago, Proserpina said:

Become sensitive to very subtle changes in state.  Use anything that even slightly induces a psychedelic like state frequently. Be open-minded as to how they 'come through' and be willing to deal with the consequences (possible madness).

can you explain it little more?

[Forestluv]

If it were me, I’d loosen up on the visuals needed for a mystical experience. Ime, visuals can be distracting - like some entity materializing. Usually, I have no p visuals or ver subtle - like things are perceived through a new lens - yet not toasters turning into machine elves kinda thing. 

Expectations can be good for motivation and progress toward a goal, yet they can also be very limiting. For example, before I did my first sensory deprivation tank, I read about other people’s mystic experiences and I realized I was developing beliefs what it “should be like”. I needed to let this go, to open up greater space and potential.

I’ve been interested in exploring mystical experiences my whole life, it’s part of my personality.

The biggest block for me is mindest in several ways:

1) The conditioned way of perceiving / thinking that is “normal” and the belief I need to go somewhere mystical. When my mind is conditionally thinking in patterns, seeing things familiar as normal / boring and thinking about stuff I should do, it’s very unlikely I can enter an altered state of consciousness. For example, my living room is highly familiar to me and very difficult to relate differently with. One nice thing about psychedelics is that it scrambles everything up. It’s like I’ve never been in this room before, yet I have. It’s a totally different relationship. For example, I may ‘feel’ the essence of inanimate objects in the room. 

2) Beliefs that a mystical experience need to be a certain way and have lots of bells and whistles. This is common when people read about other’s mystic experience reports (which are often sensationalized in an effort to capture the extra ordinary nature). Mystical experiences often begin subtle and if the mind challenges it, the opportunity vanishes. For example, last night I took my first dark hike in nature. It was a drizzly, misty night with moonglow. I had been to this nature center 100+ times, yet it just felt and looked different. The first thing my mind wanted to do was to get grounded and make sense of things be using internal maps and placing myself in time and space “Oh, I know where I am. The bridge is coming up, and the turtle trail will be on the left. Yet I should probably stay on the main trail because the side trails may be too wet”. This is a very rational and grounded way to perceive. Yet awareness “caught” it. This is a skill developed in traditional meditation. There was realization of the thoughts and mind construction and it was let go. Then, space for unknown, uncertainty and creativity arose. I didn’t know who, what, where I was. The fog rolling over the river was like a scene out of a movie. There was an eerie silence. It’s was peaceful yet also eerie. All the animals were hidden. I was the only animal and I started sensing spirits. . . Traditionally, my mind would take over narrative control and think “C’mon dude, you are just making this shit up. You are in the local nature center getting wet. You’re probably gonna get a cold, then you will need to get tested for covid. It’s best we turn around now”. This is a rational mind taking control and people who yearn for mystical experiences generally have a rationally conditioned mind. People that have more fluid minds, can let go and enter creative imaginary spaces. They might not even call the “mystical experiences”

3) As written above, a big part of entering altered states is relaxing the conditioned mind and imagining, without labeling as imagining and returning to rationality. Kids have this ability, yet the vast majority of adults lose it. It’s an ability to enter a pseudo lucid state in which it doesn’t matter if it’s “real” or “imaginary”. The nice thing about psychedelics, is that they de-active this part of the mind. Edible cannabis is super helpful. Ime, it’s much harder do without substances. Some people, like myself, aren’t naturally good at this. For many years of meditation, I wanted mystic experiences, yet they never came. I got some insights and relation, yet no what I would consider mystical. Yet after the mind enters many altered states it becomes easier.

If I were to write a guide on i inducing mystical experiences, I would first relax what it’s supposed to be like. As well, they can be subtle and just glimpses. I would learn to enjoy the subtle glimpses, get curious and set an intention to return. For example, while doing yoga, there may be 10 seconds of effortless flow and a unique form of energy, Rather, than think “that wasn’t real. Or that’s not what kundalini energy is supposed to be like”, think “whoa, that was cool. Like a peek into another realm”. Know that you can have a mild state of mysticism simply sitting wherever you are.

I’ve also found getting into lucid dreaming helps - especially the interface between real and dreaming (half awake / half asleep). In mediation, there is so much emphasis placed on focused attention on an object and awareness being “Here and Now”. I would say a “monkey mind” that jumps all over the place is problematic. Yet a “wandering” mind can be an asset in some contexts. A monkey-mind would be like “I forgot to pay my bill. Crap I’m screwed. That dog barking is distracting. It’s too hot in here. My leg hurts. How much more time until I’m done? What should I eat for lunch?”. That type of scattered mind is not a good mindset to set the stage for a mystical experience. The mind can re-condition itself with lots of mindful practice, or use a substance. Psychedelics can temporarily deactivate that monkey mind, yet it will return after the trip. Yet I’ve found psychedelics is a good tool to deco diction monkey mind. Yet ime, that monkey mindset has got to to enter mystical states. Other methods can be shamanic breathing, edible cannabis - this can overpower the monkey mind. 

Rational thinking, analysis and making sense of everything is also a deterrent. As is chronic worrying and planning. This can be reduced with meditation practice. Drastically changing one’s environment can be useful if the mind is in a grey zone of being able to relax. For example, taking a week long retreat in the woods can a good environment for a mind that is “close”. Without distractions, social media, work . . the mind can slowly let go of societal rules, one’s character etc. Yet if a mind is strongly grounded in rational analysis it will spend half the time trying to figure things out, then probably beat itself up for wasting this opportunity trying to figure stuff out. Yet a mind in the grey zone may relax into a pseudo dreamscape and start noticing new things about nature, itself and relationship to reality - opening up a mystical experience.

For me, ‘mind wandering’ is beneficial and context-dependent. Mind wandering is distinct from the chaotic monkey mind that jumps all over the place. Mind wandering meanders along a common theme. In meditation, it is getting lost in “thinking”. This is considered “bad” by meditation practitioners, yet I think this labeling is cuts one off from an important skill development. If the goal is to focus on the breath and/or be present Here and Now, then mind wandering is distractive. Unfortunately, the mind sees this as “bad” and may get frustrated in getting lost in thought. Yet I’ve learned that mind wandering can be a form of meditation helpful to entering different mind states. I’m not ta liking about mind wandering about an upcoming exam, needing to see the dentist, what some guy on Twitter said etc. I’m referring more to “day dreaming”, a mind space where it isn’t just thoughts - there are images and emotions. For example, the mind may remember a trip with a friend and wonder about traveling to Africa with the friend. The mind enters tribes, dances, new foods. At deeper levels there may be feelings, tastes of foods - yet there is t the detached witness of ‘“I’m sitting in on a meditation cushion imagining this”. If that realization occurs, it is good in the context that your mind wandered and you lost awareness that you should be meditating Here and Now. Yet it is also “bad”, because it pulls the mind out of immersion in a creative dreamscape. That type of wandering mind is a creative skill, imo. The trick is being able to roll with it without analysis and judgement that ruins it.
 

 

[Raven1998]

1 hour ago, GreenWoods said:

Yes for sure:

 

• Do a dark room retreat for 2-6 weeks (results in natural DMT) release + hard core DMT breathing practices (see on youtube). A few weeks ago I did a very intense version of shamanic breathing for around 40 minutes. I also was on day 3 of a dark room retreat. I saw faint but very noticiable DMT imagery and and a very bright light appeared, which I believe could have turned into the tunnel if I breathed for longer. On the breathhold, my consciousness altered so much that I was sure the universe would have collapsed and I would have been in that void without body or anything (only temporary, definitely not mahasamadhi), or at least had an very intense OBE, if I had breathed for longer. (The DMT imagery and the white light was thanks to the dark room retreat, but the altered state of consciousness was purely due to the breathing, I believe.) You can also do fasting during a dark room retreat (also produces DMT) to really supercharge it.

 

• Or get good at having OBEs and try to visist them from there. Taking NN, DMT results in an OBE. These OBEs are usually different from normal OBEs because of the DMT.  You would have to be a very experienced OBE traveler for that though, otherwise it is likely that you just see imaginad rather than the 'real' dmt entities. Though it really makes no difference either way. To have OBEs, read that post .

 

• If you have good intuition, you can just try to communicate with them telepathically. But this is very subtle and has a high likelihood of bsing yourself

 

 

 

 

thank you

[fridjonk]

@Forestluv Really resonate with you. Thanks for taking the time for these grand posts of yours. 

[Raven1998]

46 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

If it were me, I’d loosen up on the visuals needed for a mystical experience. Ime, visuals can be distracting - like some entity materializing. Usually, I have no p visuals or ver subtle - like things are perceived through a new lens - yet not toasters turning into machine elves kinda thing. 

Expectations can be good for motivation and progress toward a goal, yet they can also be very limiting. For example, before I did my first sensory deprivation tank, I read about other people’s mystic experiences and I realized I was developing beliefs what it “should be like”. I needed to let this go, to open up greater space and potential.

I’ve been interested in exploring mystical experiences my whole life, it’s part of my personality.

The biggest block for me is mindest in several ways:

1) The conditioned way of perceiving / thinking that is “normal” and the belief I need to go somewhere mystical. When my mind is conditionally thinking in patterns, seeing things familiar as normal / boring and thinking about stuff I should do, it’s very unlikely I can enter an altered state of consciousness. For example, my living room is highly familiar to me and very difficult to relate differently with. One nice thing about psychedelics is that it scrambles everything up. It’s like I’ve never been in this room before, yet I have. It’s a totally different relationship. For example, I may ‘feel’ the essence of inanimate objects in the room. 

2) Beliefs that a mystical experience need to be a certain way and have lots of bells and whistles. This is common when people read about other’s mystic experience reports (which are often sensationalized in an effort to capture the extra ordinary nature). Mystical experiences often begin subtle and if the mind challenges it, the opportunity vanishes. For example, last night I took my first dark hike in nature. It was a drizzly, misty night with moonglow. I had been to this nature center 100+ times, yet it just felt and looked different. The first thing my mind wanted to do was to get grounded and make sense of things be using internal maps and placing myself in time and space “Oh, I know where I am. The bridge is coming up, and the turtle trail will be on the left. Yet I should probably stay on the main trail because the side trails may be too wet”. This is a very rational and grounded way to perceive. Yet awareness “caught” it. This is a skill developed in traditional meditation. There was realization of the thoughts and mind construction and it was let go. Then, space for unknown, uncertainty and creativity arose. I didn’t know who, what, where I was. The fog rolling over the river was like a scene out of a movie. There was an eerie silence. It’s was peaceful yet also eerie. All the animals were hidden. I was the only animal and I started sensing spirits. . . Traditionally, my mind would take over narrative control and think “C’mon dude, you are just making this shit up. You are in the local nature center getting wet. You’re probably gonna get a cold, then you will need to get tested for covid. It’s best we turn around now”. This is a rational mind taking control and people who yearn for mystical experiences generally have a rationally conditioned mind. People that have more fluid minds, can let go and enter creative imaginary spaces. They might not even call the “mystical experiences”

3) As written above, a big part of entering altered states is relaxing the conditioned mind and imagining, without labeling as imagining and returning to rationality. Kids have this ability, yet the vast majority of adults lose it. It’s an ability to enter a pseudo lucid state in which it doesn’t matter if it’s “real” or “imaginary”. The nice thing about psychedelics, is that they de-active this part of the mind. Edible cannabis is super helpful. Ime, it’s much harder do without substances. Some people, like myself, aren’t naturally good at this. For many years of meditation, I wanted mystic experiences, yet they never came. I got some insights and relation, yet no what I would consider mystical. Yet after the mind enters many altered states it becomes easier.

If I were to write a guide on i inducing mystical experiences, I would first relax what it’s supposed to be like. As well, they can be subtle and just glimpses. I would learn to enjoy the subtle glimpses, get curious and set an intention to return. For example, while doing yoga, there may be 10 seconds of effortless flow and a unique form of energy, Rather, than think “that wasn’t real. Or that’s not what kundalini energy is supposed to be like”, think “whoa, that was cool. Like a peek into another realm”. Know that you can have a mild state of mysticism simply sitting wherever you are.

I’ve also found getting into lucid dreaming helps - especially the interface between real and dreaming (half awake / half asleep). In mediation, there is so much emphasis placed on focused attention on an object and awareness being “Here and Now”. I would say a “monkey mind” that jumps all over the place is problematic. Yet a “wandering” mind can be an asset in some contexts. A monkey-mind would be like “I forgot to pay my bill. Crap I’m screwed. That dog barking is distracting. It’s too hot in here. My leg hurts. How much more time until I’m done? What should I eat for lunch?”. That type of scattered mind is not a good mindset to set the stage for a mystical experience. The mind can re-condition itself with lots of mindful practice, or use a substance. Psychedelics can temporarily deactivate that monkey mind, yet it will return after the trip. Yet I’ve found psychedelics is a good tool to deco diction monkey mind. Yet ime, that monkey mindset has got to to enter mystical states. Other methods can be shamanic breathing, edible cannabis - this can overpower the monkey mind. 

Rational thinking, analysis and making sense of everything is also a deterrent. As is chronic worrying and planning. This can be reduced with meditation practice. Drastically changing one’s environment can be useful if the mind is in a grey zone of being able to relax. For example, taking a week long retreat in the woods can a good environment for a mind that is “close”. Without distractions, social media, work . . the mind can slowly let go of societal rules, one’s character etc. Yet if a mind is strongly grounded in rational analysis it will spend half the time trying to figure things out, then probably beat itself up for wasting this opportunity trying to figure stuff out. Yet a mind in the grey zone may relax into a pseudo dreamscape and start noticing new things about nature, itself and relationship to reality - opening up a mystical experience.

For me, ‘mind wandering’ is beneficial and context-dependent. Mind wandering is distinct from the chaotic monkey mind that jumps all over the place. Mind wandering meanders along a common theme. In meditation, it is getting lost in “thinking”. This is considered “bad” by meditation practitioners, yet I think this labeling is cuts one off from an important skill development. If the goal is to focus on the breath and/or be present Here and Now, then mind wandering is distractive. Unfortunately, the mind sees this as “bad” and may get frustrated in getting lost in thought. Yet I’ve learned that mind wandering can be a form of meditation helpful to entering different mind states. I’m not ta liking about mind wandering about an upcoming exam, needing to see the dentist, what some guy on Twitter said etc. I’m referring more to “day dreaming”, a mind space where it isn’t just thoughts - there are images and emotions. For example, the mind may remember a trip with a friend and wonder about traveling to Africa with the friend. The mind enters tribes, dances, new foods. At deeper levels there may be feelings, tastes of foods - yet there is t the detached witness of ‘“I’m sitting in on a meditation cushion imagining this”. If that realization occurs, it is good in the context that your mind wandered and you lost awareness that you should be meditating Here and Now. Yet it is also “bad”, because it pulls the mind out of immersion in a creative dreamscape. That type of wandering mind is a creative skill, imo. The trick is being able to roll with it without analysis and judgement that ruins it.
 

 

thank you

[herghly]

10 hours ago, GreenWoods said:

If you do enough research you will probably find psychedelic plants which naturally grow in your country and thus are legal.

Be careful, just because something grows naturally does NOT make it legal

[GreenWoods]

24 minutes ago, herghly said:

Be careful, just because something grows naturally does NOT make it legal

Oh. yes, you are right. I didn't give that post much thought.

I assume it might work something like this:

• If you go into the forest and gather some mushrooms and the police sees you, then this is probably 0 problem
• if you take them home, eat too much of them and end up calling the ambulance, you are in trouble
• And growing them at your home might also be not legal

Probably always depends on the country.

[Raven1998]

On 14/12/2020 at 7:44 AM, GreenWoods said:

Oh. yes, you are right. I didn't give that post much thought.

I assume it might work something like this:

• If you go into the forest and gather some mushrooms and the police sees you, then this is probably 0 problem
• if you take them home, eat too much of them and end up calling the ambulance, you are in trouble
• And growing them at your home might also be not legal

Probably always depends on the country.

thank you

[gettoefl]

On 13/12/2020 at 5:17 PM, Forestluv said:

 

so helpful thanks