How to break through the illusion of being a thought, once and for all?

[Javfly33]

 

17 hours ago, James123 said:

Key is Completely surrendering the self for any consequence.  Because when you completely surrender so called mind will have no place to hold on. Than you start to see illusion more easily and deeply. At that moment process of thoughts, which comes from egoistic self will be a joke.

@James123 Got it!

Quote

Additionally, when you realize that your birth comes from knowing, if you never learn, you will be never born, and when you not know you are right before birth. There will be no so called mind left. 

I´m beggining to "understand" what you mean with that. Nice  

14 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@Javfly33  30 day solo meditation retreat. Meditation non-stop 24/7 until something breaks.

You will never awaken deeply through 1-hour daily practice. It's never going to be enough.

You must stake your entire life on it if you want it. This is how all the masters did it and why none of their students succeed. It takes seriousness, and you are not serious.

I´ve done so far a retreat or 6 days. And I wasn´t even meditating for 3 days. Next one I will be able to do a 7 days with way more intensity.

I am serious, but at the same time you also say that you must work through the survival basic things before going full throttle with enlightement. So my focus is not 100% on enlightment right now. But that is a strategic move, not because of lazyness. I am suspecting now in a real way that I might not be the human body so this is beggining to become really serious and exciting. 

11 hours ago, VeganAwake said:

Who keeps falling into what illusion?

The 'I' is the illusion!!

Step One is recognizing there was never a 'you' in the first place.... everything else falls into place afterwards. ❤

 

The big "I", the Self, the Universe, thats who I am and that is the one who keeps falling to the illusion

You are right that the "I" is the illusion (the "small I"), it seems you have "got it" permanently by your messages. Happy for you man. By some weird reason though it seems "I" keep believing myself to be this illusion

2 hours ago, Nahm said:

Story of others, achievement...reinforces the belief you’re separate. 

Story of you awakening & falling into the illusion is thoughts only. It’s a story about a ‘you’. 

States, condemnation, psychedelics, sober, temporary states, illusion, fragmented, prison...nobody’s forcing you to retell these stories about yourself. Contemplate why you’re doing this. Be attentive to what you are being inattentive to.  ‘Go back’, to the very first step of avoiding feeling. 

?? 

You say that a lot and i think it´s brilliant but it seems a quite impossible thing to do sober. I can only opening up to feeling when I am on psychedelics because they literally force me to it. But in my normal state (oh men, I am doing it again  ) seems a very far away possibility to do.

 

[Someone here]

@Javfly33 

If I told you "stay as awareness".. Who is there to stay as awareness ?  Awareness is already always effortlessly staying as itself.

If I told you "don't listen to thoughts".. Who is there to listen or not listen ? If I told you "don't judge thoughts let them come and go"..who is there to do these things. There is nothing there that can choose to do this or that. Even if I say let everything as it is.. That's still assuming there is a you that can either surrender or resist. There is nothing to be done. Who would do it?

Edited December 2, 2020 by Someone here

[Javfly33]

6 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Javfly33 

If I told you "stay as awareness".. Who is there to stay as awareness ?  Awareness is already always effortlessly staying as itself.

If I told you "don't listen to thoughts".. Who is there to listen or not listen ? If I told you "don't judge thoughts let them come and go"..who is there to do these things. There is nothing there that can choose to do this or that. Even if I say let everything as it is.. That's still assuming there is a you that can either surrender or resist. There is nothing to be done. Who would do it?

The Self!!! 

The void or nothingness is intelligent and can choose to identify with thoughts, or not.

That´s my view at least @Someone here

[Someone here]

13 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

The Self!!! 

The void or nothingness is intelligent and can choose to identify with thoughts, or not.

That´s my view at least @Someone here

Who is that guy? 

[Forestluv]

2 hours ago, Endangered-EGO said:

 

I’m not sure forcing yourself to meditate more than you can handle is better or even faster. Adyashanti said that, going at it with determination like an athlete just worked for him because he struggled so hard he finally gave  up everything and had an awakening.
Most people aren't ready to experience hell in order to "know the truth about hell". Forcing yourself to do self inquiry and meditation is just not a long term solution for most people who desire changes in perception (awakenings) or "liberation from suffering".

If you enjoy meditation, and it feels good, your mind will simply end up desiring to meditate more, and fall into mindfulness meditation during the day. Mixing effort- with effortless-meditation raises concentration too.

You cannot start to sprint in the middle of a marathon. Keep the pace.

The mind needs to build up momentum, by desiring to meditate. If it feels good to be focussed, the mind will naturally enter that state. If it feels bad the mind will try everything to get away from "IT".
 

I ran marathons for over 20 yrs and marathon runners are always at the edge of “more than you can handle”. To a marathon runner “more than you can handle” means burnout or a serious injury that prevents training. Ime, it’s true that having joy and fun in running is important. If someone is forcing themselves to run and hates it, they won’t make it the long haul. There needs to be elements of fun and joy in the training. Yet the expectation that one will always be passionate to run and feel joy is not optimal either. Ask any veteran marathon runner if they feel motivated to run and joyful 100% of the time and they will all say 'no', because if that were true, there is still more they can handle and they are nowhere near their edge. 

There are times the last thing I want to do is run. It’s rainy and I’m tired - yet I do it anyway. There are workouts in which my body is a bag of lactic acid and I’m begging myself to quit the workout early - yet I don’t. These times are potent medicine, perhaps 10-20% of training - yet are necessary to reach one’s potential and expertise. And this is true in any field:  spirituality, science, art, sports, yoga, skiing, writing etc.

And in becoming an expert skier, one must be willing to fall. I remember standing at the top of a black diamond slope taking a deep breath and facing my edge. My mind was hyper alert and adrenaline flowed through my body. And down I went doing my best to ski through the moguls. At first I was awkward and I fell several times. This is important for development, yet one goes over a threshold of intensity and duration, injury will result. Yet without going toward one's edge, the mind and body will not reach it's potential. If I stayed on the bunny slopes, I wouldn't have reached higher levels. This is in the context of developing knowledge, skills and expertise. 

[Nahm]

55 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

You say that a lot and i think it´s brilliant but it seems a quite impossible thing to do sober. I can only opening up to feeling when I am on psychedelics because they literally force me to it. But in my normal state (oh men, I am doing it again  ) seems a very far away possibility to do.

 

Then the self referential thinking is non resistant. It’s actually what you want, what feels good & aligned for you. 

[Moksha]

55 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

I ran marathons for over 20 yrs and marathon runners are always at the edge of “more than you can handle”. To a marathon runner “more than you can handle” means burnout or a serious injury that prevents training. Ime, it’s true that having joy and fun in running is important. If someone is forcing themselves to run and hates it, they won’t make it the long haul. There needs to be elements of fun and joy in the training. Yet the expectation that one will always be passionate to run and feel joy is not optimal either. Ask any veteran marathon runner if they feel motivated to run and joyful 100% of the time and they will all say 'no', because if that were true, there is still more they can handle and they are nowhere near their edge. 

There are times the last thing I want to do is run. It’s rainy and I’m tired - yet I do it anyway. There are workouts in which my body is a bag of lactic acid and I’m begging myself to quit the workout early - yet I don’t. These times are potent medicine, perhaps 10-20% of training - yet are necessary to reach one’s potential and expertise. And this is true in any field:  spirituality, science, art, sports, writing etc. Yet if those times go over a threshold of intensity and duration, injury will result. Yet without going toward one's edge, the mind and body will not reach it's potential - in the context of developing knowledge, skills and expertise. 

Perfect timing and very helpful for me, thank you. ?

[Javfly33]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

Then the self referential thinking is non resistant. It’s actually what you want, what feels good & aligned for you. 

14 hours ago, VeganAwake said:

 

Sorry, can't unquote.

@Nahm What to do if you skip meditation one day because you have to do things and the mind start creating thoughts of guilt and anxiety about "heeeey!!! You have skipped meditation! What are doing? You are going to lose all of this amazing awareness!! You are going to lose the joy!!!"

And "see? You can't put yourself disciplined. This demostrates you don't deserve liberation. Enjoy your prison, here comes another thought, motherfucker".

 

This two arised today and I didn't know what to do with them. ??

[Nahm]

@Javfly33

What do you do with cars going by? 

[Javfly33]

26 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Javfly33

What do you do with cars going by? 

I let them pass Lol

But what if they are right?

[Nahm]

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

But what if they are right?

⬆️  ? ? 

[Moksha]

2 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

But what if they are right?

Depends on who is driving. If the car is driving you, it is never right. If you are driving the car, it is always right. Learn to notice the difference.

[Nahm]

@Moksha

Nice.