Bluetooth and 4G/5G - B.S Conspiracy or Dangerous?

[Javfly33]

13 hours ago, Blackhawk said:

And EMF could also cause a pink unicorn to manifest itself from thin air.

But if you claim that, you need to bring the evidence.

It's not my job to prove that EMF can't cause a pink elephant to manifest itself from thin air. It's your job to prove that EMF causes a pink elephant to manifest from thin air.

Duh... You "scientists-give me the proof" are always so predictable...

What I find dangerous about your way of thinking is that you assume that as long as hasn´t been proven, then we should just do what we are doing. We just should wait for the official science. This is such a naive dumb position.

For example, let´s say there´s evidence and investigation that indicates that smoking it´s highly nocive for the lungs. But this evidence so far has been put together yet in a strictly scientific manner. THere´s anecdotical evidence too (also not scientific).

So after all of this evidence, the normal thing to do is to do would be to, at least, try to inform yourself more, be a little on the heads up, etc. 

But no, you keep smoking, no matter what, you just wait that hardcore evidence to give you the truth. The problem is, science takes a lot of time. It might be too late if you wait for the newspaper and the official science to give you the truth

Can you consider that something might be TRUE and at the same time maybe it hasnt been proven yet?

You type of guys just give me the sensation that you go around in life thinking that if I can´t prove that mars doesn´t exist, that means AUTOMATICALLY that mars doesn´t exist!! Lol

It´s like the evidence materialize reality for you guys. Lol. If I cant prove to you that 2+2= 4, then by your logic, 2+2 are not 4

Edited December 3, 2020 by Javfly33

[Blackhawk]

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

Duh... You "scientists-give me the proof" are always so predictable...

What I find dangerous about your way of thinking is that you assume that as long as hasn´t been proven, then we should just do what we are doing. We just should wait for the official science. This is such a naive dumb position.

For example, let´s say there´s evidence and investigation that indicates that smoking it´s highly nocive for the lungs. But this evidence so far has been put together yet in a strictly scientific manner. THere´s anecdotical evidence too (also not scientific).

So after all of this evidence, the normal thing to do is to do would be to, at least, try to inform yourself more, be a little on the heads up, etc. 

But no, you keep smoking, no matter what, you just wait that hardcore evidence to give you the truth. The problem is, science takes a lot of time. It might be too late if you wait for the newspaper and the official science to give you the truth

Can you consider that something might be TRUE and at the same time maybe it hasnt been proven yet?

You type of guys just give me the sensation that you go around in life thinking that if I can´t prove that mars doesn´t exist, that means AUTOMATICALLY that mars doesn´t exist!! Lol

It´s like the evidence materialize reality for you guys. Lol. If I cant prove to you that 2+2= 4, then by your logic, 2+2 are not 4

 

30 minutes ago, neutralempty said:

@Javfly33

It's just a substitution for the bible. Now it's science!

Sigh. Ok, let's talk again in 25 years, then we'll see who was right.

Spoiler: it will be me.

While we are waiting 25 years you guys can abandon all electronical stuff, while I will be happily using them. And then when you see it's safe you can start using them.

Edited December 4, 2020 by Blackhawk

[LfcCharlie4]

@Blackhawk That's the thing you don't get (as you never looked into any of the resources I sent) you don't need to abandon 'electronical stuff' you just need to take preventative measures that are pretty basic really & become habits. 

Not putting your phone up to your head, or in your pocket (unless on Aeroplane mode), turning WiFi and electrics off at night, wearing blue light glasses at night, wearing air tube headphoes etc etc, there's so many little things we can do, it doesn't have to transform your life, that's the thing. 

Personally, I noticed improvements in sleep just by doing this & by sleeping grounded, but I'm all about optimizing health & living a long, healthy life, so am always looking for ways to optimize. 

And, I look forward to speaking in 20-25 years, especially as wireless tech gets stronger & tech use drastically rises in Children, I think we are going to have a lot of changes have to happen. 

[Arcangelo]

@Blackhawk  Hehe! tell us more

[The0Self]

I've heard military men on submarines have spiritual experiences more often than other people. I heard it on some podcast and it wasn't mentioned in relation to 5G or electromagnetic waves or anything like that -- it was some completely different topic.

Maybe they're out of the reach of the electromagnetic fields down there and somehow they temporarily become slightly more contemplatively fit? I have no clue.

[randomguy123]

I heard sadhguru once mention that there is definitely an impact of this stuff on you, Wifi, Cellular, etc, although he did not go in to detail.

As far as academic science is concerned, the only thing they care about right now is the amount of power transferred. This makes phone calls the main issue, as you hold the phone close to your head, much more power gets generated compared to any other action, which causes the skin to heat up in significant ways and might have an effect on the cells. There have been some negative results reported for that. So this is not applicable to wifi, 4G, 5G and bluetooth and all the rest as they generate so little power. It's pretty crude, but that's the level that we're scientifically thinking at.

This is very unlikely to change, because of the way we fundamentally think about electromagnetic radiation. They're not concerned about high frequency signals, because even the highest used frequencies in electronics are much lower than say the frequencies of visible light. So if we go all out with 5G, telecom systems anything you want, we would still be producing things that are considered less harmful to the scientific community than everyday "visible light". Nobody cares where this radiation comes from, because it is all just electromagnetic radiation and the stars that produce the only visible light that is natural, are just considered to produce it with a certain distribution, nothing special about that. Nobody will ask any further questions, as this model is so fundamentally embedded in science today, that to improve it or add to it would require the largest of paradigm shifts. Like making string theory work, but for electronics.

Besides, all the electric lighting that you have in your house, produces more power and much higher frequency radiation than wifi or 4G or 5G, so if you're worried about wifi, or 5G, electric lighthing should scare you to death.

 

 

[Arcangelo]

These concerns exist since the invention of radio BTW

[mmKay]

On 29/11/2020 at 7:46 PM, Austin Actualizing said:

Your health is more important than putting yourself at risk. 

LOL this sentence

[mmKay]

On 29/11/2020 at 8:14 PM, Travelion said:

During sleep the WiFi should be turned off

Uhh, I don't know if that's gonna do anything. You can make your phone not pick up the signal but it's still there being sent from the router? And also, if you go to your phone wifi options, you most likely will see like 25 more closeby wifi signals being picked up, not as you had the only router in the whole city X D

[lmfao]

On 03/12/2020 at 8:58 AM, Blackhawk said:

Bring the scientific evidence.

In this matter you are in the realm of modern science. So without any science showing that it's unsafe it's just a fear/belief. And mere speculation.

False until proven otherwise.

The logic you've been spouting in this thread is far from comprehensive or complete. 

For many scientific innovations, e.g. medicines, drugs and foods, the "burden of proof" is often on those companies to test that it is safe before they allow all humans to use it. I'm not asking that the same standard be applied be here, but to show the room for error and gaps in your thinking. 
----
This isn't me saying I think or know they cause harm. To my personal intuition and "common sense", it isn't a large "leap" to think it's possible that lots of electromagnetic waves in the advent of technology may have an impact on the human biology, possibly in a negative/perturbing way.

What seems like a plausible leap or plausible concern to me might seem like an irrational leap to you, and vice versa. Everyone has "common sense" or "gut" concerns, but everyone has different ones. It's quite relative and tricky to navigate. You can't do away with the problem completely by labelling all these hunches as hogwash either. Since we all have correct hunches for things that might be bad for us even if we aren't scientists with studies on hand to prove it. 


But I have no idea if they do cause harm. It's already known that using technology changes your brain and psychology due to interacting with the content of technology in a particular way (social media, addiction, etc), but that's not the same as saying that these waves inherently cause physical harm. Maybe some studies out there sufficiently 'debunk' the idea, I don't know.

Edited December 9, 2020 by lmfao

[Blackhawk]

@lmfao They have tested it before they have released it.

And we have had this kind of technology for decades.

At this point it's just ridiculous to be afraid that they cause harm. But there will always be paranoid people. For example there's still paranoid people who think that eating microwaved food is dangerous. Even after 1000 years there will still be people who will be afraid of all technology. It will never stop.

Man, I really don't want to talk about this subject. It's such a unnecessary topic, a waste of time.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Blackhawk

[lmfao]

@Blackhawk fair. You do have a point about it being fear or random sentiments. 

[peqkno]

On 29.11.2020 at 11:30 PM, Red-White-Light said:

It's a non-ionising radiation.

There was a time I was looking into that stuff (EMFs, ...).

Most interview I heard on the subject adressed that point "It's non-ionising radiation" (as well as "Too little energy to heat you up.")  - given I luckily listened to the ones that didn't feel like conspiracy thinking with no evidence behind it.

- The argument: It's another pathway / mechanism, it isn't either heat nor must the radiation be ionising, it works through a different mechanism.
(Mercola interviewed a scientist talking about VCCGs (voltage gated calcium channels) )

https://www.emfsa.co.za/videos/dr-martin-pall-to-the-nih-the-5g-rollout-is-absolutely-insane/

 

The main pattern I saw happening:

Many who say it doesn't have any effect (people I saw online) didn't do any research on the topic and their talking points are "there's no thermal damage, it's not ionising, so it can't."
Which isn't adressing the concerns of people talking about adverse effects ("non-thermal damage", "standards different around the world and not safe"...). And these are the main arguments I saw from people talking about adverse effect of EMFs.

(Would find it way nicer when they were to open their minds, listen to the actual arguments made and do more science around the topic to check the actual arguments being made and find out new stuff.)
It's like people know and have seen the "5G/EMF is dangerous" on Alex Jones or sth, but don't take the possibility serious that there may be actual scientists and people who aren't into conspiratorial thinking AND research those and actually go find those.
 

Plus, I'm pretty confident you can find studies on smartphone usage near the head and blood cells clotting together.  Any other claims, idk.

@Blackhawk What counts as evidence for you? https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/7520958029.pdf  (page 5 or 79, and others) ?

 

Ideally I would have done the science myself and directly experienced it, but I didn't have the balls yet to put three wifi-routers and a cellphone around my head. That would be the clearest way to tell and end any discussions (if no more narratives are stricken around it).

 

If that's not convincing to open the mind to the possibility and you're interested in finding what's up with this, then research yourself. Don't expect a gold standard post that can't be nitpicked to be written by "busy" people on some random forum, but go out of your normal way to explore.

(and no, I don't mean there's no woo or people who try use the fear to market you magical stuff necklaces, or people just believing in 5G = Bad because of conspiracy thinking and no scepticism... I see that element being there.)

There's also some older threads on this forum on this topic with more examples, etc. ...

 

That being said, if there's anyone here actually having looked extensively into it and has come up with any conclusions, please share. I'd like to get some rebuttal on the vccgs, blood clotting, etc.

[Blackhawk]

5 hours ago, peqkno said:

 

@Blackhawk What counts as evidence for you? https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/7520958029.pdf  (page 5 or 79, and others) ?

 

Ideally I would have done the science myself and directly experienced it, but I didn't have the balls yet to put three wifi-routers and a cellphone around my head. That would be the clearest way to tell and end any discussions (if no more narratives are stricken around it).

 

If that's not convincing to open the mind to the possibility and you're interested in finding what's up with this, then research yourself. Don't expect a gold standard post that can't be nitpicked to be written by "busy" people on some random forum, but go out of your normal way to explore.

(and no, I don't mean there's no woo or people who try use the fear to market you magical stuff necklaces, or people just believing in 5G = Bad because of conspiracy thinking and no scepticism... I see that element being there.)

There's also some older threads on this forum on this topic with more examples, etc. ...

 

That being said, if there's anyone here actually having looked extensively into it and has come up with any conclusions, please share. I'd like to get some rebuttal on the vccgs, blood clotting, etc.

Even if the blood changes, there's no evidence of it causing harm to the body.

Putting three wifi routers and a cellphone around your head wouldn't be a realistic scenario.

[DIDego]

@Blackhawk  Heard about The Marlboro Man?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marlboro_Man