Peter Ralston on psychedelics

[Gesundheit]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

If sticking 5-MeO-DMT up your ass counts as grace, then I guess grace it is.

Cause and effect = materialism

Grace = the opposite of materialism (and not even idealism)

[lmfao]

I find the talk about spiritual talent quite unsettling, since my emotional reaction is hearing someone telling me that I have no talent. And I'm defensive of the notion of talent as it's talked about here because I don't want to believe it and internalise it. So I won't believe it. 

This talk about talent, and a few other things like states and etc. You can call it me projecting my insecurities (which I can accept) or just not being the right thing for me to hear right now, but it doesn't foster the correct mindset in me. Hearing it talked about this way invokes in me the mindset of playing a relative game which is all about material acquisition of spiritual goodies. 
Maybe what you guys is saying is 'true' , I don't know, but it doesn't help me to read it since I think it creates an incorrect mindset (Yes yes, no one is forcing me to believe it and this is just my reaction). 

[UnbornTao]

@lmfao You may find this useful: Leo says that, in a sense, he’s spiritually gifted. But look at his older videos. He didn’t have a clue about enlightenment and yet talked about it. Now he seems to have had some genuine enlightenment experiences.

So forget this talent talk.  

[mandyjw]

@lmfao When a master is in the flow of doing what they've mastered, like a master pianist, pro tennis player, etc, are they reflecting upon how they are doing? 

[tsuki]

Enlightenment is an entirely relative matter. Relative to the self, no-self is absolute. Absolute is ineffable and totally ungraspable to the mind.

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, lmfao said:

I find the talk about spiritual talent quite unsettling, since my emotional reaction is hearing someone telling me that I have no talent. And I'm defensive of the notion of talent as it's talked about here because I don't want to believe it and internalise it. So I won't believe it. 

This talk about talent, and a few other things like states and etc. You can call it me projecting my insecurities (which I can accept) or just not being the right thing for me to hear right now, but it doesn't foster the correct mindset in me. Hearing it talked about this way invokes in me the mindset of playing a relative game which is all about material acquisition of spiritual goodies. 
Maybe what you guys is saying is 'true' , I don't know, but it doesn't help me to read it since I think it creates an incorrect mindset (Yes yes, no one is forcing me to believe it and this is just my reaction). 

It's way deeper than merely talent.

It's more like I'm telling you that you cannot fly because you weren't born a bird. The bird isn't simply talented at flying. The bird has hardware that you don't have.

Likewise there are many things you are not conscious of because you don't have the hardware.

[Forestluv]

7 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It's way deeper than merely talent.

It's more like I'm telling you that you cannot fly because you weren't born a bird. The bird isn't simply talented at flying. The bird has hardware that you don't have.

Likewise there are many things you are not conscious of because you don't have the hardware.

How much of limitation is due to not maximizing one's hardware vs the limits of their hardware?

To me a lot of people seem to cut off from their hardware potential by focusing on inherent hardware limitations, of which they aren't aware of what the limits are. They've never pushed themselves to those limits. 

Ime, this is one of the values of psychedelics. I thought I had an idea of what my hardware potential was and that I was reaching 90% or so of it. Then psychedelics revealed so much expansion that I realized I was only operating at about 0.1% of my hardware potential. It was like realizing I had been playing Atari games on a PS5. 

[UnbornTao]

@Leo Gura

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Likewise there are many things you are not conscious of because you don't have the hardware.

I say bullshit again. The reason you’re not conscious is because you’re not conscious. You are Consciousness and there’s no hardware in that.

[mandyjw]

God is so good, there's no bullshit. It's all just fertilizer for more beauty. 

Nonduality, means there isn't duality. But in order to say there's no duality, we must use the word duality. What a bunch of bullshit. So nonduality and duality are one. Except that's bullshit too, because there isn't "one" without duality and the possibility of "not one". You have teachers talking about levels and you have teachers denying levels. Believing in levels is a major problem. Believing that there are NOT levels is a major problem and still in order to believe there aren't levels, you must actually believe in the concept of levels just like in order to talk about nonduality, we must assume we know what duality is first. Watch like a HAWK what's pre-assumed. Here be dragons. 

Edited December 2, 2020 by mandyjw

[Leo Gura]

25 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

How much of limitation is due to not maximizing one's hardware vs the limits of their hardware?

Not only that, but much of the limits are software which can be upgraded.

It's difficult to know when a limit is hardware vs software since there is no clear line between them.

Quote

Ime, this is one of the values of psychedelics. I thought I had an idea of what my hardware potential was and that I was reaching 90% or so of it. Then psychedelics revealed so much expansion that I realized I was only operating at about 0.1% of my hardware potential. It was like realizing I had been playing Atari games on a PS5. 

I consider psychedelics hardware because you cannot easily change your natural neurotransmitter cocktail.

Psychedelics show you the absolute importance of hardware in consciousness.

If you could permanently alter your natural nuerotransmitter cocktail you could acheive levels of conscious impossible otherwise.

23 minutes ago, Arzola said:

@Leo Gura

I say bullshit again. The reason you’re not conscious is because you’re not conscious. You are Consciousness and there’s no hardware in that.

You say bullshit cause you are an arrogant jackass  You think you got consciousness all figured out, but you don't.

[The0Self]

2 hours ago, lmfao said:

I find the talk about spiritual talent quite unsettling, since my emotional reaction is hearing someone telling me that I have no talent. And I'm defensive of the notion of talent as it's talked about here because I don't want to believe it and internalise it. So I won't believe it.

There is spiritual talent. Just like there's athletic talent. Surprise, surprise... But untrained vs trained can be so much greater than relatively untalented vs talented. There are absolutely no limits to what you as God can do. In the end you always get exactly what you as God want. But you as God is selfless -- and also limitless.

Edited December 2, 2020 by The0Self

[Fran11]

16 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

If you could permanently alter your natural nuerotransmitter cocktail you could acheive levels of conscious impossible otherwise.

That can be done by Visualizations and high Imagination developement. Believe it or not I've been into those practices for five years now and my sober consciousness is at the level of a moderate dose of LSD.

And before I just had a normie consciousness so I don't think I was born with any special hardware. I don't say this to brag but to encourage others that it is possible.

Part of the reason people highly underestimate how high sober consciousness can go is because they explore Psychedelic states but then their daily sober practices constist manily of dry concentrations which take you in a completely different direction...

Edited December 2, 2020 by Fran11

[Forestluv]

6 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I consider psychedelics hardware because you cannot easily change your natural neurotransmitter cocktail.

Psychedelics show you the absolute importance of hardware in consciousness.

If you could permanently alter your natural nuerotransmitter cocktail you could achieve levels of conscious impossible otherwise.

Ahh, so psychedelics would temporarily upgrade the hardware of Atari to a PS5. 

Once someone gets a good look at PS5 and drops back down to Atari - it seems they can either try to upgrade the quality of their Atari games or upgrade the quality of their Atari hardware to be more like PS5. 

[The0Self]

3 minutes ago, Fran11 said:

That can be done by Visualizations and high Imagination developement. Believe it or not I've been into those practices for five years now and my sober consciousness is at the level of a moderate dose of LSD.

Part of the reason people highly undunestimate how high sober consciousness can go is because they explore Psychedelic states but then their sober practices constist manily of dry concentrations which take you in a completely different direction...

My hope is that this is already obvious to many of us here.

There is no sober consciousness. There's just what seems to happen. The apparent reality can be guided and altered to out-of-this-world blissful states. One way that is available to basically everyone is practicing the Jhanas -- a method I highly encourage spiritual aspirants to get excited about, because once you get a taste of it, it's all over.

[Forestluv]

14 minutes ago, Fran11 said:

That can be done by Visualizations and high Imagination developement. Believe it or not I've been into those practices for five years now and my sober consciousness is at the level of a moderate dose of LSD.

And before I just had a normie consciousness so I don't think I have any special hardware.

Part of the reason people highly undunestimate how high sober consciousness can go is because they explore Psychedelic states but then their sober practices constist manily of dry concentrations which take you in a completely different direction...

In terms of neurotransmitter activity, LSD-induced states are incredibly difficult to attain without LSD. Lucid dream states may seem subjectively similar to tripping, yet not based on neurotransmitter cocktails. LSD has widespread effects on various serotonin signaling pathways. That is incredibly hard to mimic naturally. Expert meditators have achieved unique patterns of brain activity, yet I haven't seen anything near a psychedelic-induced state. This of course is based on ideas of entities called a "brain" and "neurotransmitters", there are also other ways to look at it. 

 

[Adamq8]

2 minutes ago, The0Self said:

My hope is that this is already obvious to many of us here.

There is no sober consciousness. There's just what seems to happen. The apparent reality can be guided and altered to out-of-this-world blissful states. One way that is available to basically everyone is practicing the Jhanas -- a method I highly encourage spiritual aspirants to get excited about, because once you get a taste of it, it's all over.

Can you share more about the Jhanas? It sounds interesting 

[Fran11]

4 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

In terms of neurotransmitter activity, LSD-induced states are incredibly difficult to attain without LSD. Lucid dreams states may subjectively feel similar to tripping, yet not based on neurotransmitter cocktails. LSD has widespread effects on various serotonin signaling pathways. That is incredibly hard to mimic naturally. Expert meditators have achieved unique patterns of brain activity, yet I haven't seen anything near a psychedelic-induced state. This of course is based on ideas of things called a "brain" and "neurotransmitters", there are also other ways to look at it. 

 

Yeah you are right, but if you reach the same levels of Consciousness and Imagination, and can completely replace "reality" with your Imagination at will... what do NTs matter? 

Edited December 2, 2020 by Fran11

[Forestluv]

11 minutes ago, Fran11 said:

Yeah you are right, but if you reach the same levels of Consciousness and Imagination, and can completely replace "reality" with your Imagination at will... what do NTs matter? 

I would say it depends on one's experience of "Consciousness levels and Imagination". If in your experience, you now have the same level of Consciousness and Imagination with or without psychedelics and you have no desire to use psychedelics, then psychedelics and ideas about NTs don't matter within your experience.  

[Fran11]

12 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

I would say it depends on one's experience of "Consciousness levels and Imagination". If in your experience, you now have the same level of Consciousness and Imagination with or without psychedelics and you have no desire to use psychedelics, then psychedelics and ideas about NTs don't matter within your experience.  

What I ment is that I have reached the same level of consciousness that before would take a moderate dose of LSD for me to achieve. Now having that baseline, that same dose takes me even higher, as it usually happens to everybody with Psyches if they do Consciousness work.

A great way to "lock-in" the Psychedelic consciousness is trying to recreate those levels of Imagination the days after the trip IME. It's like steroids for Imagination developement so they are still extremely useful for me.

Edited December 2, 2020 by Fran11

[Forestluv]

4 minutes ago, Fran11 said:

What I ment is that I have reached the same level of consciousness that before would take a moderate dose of LSD to achieve. Now having that baseline, that same dose takes me even higher, as it usually happens to everybody with Psyches if they do Consciousness work.

That seems to be what some call "raising one's baseline level of consciousness".

That's what I was referring to with upgrading ones software or hardware. Ime, I don't see how it's possible to access or maintain my highest levels of psychedelic-induced conscious states. Yet I can access what seems like a low dose of psychedelics with things like yoga, running, shamanic breathing, meditation in nature, watching nonduality videos, Leo's metaphysics videos, staring in space, lucid dream states etc.