Posted November 25, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, Jodistrict said: This is why I don’t take anything serious that is popular in this shallow, money-driven culture. Peterson reflects back the prejudices of his followers thus making them feel validated. He is not an author who breaks new ground in understanding. @Jodistrict That's well put. I have the same issue with other popular figures like Ben Shapiro and Alex Jones. They're not popular for having profound, groundbreaking knowledge. They're just popular for having people that are willing to listen to them because they want someone who's articulate with good rhetorical skills to validate their preconceived opinions. Edited November 25, 2020 by Peter-Andre Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted November 25, 2020 What's wrong with JP? Could someone enlighten me please? I'm really not a JP fanboy. Right now I'm listening to his 12 rules for life book. As far as I can tell it's some sort of a self help book with a lot of intellectual cross references from different sciences. Nothing wrong with that. Sometimes it's hard for me to listen to him because the tonality in his voice is quite dark and negatively sounding and some of his arguments in 12rfl seem really farfetched but that's probably not what you criticising here, right? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted November 25, 2020 2 hours ago, Grzegorz said: What's wrong with JP? Could someone enlighten me please? There is nothing wrong with him per se. He has many conservative views that don't coincide with the views of the more liberal members on this forum. His intent is good, but he is a little bit stuck in his own Ego. His Ego has created an image of a public intellectual, and the image doesn't allow him to look beyond the image and into the essence. If his words inspire you or help you in any way, follow his work. josephknecht.org Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted November 25, 2020 7 hours ago, Peter-Andre said: @Jodistrict That's well put. I have the same issue with other popular figures like Ben Shapiro and Alex Jones. They're not popular for having profound, groundbreaking knowledge. They're just popular for having people that are willing to listen to them because they want someone who's articulate with good rhetorical skills to validate their preconceived opinions. they're also pretty good at marketing themselves Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted November 26, 2020 Only a true conservative would try to make laws and rules out of chaos. Kind of like acknowledging that yes, chaos is necessary, but we must tame the beast and "civilize" it by bringing more rules, concepts and order to it. "Only that which can change can continue." -James P. Carse Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted November 30, 2020 I liked this one. helped me a lot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted November 30, 2020 @MrWolf Haven't read that one yet. Is the advice also applicable to women? josephknecht.org Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted November 30, 2020 Ofc I will, I didn't get a single note out of 12 Rules and found it way too verbose, but I'll probably eventually buy it again and re-read it as consciousness tends to shift. Hopefully this book will provide me with one note, but if not that's cool too, I've learned a ton from Jordan over the years, so I'm happy to send him a few lobster buckerinos. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 1, 2020 On 24/11/2020 at 7:40 AM, Applegarden said: If we don't want to give JP publicity, then how about people like Tony Robbins, Dan Pena, pick-up coaches e.c.t. We all started from somewhere and maybe people find their own missing fragments they needed to hear from JP, of course it could come with it's risks and misdirections, but i can come from you and me aswell. Thanks for this post. What's with all of the arrogance in this thread? I enjoyed "12 Rules for Life", when I read it 2 years ago. I liked how it was composed of 12 essays and the style of writing. I think JP had a solid point about learning to express your thoughts clearly in writing and speech. At the time this book seemed like a breath of fresh air, but thinking back now, it was probably because I was very lost existentially back then. When you're lost, anything as stable as 12 rules for life you grab onto like a liferaft. So as you said, @Applegarden, maybe at this point this was what I needed to hear and what resonated. Saw the "12 More Rules" on a bookshelf, but personally it didn't appeal to me enough to even pick it up. Why would you need 12 more rules? Seems kind of overwhelming. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 1, 2020 (edited) It seems like this book won't come out till at least March next year. When that happens, we can gather around again lmao to discuss. Edited December 1, 2020 by lmfao Hark ye yet again — the little lower layer. All visible objects, man, are but as pasteboard masks. But in each event — in the living act, the undoubted deed — there, some unknown but still reasoning thing puts forth the mouldings of its features from behind the unreasoning mask. If man will strike, strike through the mask! How can the prisoner reach outside except by thrusting through the wall? To me, the white whale is that wall, shoved near to me. Sometimes I think there's naught beyond. But 'tis enough. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 (edited) Maybe JBP is just doing the best he can, and just so happens has become fond of making a lot of money doing it. Will the fondness be a distraction? It's certainly possible. I haven't read any of his books and have only skimmed the self-help character of his writing and some explorations of religious ideas in a few lectures. Seems that he's mostly occupied with approaching chaos with the mind to bring it into order, or something or other. Maybe it is related to the unconscious fears that inhabit his psyche due to the illnesses that he has mentioned (not really sure what they are). Not sure, but his approach does betray a certain level of suffering, it seems. There might be some value to attempting to bring mental order to chaos, because in the effort, it may become apparent that such implied control will not be on the apparent world, nor even of the mind. It could further the potential for realizing what is NOT true, thus understanding the limitations of mind as a tool. Until then, his mind will likely maintain its hegemony over him as his master. Edited December 2, 2020 by kbone Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 (edited) @SS10 Not impressed with Robert Greene either (saw that as a thread somewhere). Jordan Peterson's only useful comment is the relational feedback loop that a human being needs to optimise between their prefrontal cortex and their autobiographical memory in order to derive self-wisdom via reflection. And I said it better than him. And I didn't need to write a book, nor two. These people are scamming you because they know you're stuck at the cultural casino (its a real thing - millions of people play the slot machines on YouTube and bookstores especially in the personal development section looking for that fix that's never going to come). Give me money now please, I just made your life exponentially better with that one insight. They take advantage of the fact that people's relational relationship with their prefrontal cortex and in particular their hippocampus (parietal lobe implicated along with corpus but let's not overcomplicate) is very low, we'll call it the PC-H-R relationship (where R is to relational). People cannot think for themselves, and scammers like the Tai Lopez's build the "thought can" vending machines to make a lot of money from people's ignorance. This is the very reason for most people's ignorance by the way. I think Jordan has a good heart, but a good heart doesn't always have completely pure intentions while at the same time I also think he's a bit ignorant of the ramifications of this very simple insight combined with peoples capacity to improve themselves here. See Jordan is a determinist in many ways, he hasn't denounced free will, but he has low openness when it comes to peoples capacity to improve their cognition through a simple technique like this. This one simple ignorance, is what gives him the justification to write books of "tomato and barbecue sauce please, oh yes and with onion. Garlic? Yeah adda little of that as well, and sauerkraut!". They want your money just like a beggar wants your money, more importantly they want the status more than the money so give the money to the beggar instead and if you really want to build long lasting insight, fix your damn brain and you'll thank me for it later. Edited December 2, 2020 by Origins Transcendence: List of Journals - https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/63844-transcendent-journals-list/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 2 hours ago, Origins said: Give me money now please, I just made your life exponentially better with that one insight. Just make a thread whenever you have your ted talk or release a book ? Hark ye yet again — the little lower layer. All visible objects, man, are but as pasteboard masks. But in each event — in the living act, the undoubted deed — there, some unknown but still reasoning thing puts forth the mouldings of its features from behind the unreasoning mask. If man will strike, strike through the mask! How can the prisoner reach outside except by thrusting through the wall? To me, the white whale is that wall, shoved near to me. Sometimes I think there's naught beyond. But 'tis enough. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Origins said: @SS10 Not impressed with Robert Greene either (saw that as a thread somewhere). Jordan Peterson's only useful comment is the relational feedback loop that a human being needs to optimise between their prefrontal cortex and their autobiographical memory in order to derive self-wisdom via reflection. And I said it better than him. And I didn't need to write a book, nor two. These people are scamming you because they know you're stuck at the cultural casino (its a real thing - millions of people play the slot machines on YouTube and bookstores especially in the personal development section looking for that fix that's never going to come). Give me money now please, I just made your life exponentially better with that one insight. They take advantage of the fact that people's relational relationship with their prefrontal cortex and in particular their hippocampus (parietal lobe implicated along with corpus but let's not overcomplicate) is very low, we'll call it the PC-H-R relationship (where R is to relational). People cannot think for themselves, and scammers like the Tai Lopez's build the "thought can" vending machines to make a lot of money from people's ignorance. This is the very reason for most people's ignorance by the way. I think Jordan has a good heart, but a good heart doesn't always have completely pure intentions while at the same time I also think he's a bit ignorant of the ramifications of this very simple insight combined with peoples capacity to improve themselves here. See Jordan is a determinist in many ways, he hasn't denounced free will, but he has low openness when it comes to peoples capacity to improve their cognition through a simple technique like this. This one simple ignorance, is what gives him the justification to write books of "tomato and barbecue sauce please, oh yes and with onion. Garlic? Yeah adda little of that as well, and sauerkraut!". They want your money just like a beggar wants your money, more importantly they want the status more than the money so give the money to the beggar instead and if you really want to build long lasting insight, fix your damn brain and you'll thank me for it later. Lmfao authors who contain even an ounce of truth cannot scam you. Scam relative to what? Nightclubs Monthly cable cost Alcohol, tobacco, drugs in general Shit food Awful content Yeah you're right they're a scam relative to what God can tell you. They're not a scam relative to: What 99.9% of people spend their money on What 99.9% of people spend their time on What 99.9% of products offer you They are knowledge products like anything else. Is Leo scamming you as well because you can debate what he says or his content is "too long" and can be condensed? Stop nitpicking, nitpickers are never successful. Maybe focus on the good they do???? Just lmfao @ calling them of all people scammers, extremism personified. Oh and I didn't even see the Tai Lopez thing. You know what? What are your life principles? What are your results? Post your life, writing and 100s of hours of content for us to scrutinize Edited December 2, 2020 by The_Alchemist Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 @MrWolf LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL HAHAHAAAAA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 6 hours ago, Origins said: @SS10 Whatever you said in that long paragraph sounds like it could be interesting, But I have no idea what the fuck you said. Too wordy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 I am grateful for some of his early lectures I saw online. However, his 'being', choices, words, actions and lack of mental health suggest to me he has more work to do. I hope he can continue to grow and learn. He has a lot of eyes on him. Do some good Jordan! Even if you are just a bridge to other teachers in the long run... "Unburdened and Becoming" - Bon Iver ◭"89"◮ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 2, 2020 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Thought Art said: I am grateful for some of his early lectures I saw online. However, his 'being', choices, words, actions and lack of mental health suggest to me he has more work to do. I hope he can continue to grow and learn. He has a lot of eyes on him. Do some good Jordan! Even if you are just a bridge to other teachers in the long run... He is a clear symptom of an absence of meaning and direction in the world. He´s cure looks like demanding meaning and direction in defence against nihilism and his own anxiety. I mean he helps a lot of people i hear. I just wish for people that he will be a small and quick steppingstone. He´s fight and entanglement in he´s own opinions is killing him. I hope he gives up at some point and surrenders. Edited December 2, 2020 by MrWolf Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted December 3, 2020 Locking since JP deserves no more free advertizing on this forum. You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
