How to forgive the "worst" people in society?

[Lyubov]

I find myself hitting a wall when it comes to this topic. I've grown out of actively hating or desiring seeing such people punished or such stage red/blue type reactions but beyond that I just feel indifferent. I almost don't want to feel any particular way about it or even put energy into it and I'm far from feeling foregiveness or love for such people. It feels like a blockage. I'm talking about people who are truly beyond saving. The most selfish of the selfish. Not people who are psychotic/unstable and do something crazy or someone in an incredibly desperate survival situation but those with reasonable mental clarity and means who plan and plot out their selfishness which causes immense suffering in the lives of others. I feel zero love and foregiveness for such people and don't have any good wishes to give them. How to overcome this blockage?

Edited November 21, 2020 by Lyubov

[Opo]

Candy flip? 

[Leo Gura]

Just realize they are you. So who are you judging?

[Parththakkar12]

First of all, it really is okay to not have good wishes or forgiveness for them. It may really be in the best interests of others to have such people gone. Realize though that when we indulge in such thinking, we're also being selfish and we're playing their game, so it is fair game.

If you really want to have compassion for them, my suggestion would be to look for the positive intention behind why they're doing it. There will always be a positive intention, that is a genuinely positive intention. (Not just I like killing people or something) You will see that it is impossible for someone to really have mental clarity and be dangerously selfish at the same time. There will always be some form of delusion or another.

[Eren Eeager]

Realize you would do the same horrible things if you were them and  in thier place. It just happened that you are not in thier place. It is thier job to stop doing these things and your job is to forgive them. 

[Lyubov]

27 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Just realize they are you. So who are you judging?

this is just spiritual mumbo jumbo at this point. it has yet to be integrated into the relative for me. it's easy preaching stuff like this until someone wrongs you on a deep level and you have to practice what you preach. 

5 minutes ago, Eren Eeager said:

Realize you would do the same horrible things if you were them and  in thier place. It just happened that you are not in thier place. It is thier job to stop doing these things and your job is to forgive them. 

hmm this is helpful. it's easy to judge them but if I was to experiencing their point of view with whatever means they have I would likely be making similar choices they are. 

[Lyubov]

35 minutes ago, Opo said:

Candy flip? 

my last few trips were terrible so I'm taking a break from psychedelics till I have a firm footing  

[Lyubov]

33 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

First of all, it really is okay to not have good wishes or forgiveness for them. It may really be in the best interests of others to have such people gone. Realize though that when we indulge in such thinking, we're also being selfish and we're playing their game, so it is fair game.

If you really want to have compassion for them, my suggestion would be to look for the positive intention behind why they're doing it. There will always be a positive intention, that is a genuinely positive intention. (Not just I like killing people or something) You will see that it is impossible for someone to really have mental clarity and be dangerously selfish at the same time. There will always be some form of delusion or another.

yeah you are right. for instance I don't think some person who plots out some terrible rape or murder even though they may appear articulate is doing so from a place of no suffering or selfless love but out of some deep seeded fear or pain.

[Gesundheit]

Love is understanding. Stop judging and start trying to understand them.

Forgiveness is acknowledgement and letting go. Once you have stopped judging, you will be able to forgive and let go.

[No Self]

Watch what happens when you follow through on your rage against brutalisers. You become one of them.

Forgiveness is nothing more than an act of enlightened self-interest.

[Lyubov]

2 minutes ago, No Self said:

Forgiveness is nothing more than an act of enlightened self-interest.

hmm this is an interesting way of defining foregiveness. I haven't thought of it like this before. this is helpful, thanks

Edited November 21, 2020 by Lyubov

[Eren Eeager]

@Lyubov It is all just roles we play and it all depends on our different levels of karma. If you had a low level of karma you would be playing the role of criminal, doing all these horrible selfish things. But still it is a role, you almost have no choice but to play this role. If you had a high level of karma, you would. Be playing the role of a seeker who is looking for the truth, and here also you almost have no choice but to play the role. It is just a role play game,where we paly different roles. So be a good actor  play your role and love everybody.

[Carl-Richard]

Picture them as their 3 year old self.

Edited November 21, 2020 by Carl-Richard

[No Self]

Just now, Lyubov said:

hmm this is an interesting way of defining foregiveness. I haven't thought of it like this before. this is helpful, thanks

Cheers!

I do speak from experience, so I know how unsatisfying theoretical answers can seem in the face of heavy abuse. But in the end, it's a choice of becoming a part of their sickness or discarding the whole thing with, "No, thanks." It can take time to reach that point, but I feel it is important to do so.

Note: this is not an argument for letting rapists walk the streets or failing to take practical action as needed.

[Preety_India]

You don't need to love someone that you don't want to love. Such things lead to fake morality. 

Be authentic and stop caring. 

[No Self]

Another one:

[Preety_India]

If the whole objective of forgiving was to simply annoy someone... Alas! 

The whole objective of forgiveness has been muddied. 

Do not lose yourself in trying to show others the direction. 

 

Edited November 21, 2020 by Preety_India

[Eren Eeager]

26 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

You don't need to love someone that you don't want to love. Such things lead to fake morality. 

Be authentic and stop caring. 

Yup with you in this point. If you cannot transcend selfishness you just need to accept you being selfish otherwise you will end up in forcing your self in unhealthy ways creating dysfunction.

[Preety_India]

Just now, Eren Eeager said:

Yup with you in this point. If you cannot transcend selfishness you just need to accept you being selfish otherwise you will end up in forcing your self in unhealthy ways creating dysfunction.

Calling oneself selfish for not liking something is another Fake morality pushed down your throat by moralists. 

It's just a choice of what to dislike and avoid. 

 

[Lyubov]

24 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

If the whole objective of forgiving was to simply annoy someone... Alas! 

The whole objective of forgiveness has been muddied. 

Do not lose yourself in trying to show others the direction. 

 

I knew you would post something good in here