The root of suffering IS not desire

[Nahm]

@Gesundheit

Nice. 

[Gesundheit]

1 hour ago, krockerman said:

unfulfilled desire = suffering

You'd logically think that. But in reality, no.

You'd only understand if you ever glimpsed the peace of mind that you'd feel in the absence of desire. It's beyond description, and it will spoil you for the ordinary life.

[Moksha]

2 minutes ago, krockerman said:

Even if you awake to no-self you are gonna go back to sleep. It’s just how reality works. every being in reality has at some point realized no self yet most are far from awake now. You see the problem 

You are right, for most of us. People fall into and out of sleep. It seems that the more they awaken, the longer they stay awake, until finally they no longer sleep. It is like the spiraling ascent of a mountain, passing into and out of the sun, until you are finally high enough that there is only sun.

A second path is more precipitous and rare. There are some who awake in a cataclysm of Consciousness, and then stay awake for the rest of their lives.

[Origins]

For me it's a lack of knowing.

Know truth, be free.

A lack of knowing that one day this physical form will someday end and the essence that gives birth to its consciousness will be transmuted and transformed into something presently unimaginable to me.

A lack of knowing of the ever expansive, ever mysterious nature of not just the universe but of existence itself in its most simple form, the leaves falling from the tree, a sea of consciousnesses interacting all simultaneously in different ways across this entire planet and probably many other planets presently unimaginable to most of us. 

A lack of knowing of the life that existed prior to the memory we have of experiencing this life we have now, that this memory we have is both an individual and collective hypnosis that hides us from viewing the impenetrable depth, horizon line and vastness of the memory of the grand memory of life we're all a part of.

Through this, we move on a discovery process with the imagination and the essence of being, beyond the shadows of trouble presented to us in our present life and into the rays that cast a life on all of life. Although aided by the imagination, the understanding that results is beyond imagination, it becomes like an immortal diamond we can carry in our hearts as we carry ourselves with life and its ever unfoldment, and through that process, we don't become immortal, we recognise we're already immortal. 

Thee who truly understands their immortality cannot suffer, but if we trifle with shallow understanding, this will cause great frustration and pain. So to the depths of canyons we must go, the heights of mountains, the beauty of rainbows, the mystery of rows of trees shifting synchronously from the wind, the surprising awe of a purple glow in the dawn, the brisk rise of sunlight in the morning with birds sounding the busy work of all of nature. This rounds us, grounds us, twists the sounds between our ears into frequencies that help us foresee, believe, perceive beyond the illusion, that there is no conclusion, and if so, nothing is to its exclusion, so to that, there is always home.

I know I am immortal. I want everyone to be able to have this understanding as well, but this is for them or anyone else, not for me to decide, just to open the door a little wider than before. And to this, however it is to manifest for them, let them have their dignity and regardless as to what they believe true of themselves, when I look them the eye, I will always see natures symphony.

[Tanz]

The root to suffering is ignorance

[Moksha]

@Origins ? Consciousness is Truth. But it does love to dream ?

 

Edited November 19, 2020 by Moksha

[Moksha]

5 minutes ago, Tanz said:

The root to suffering is ignorance

Very rooty. Perhaps the root of suffering is desire, and the root of desire is ignorance. When we see truly, we no longer need to desire, and therefore we no longer suffer.

[Javfly33]

You don´t get it.

ALL thoughts are desire.

 

[krockerman]

1 hour ago, Moksha said:

You are right, for most of us. People fall into and out of sleep. It seems that the more they awaken, the longer they stay awake, until finally they no longer sleep. It is like the spiraling ascent of a mountain, passing into and out of the sun, until you are finally high enough that there is only sun.

A second path is more precipitous and rare. There are some who awake in a cataclysm of Consciousness, and then stay awake for the rest of their lives.

Well no even the most enlightend beings in reality will fall back to sleep sooner or later

[krockerman]

1 hour ago, Gesundheit said:

You'd logically think that. But in reality, no.

You'd only understand if you ever glimpsed the peace of mind that you'd feel in the absence of desire. It's beyond description, and it will spoil you for the ordinary life.

Well you cannot that peace of mind unless you desire to have it. Otherwise you would not acually enjoy that peace. If you have no desire you can neither feel the pain of hell or the beauty of heaven. 
 

you desire that peace of mind. Once you get it you desire to keep that peace of mind. Otherwise you would have to problem to get back your desires

[Breakingthewall]

Most of people who is enlightened is because they had the desire to trascend the ego and be the real being, so it could be said that root of enlightenment is the desire

[Gesundheit]

43 minutes ago, krockerman said:

Well you cannot that peace of mind unless you desire to have it. Otherwise you would not acually enjoy that peace.

It's the exact opposite of desire. So pure, it only presents itself in the absence of desire.

43 minutes ago, krockerman said:

If you have no desire you can neither feel the pain of hell or the beauty of heaven.

It's beyond description. It transcends both hell and heaven.

43 minutes ago, krockerman said:

you desire that peace of mind. Once you get it you desire to keep that peace of mind. Otherwise you would have to problem to get back your desires

Once you desire it (or anything else for that matter), you will lose it. It is the most sacred thing there is. It is not to be touched by the profanity of the ego.

Edited November 19, 2020 by Gesundheit

[Beginner Mind]

54 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Most of people who is enlightened is because they had the desire to trascend the ego and be the real being, so it could be said that root of enlightenment is the desire

I was thinking something similar this morning.  It takes seeking in order to realize that there is nothing to seek.  For most of us, it's not enough to be told, "Let go of seeking."  One must go on their little spiritual journey and discover for themselves that the peace they are seeking is already here.

Edited November 19, 2020 by Beginner Mind

[from chaos into self]

Desire  is not essential to life. When you are caught in desire, you suffer, but you are right that desire is not always suffering. But to let go of desire is a step towards awakening.

[Moksha]

1 hour ago, krockerman said:

Well no even the most enlightend beings in reality will fall back to sleep sooner or later

Enlightened beings don't fall back to sleep. That is what differentiates them from people that are only awake. The Buddha, Jesus, Eckhart Tolle, etc. are always awake. Consciousness can still ebb and flow in them as it is needed, but the light is always on.

[from chaos into self]

6 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Enlightened beings don't fall back to sleep. That is what differentiates them from people that are only awake. The Buddha, Jesus, Eckhart Tolle, etc. are always awake. Consciousness can still ebb and flow in them as it is needed, but the light is always on.

Is this a belief? 

[Moksha]

2 minutes ago, from chaos into self said:

Is this a belief? 

It is a definition, which is a form of belief.

Whether or not people actually can remain awake for the rest of their lives is for you to realize

[krockerman]

On 2020-11-19 at 6:37 PM, Moksha said:

Enlightened beings don't fall back to sleep. That is what differentiates them from people that are only awake. The Buddha, Jesus, Eckhart Tolle, etc. are always awake. Consciousness can still ebb and flow in them as it is needed, but the light is always on.

They are gonna fall back as long as they follow the fundamental laws of reality. Nothing is permanent even enligtment. Even @Leo Gura has stated that even if you attain Non-duality you are gonna come back to duality at some point. That does not mean that it will happen in their life time or many many life times. But it will happen

[Moksha]

2 minutes ago, krockerman said:

They are gonna fall back as long as they follow the fundamental laws of reality. Nothing is permanent even enligtment. Even @Leo Gura has stated that even if you attain Non-duality you are gonna come back to duality at some point. That does not mean that it will happen in their life time or many many life times. But it will happen

You are definitely right that everything is impermanent. Only Consciousness is changeless.

[Someone here]

You misunderstood Buddha's teaching. 

"The root of suffering is unfulfilled desire "?  The thing is desire is never really fulfilled. Due to the simple fact of impermanence. It's never enough. A little ain't enough. a lot ain't enough. There will be never such thing as enough. Nothing finite will satisfy you because you are Infinite being. Only infinity can satisfy you. Which is nothing.