Why am I attracting narcissists?

[RendHeaven]

4 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

Having boundaries and selflessness are two different things. I've seen selfless people get shit on and that's because they never learned how to keep boundaries. 

These same "selfless people" you see "getting shit on" due to their lack of boundaries end up complaining for days and weeks and months and years about how they keep getting shit on.

Why? Because they're fucking selfish. They're not actually selfless. It's so obvious.

Listen, maybe selfless people without boundaries do exist (in the form of sages and saints). But these people never complain because they have real self-love.

Unless you're literally a saint with 50 years of cosmic contemplation under your belt, your best bet toward selflessness is to set firm personal boundaries.

Edited November 18, 2020 by RendHeaven

[Natasha]

5 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

@Natasha my mom was abusive. 

I'm not exactly demonizing narcissists. Just that I don't want them around me because they cause a lot of harm through their manipulation. 

Not everyone has to suffer trauma in order to be abused by narcissists..the narcissist who had abused me had also had toxic relationships with other women and when I befriended those women, they had no history of trauma. 

Narcissists destroy lives. It's just facts. They need to own it. And it's not overrated. In fact most women don't even realize that they are suffering narcissistic abuse because they are hardly aware of such a term.

More awareness in this aspect is necessary 

 

 

I agree. 

[Preety_India]

6 minutes ago, RendHeaven said:

Listen, maybe selfless people without boundaries do exist (in the form of sages and saints). But these people never complain because they have real self-love.

You're conflating two different things here. 

Being selfless towards someone is one thing.

Having self love is a totally different thing. 

These are two different parameters. 

Some people are not very good at self love because of past trauma or abuse and they can be very selfless people, they can do selfless acts. 

Also complaining about something is venting out. It's not selfish. If someone is hurt, let them complain. Calling them selfish is like telling a domestic violence victim that they should just shut up and not complain. 

Here I'm not bitching or whining. That can be considered selfish, I understand 

But asking for help and looking for perspectives on why certain patterns exist is called self introspection and opening up to people, that's absolutely nothing selfish about it 

 

[Gesundheit]

1 hour ago, Etherial Cat said:

Pavlovian would mean that you've been trained with a reward. 

Well, yes, at least for me. I remember when I was a child, my parents would reward me psychologically in order for me to desire women. They would point to a singer on TV and tell me that I am a good kid and that they will marry me with her. It's Pavlovian conditioning on the level of the psyche/self-esteem. That's when I first started desiring women. After that, and as I was growing up, the only thing that was attractive to me is the thoughts of me hugging girls and kissing them. I didn't know anything about sex at that point. And then slowly with time, since nipples were not supposed to be seen, I started developing a curiosity to see nipples. Then somehow I started developing a desire to see everything that's hidden by default; including breasts, butts and butt holes, and vaginas.

1 hour ago, Etherial Cat said:

A man's attraction towards them since to be pre-conditioning, like it's biological, I'd say.

No, nothing really biological about it. It's all psychological. I assume the same thing for women, but in reverse and in different ways. Otherwise, how do you explain homosexuality and bisexuality and all the different orientations, fetishes, and perversity?

1 hour ago, Etherial Cat said:

Tits and ass are a sign of fertility, like the waist to hip ratio. Its recognizing instinctively who's a good reproducer. 

Lol no. Obesity-phobia debunks this theory entirely. If fertility is truly the attractive thing about women, then fat women should be the hottest, or at least high on the rankings because:

Fat = estrogen | Estrogen = fertility

This theory is basically coming from the evolutionary perspective and it obviously is biased and somehow works like a self-fulfilling prophecy. When science ranks certain people higher, we automatically tend to think that they're more attractive.

Although, technically, at certain levels, high estrogen starts becoming antagonistic to fertility. So not all elevations in estrogen levels are indicators of fertility.

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Preety_India said:

They bring out my caring side more than other normal people. 

Bringing out those feminine caring instincts in me makes me produce oxytocin for them. I want to care for a person who needs my hug or affection. 

Narcissists tend to want my affection. So I tend to submit. 

I almost feel like a nurse who is helping a wounded soldier. 

 

YES! Very good. Now that's some progress. You are an enneagram type 2. Classic girly problem.

You sacrifice yourself too much for others to the point of not taking care of your needs enough. You need more self-care and self-love. Be more selfish.

[Preety_India]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

YES! Very good. Now that's some progress. You are an enneagram type 2. Classic girly problem.

Yep yep yep. 

[Preety_India]

4 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You sacrifice yourself too much for others to the point of not taking care of your needs enough. You need more self-care and self-love.

Yes I do. 

Does this mean that I need to get a bit more selfish and move towards the center like I showed in the diagram? 

How can I get to act more selfish? 

 

[Gesundheit]

@Preety_India

Do you have a role-model in your life (specifically female)? It can be very hard to learn how to create boundaries when your caregivers were absent or abusive, because they were supposed to be your role-models, and now as a result of their absence you don't know how to create boundaries, and as a result of abuse you hate being like them so you refuse to create boundaries. And it all happens subconsciously, so your emotions are not allowing you to create the proper boundaries.

A good inspiring role-model can totally solve this problem for you.

[Leo Gura]

@Preety_India Read the book: Thick Face, Black Heart.

That's what you're missing.

You need to learn to be more ruthless. Which of course you will refuse to do cause you are stuck in the care-bear paradigm.

[Barbara]

Don't put your well-being in other people's hands. Stop focusing so much on narcissistic or abusive people and focus on you! How you can elevate your vibe, be more confident, learn how to say no, and care for yourself first! The goal should be having such a powerful and strong energy that narcissists and psychos run away from you! Not you losing energy trying to keep them away. You rock girl! 

[Preety_India]

1 minute ago, Gesundheit said:

@Preety_India

Do you have a role-model in your life (specifically female)? It can be very hard to learn how to create boundaries when your caregivers were absent or abusive, because they were supposed to be your role-models, and now as a result of their absence you don't know how to create boundaries, and as a result of abuse you hate being like them so you refuse to create boundaries. And it all happens subconsciously, so your emotions are not allowing you to create the proper boundaries.

A good inspiring role-model can totally solve this problem for you.

 

You're right about all this. The only female role model in my life was my mother who was both absent and abusive. My father died when I was too young. My siblings left the family long ago. And they settled in the US although they are good with my extended family and I do contact them some times. But usually I'm alone. My only pet was murdered by a man who had jealousy with my dad. 

So I lived a whole amount of time alone and abandoned. That loneliness could also attract me to narcissists because a lot of narcissists live alone or secluded, they like to be the lone wolf, that loneliness in them I can really connect and empathize with. 

I feel like by taking away their loneliness I'm bringing happiness into their life and also healing the abandoned inner child that I was in my childhood. 

[Preety_India]

2 minutes ago, Barbara said:

Don't put your well-being in other people's hands. Stop focusing so much on narcissistic or abusive people and focus on you! How you can elevate your vibe, be more confident, learn how to say no, and care for yourself first! The goal should be having such a powerful and strong energy that narcissists and psychos run away from you! Not you losing energy trying to keep them away. You rock girl! 

Thank you so much for your words. That means a lot to me. 

[Rilles]

2 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

So I lived a whole amount of time alone and abandoned. That loneliness could also attract me to narcissists because a lot of narcissists live alone or secluded, they like to be the lone wolf, that loneliness in them I can really connect and empathize with. 

Or maybe THEY prey on you. Because they sense youre a push-over. 

Edited November 18, 2020 by Rilles

[Preety_India]

Just now, Rilles said:

Or maybe THEY prey on you. 

Yes yes yes. My vulnerability becomes a fodder or prey. 

Like Leo said that I need to become ruthless. But the problem is that becoming ruthless reminds me of my mom who was extremely ruthless and I had promised myself that I'll never be ruthless in my life 

So ruthlessness and selfishness became my shadow aspects because deep down anything that reminded me of selfishness had to be rejected. 

That's why it's so hard for me to become ruthless and find a way to be comfortable being ruthless. 

 

[Rilles]

4 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

Yes yes yes. My vulnerability becomes a fodder or prey. 

Like Leo said that I need to become ruthless. But the problem is that becoming ruthless reminds me of my mom who was extremely ruthless and I had promised myself that I'll never be ruthless in my life 

So ruthlessness and selfishness became my shadow aspects because deep down anything that reminded me of selfishness had to be rejected. 

That's why it's so hard for me to become ruthless and find a way to be comfortable being ruthless. 

 

Realizing that you dont really give a fuck about others when your ego likes to think you do is a good start.  Makes it easier to swallow the ruthless pill. I mean, you dont really care about your neighbour a block down the street do you? So what makes you think youre so empathatic and nice? Im not judging, this is just a way to work with the shadow. In essence were just survival machines, no different from the parents we hate. 

Edited November 18, 2020 by Rilles

[lmfao]

27 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Preety_India Thick Face, Black Heart.

I can vouch for this book, it's pretty good. I only read half of it but it's on my mind to re-read. 
---
I don't think this issue has to only be framed in terms of being nice vs not being nice. It's still about enforcing boundaries. But I think it can also be framed in terms of self-defence and effectiveness. The same way you defend yourself from a physical attack, you do the same to an emotional or psychological attack. 

You can be prepared to deal with the world whilst still being loving/trusting to it. Once you emanate the right energy of not being exploitable, you'll also get into less trouble since predators hunt for certain energy. 

Don't think you have to kill or repress a part of your authentic loving self to deal with psychos and narcs. Instead see it as trying to grow. Easier said than done ofc though. 

 

Edited November 18, 2020 by lmfao

[Preety_India]

2 minutes ago, Rilles said:

Realizing that you dont really give a fuck about others when your ego likes to think you do is a good start.  Makes it easier to swallow the ruthless pill. I mean, you dont really care about your neighbour a block down the street do you? So what makes you think youre so empathatic and nice? Im not judging, this is just a way to work with the shadow. In essence were just survival machines, no different from the parents we hate. 

I don't think like that. I don't have that ruthless bone in me. It's difficult to grow that, not entirely impossible but difficult. 

I've been soft with people all my life. Now I suddenly need to become hard. This won't be easy. It will be quite change of my personality

And changing a personality 180° is no easy job. 

I really lack selfishness. I have basic selfishness when it comes to survival. But around people I'm very fond and loving and throw myself to save them and completely ignore my own needs to the point of sacrifice. This is something I will have to change otherwise I will keep getting taken advantage of. I want this cycle to stop. 

Selflessness is good but only if practiced with caution. Being selfless around a pack of lions means death. 

Just like it's difficult for a narcissist to become an empath, it's equally difficult for an empath to start acting like a narcissist. These are two diametrically opposite personalities and that's why they are so sexually attracted to each other. They start feeding each other's differences to complement their personality defects. 

I lack ruthlessness and selfishness. I have had this problem when one of my friends was going to fall under a bus and I tried to save her putting my own life at risk by coming under the bus. So I'm no stranger to my own nature.. 

The problem is that I have realized after a long time that' its okay to be good and helpful but there should be some limit and I better not take a risk on my life.. 

Some narcissists have actually helped me like one narcissistic girl who was my friend and she was incredibly selfish with people and one day she mocked me for helping people and told me that I'll always end up suffering if I become too selfless. I denied her. She was actually right. 

The problem is that when you are raised in a way where you think that having empathy is a great idea, you become oblivious to its Grey areas. 

Now with time, I have understood that everything needs to be in balance. That's why I created that diagram that shows the center balance region which means anything in extreme is a problem, even kindness in its extreme condition will attract lot of problems. There are less problems if you are well rounded and balanced on all sides in life. 

I think balancing is also an act of shadow removal. The extreme ends shown in the spectrum of the diagram probably represent these shadows of character. 

When you are too selfish you will end up harming others. When you are too selfless you will end up harming yourself. Both are bad. But culture-wise we are taught that only one out of the two is harmful and that is selfishness. But in reality both are harmful equally. Being extremely kind is a bad strategy in real life. 

Practical life does not approve of such bookish values. So it's important to be kind and empathetic and selfless but within a healthy margin and in a reasonable manner. 

That's the conclusion I reached today. 

 

[lmfao]

@Preety_India Jordan Peterson has a very good lecture on agreeableness ; ) , a Big Five personality trait you're probably on the extreme end of 
 

I know you hate this guy but trust me some of his lectures are gold  ?

Edited November 18, 2020 by lmfao

[Preety_India]

@lmfao sorry but I don't like that Jordan guy. 

The only YouTuber I seriously follow is Leo Gura.

 

[Eren Eeager]

It all starts with recognition. You must start by recognizing the good feelings you have when you are around narcissists. Once recognized, those feeling now must be ripped of them being good. No they are not good, those feelings are not mature, you say to your self, and then let go of them. They come back and you ignore and let go of them more and more until you are free from the addiction of those feelings.  You must develop the muscle to let go. You will need it a lot in your life. To deal with obsessive thoughts and addictive feelings. A male may get addicted to porn, a female may get addicted to many other emotional things. But in the end they are both addictions and both cause a lot of suffering.