Alternatives to drugs or therapy for anxiety?

[Yarco]

I feel like it's time to admit to myself that I've got pretty crippling and life-altering anxiety. I'm constantly worrying about things and considering the worst case scenario for everything. Anxiety impacts most things that I do in a day and how I do them.

Possibly also got some mild depression... although it's more like I go through phases where I have no energy and motivation for months, and other times I have lots of it. But it doesn't feel manic/depressive enough to be bipolar.

Anyway my partner has been pushing me for a while to either see my family doctor for medication or get someone to talk to.

Problem is that my anxiety is so bad that it's like an endless feedback loop. Maybe I should talk to someone about my anxiety to fix it, but I'm already almost too anxious to leave the house or drive, or talk to someone about my feelings.

RE: medication - I don't want all the potential side-effects, or changing my brain in a way that makes me feel not like "myself" any more, or just feeling dull/numb all the time.

RE: therapy - I've heard too many people say that they had to go through multiple counsellors or therapists to find the right fit. I don't want to potentially go through 5 therapists and years of my time repeating my problems over and over until I find one who can understand me and help. I feel like if I just had the right questions to ask myself, I could introspect and work through it on my own.

I've tried working through a self-help CBT website, I think it was from the NHS. But it got too boring and too much theoretical vs practical so I gave up. Also tried moodgym (similar free program out of Australia) with minimal insights and results.

Does anyone have any kind of self-help resources for anxiety? Maybe some kind of introspection exercises, meditation, or whatever?

On most topics I seem to do best with online courses. So some kind of structured video lessons with workbooks or something would be ideal I think.

I get a solid amount of sleep. Good diet / exercise seems to help my mood temporarily but then it gets worse again. I don't drink, smoke, or do drugs. I have a good and fairly easy life, no major childhood traumas or issues.

I was hoping that I could just put it off and seek enlightenment and that would fix all my anxiety/depression issues. But at this point it doesn't seem very practical and like I'm putting myself through more unnecessary suffering in the short-term. And the anxiety is bad enough that it might actually be a roadblock to enlightenment.

Edited November 16, 2020 by Yarco

[Average Investor]

I would recommend reading the sedona method and working through the practices. There is even a specific chapter in the book that should helo you with this. If you have established enough of a foundation around your health and a solid mediation practice first. It sounds like you have situated most of the food and stuff. If you are taking any sort of stimulants like caffeine you should consider cutting that out. 

I could not say exactly what I did to remove most of my anxiety. However, if you have a reoccurring theme around what you are anxious about you might be able to make some change there too. Of course maximizing your health can help, but it could even be a spiritual issue as well. I would recommend doing blood work and seeing if you have anything low as well.

Also, if you can get to a point where you can phrase it like "remember when I had anxiety". The actual process of identifying with some sort of issue seems to cause it a good portion of the problem. You would want your partner to be aware of this too. 

[Average Investor]

@Yarco Also, I am curious if you have any mold possibly in your room? It can be possible you are not seeing it as well. Could be some in the car or a place you are at often. I have seen a lot of stuff suggesting this can be an issue. Could try a nice hepa filter in the room you sleep. 

Do you work around any chemicals or anything like that? Work on replacing all of your chemicals in the house with the "think dirty" app if it works where you are. Or just try to go towards as much natural cleaners and products as you can.

 

Also, I would recommend @Michael569 in this discussion. 

[DianaFr]

Have you been able to identify the cause of your anxiety? It’s possible it’s a symptom of a deeper problem, and if that’s the case, fighting anxiety would be just like cutting off the branches of a tree when what you need to do is go to the root to get rid of the thing.

I don’t have any good online resources in mind. I find CBT very useful, though, but in my experience it works best when one has addressed the deeper issue and then uses CBT to install positive thinking and behaving habits on top of a positive foundation. Fixing anxiety is somewhat similar to fixing the indicator light on your car panel telling you that your about to run out of gas. You can disable the alarm system of your car not to hear it beep and not to get annoyed by it but if you do it you have no way to tell when your car needs maintenance.

I can share what was helpful for me. I used to have severe anxiety, up to the point I couldn’t leave my home, do my job, eat in public, pay for my groceries or do many more things that normal people do every day without even thinking. I was really struggling and I felt miserable. The most important shift that needed to happen for me was how I viewed my anxiety. I used to think there was something very wrong with me and that I responded to situations absolutely inadequately. It was when I started to view my anxiety as a completely adequate response when things started to change for the positive. Given all my past experiences and conditionings, it would be abnormal and completely inadequate to respond normally under those circumstances, for anyone. So my anxiety was a very correct and point on reflection of what was going on deep down. I completely changed the way I treated myself. I became compassionate and very understanding of my weirdness and irrational fears, and I gradually changed my life in accordance with the needs of that anxious and crippled aspect of me. I gave myself promise to never ever abandon myself, no matter how “unacceptable” or “wrong” parts of me would be. And it worked! Of course, it’s not a miracle cure but it was a significant turning point for me to finally accept myself like no one had accepted me before.

If you feel my story somewhat resonates with you, I wholeheartedly suggest you ask yourself this one question. If your anxiety was a completely correct and adequate response, what would it tell you about yourself?

[tsuki]

8 hours ago, Yarco said:

RE: therapy - I've heard too many people say that they had to go through multiple counsellors or therapists to find the right fit. I don't want to potentially go through 5 therapists and years of my time repeating my problems over and over until I find one who can understand me and help. I feel like if I just had the right questions to ask myself, I could introspect and work through it on my own.

The part about finding the right therapist is true and I have been very fortunate to find one. We had some misunderstandings and fell into a big trap, but were able to navigate out of it thanks to a life crysis she helped me through. Thanks to covid lockdowns, more and more therapists will be open to conducting sessions via skype if you are too anxious to go in person. This will potentially be a safe way to do a vibe check, but I will tell you outright that meeting in person is much more powerful and preferred. A good therapist will not only listen to what you are saying, but also connect with you emotionally and read your body language to understand you better. This is very difficult over skype.

If you want some pointers about finding a good therapist, then the most important characteristic is that he or she will care deeply about you and about who you are. When making this judgement, it is not all that important what they say. What is important is how they listen. Are they really taking in what you are saying and whether or not they are trying to block, or "trim" you. First few sessions are the most important here, there should be a lot of listening, conscious attention and gathering information on their part. Helping you get comfortable and safe is also a good sign. Without the ability to listen on the therapists' part, therapy is impossible. Ideally, you should feel safe to say anything, even the stuff that you have difficulty admitting to your parents, partners, or yourself.

What is also important is to look for posturing and defensiveness on their part. Even when you disagree, they should not defend their position like their life depends on it. Them challenging you to take a perspective is fine in later stages of therapy, but first few sessions are about getting to know you.

Having read all this, it is also important to know that therapy is not a game of judgement and if you are too focused on finding the right therapist, then you will miss the therapy itself. First and foremost, you are getting there to open up, not to find the right person. If you focus too much on what I told you, then you will be too defensive. I would advise you to tell the therapist outright that you feel like you have to find the right one and that you have been informed on how to do it. You can then talk about your expectations and needs.

8 hours ago, Yarco said:

RE: medication - I don't want all the potential side-effects, or changing my brain in a way that makes me feel not like "myself" any more, or just feeling dull/numb all the time.

My wife is using SSRI antidepressants for half a year and our experience has been largely positive. The first two weeks were an adjustment period where she experienced mood swings, but after that she became much more stable overall. Prior to that, she was having lots of mini-panic attacks regarding her health as well as lots of negative self-talk and they subsided to a large extent. Right now she's approaching the moment where she's supposed to get off them and she's experiencing a different set of side-effects. I suspect that her body knows that meds are not needed anymore and will get better once she's off. She was saying that she was feeling more like herself when she first started taking them and side-effects wore off. Once you start taking meds, DO NOT STOP TAKING THEM ON YOUR OWN ACCORD, EVEN IF YOU HAVE A HEALTH-RELATED PANIC ATTACK. ALWAYS CONTACT YOUR DOCTOR FIRST AND ASK HOW TO DO IT AND WHETHER YOU SHOULD DO IT. This is no joke, you can fuck yourself up really badly otherwise. Like, fucked up for life badly, so take this seriously. I will not tell you what may happen to not freak you out, neither will doctors, but do not underestimate this. Once you decide to take them, do not skip doses and take them exactly as prescribed.

It is important to note here that you will have to find the right doctor that knows what he's doing. We knew that it's the right person because he started the treatment after having a long discussion about the causes of her depression that was informed by the results of her psychotherapy. He also politely asked me to leave the room and spoke to my wife directly. A lot of characteristics of a good psychiatrist will be similar to psychologists that I described above. I suggest that you only go to psychiatrist if psychotherapy has little effect and the psychologist advises it. This is how it happened for my wife. You should also feel safe to call your psychiatrist when you feel like it. You have to feel that you are being taken care of and their openness is very important here.

Edited November 16, 2020 by tsuki

[kag101]

8 hours ago, Yarco said:

I feel like if I just had the right questions to ask myself, I could introspect and work through it on my own.

Stop bullshitting yourself. 

 

It took me a while to find a good psychotherapist. Here are three tips for finding a good one:  Do not be cheap, do some research/ask for recommendations, and avoid alternative/hollistic therapists. 

When you finally find one that's really good, it pays off. I feel like when I go to my therapist it's as if I'm calibrating myself through her. 

I also go to a psychiatrist. I take a special kind of antidepressant that basically don't theoretically work on anxiety. But in my case, I've found that my pathological anxiety was caused by my depression. As soon as the depression got stabilized, the anxiety levels also dropped. 

Now, I am working on taming my "normal" anxiety (which is pretty high). The doctor also prescribed me Xanax in case I really need it. Fortunately, it's been more than 6 months that he did it, and I never had to use that med. 

One thing that helps me besides therapy is Tai Chi.  

 

@tsuki Great points!! ??? And I'm glad that you're wife is doing better.  

 

Edited November 16, 2020 by kag101

[PurpleTree]

26 minutes ago, kag101 said:

I also go to a psychiatrist. I take a special kind of antidepressant that basically don't theoretically work on anxiety. But in my case, I've found that my pathological anxiety was caused by my depression. As soon as the depression got stabilized, the anxiety levels also dropped. 

So since i've seen you talk about it in another topic too, can you tell me which class of anti depressant you're taking?

Also are you planning to stay on it?

[integral]

@Yarco BODYBUILDING, get in the gym and build up your body, a athletic body and the strong body mind connection that comes with it is resilient to stress. 

Build Muscle. Connect with your body.

Each heavy weight exercise is a meditation that quickly rewires the brain, its a very powerful grounding meditation practice. 

Practice deeply relaxing during each exercise. 

Do it now: Get on the floor in push up position, close your eyes and expand your awareness until it takes up your entire body and the contact point of your feet and hands, relax your body like your going to fall sleep, then do the push ups while feeling and relaxing every muscle fiber, notice the flood of blood that enters into the muscle. Deep relaxation push ups. 

It is possible that you will underestimate what was said. I can assure you this is the first step to getting out of your head. As you keep practicing these states will become strong and strong until it is your new default.  

Exercise stimulates bdnf that rewires the brain faster then anything else. Do meditations that involve exercise for the fastest results. 

Edited November 16, 2020 by integral

[Nahm]

Thoughts about yourself that don’t resonate but are continued nonetheless in innocence and ignore-ance are like thoughts about a gorilla in your house when there isn’t one. Experientially, there are degrees of this. The thought is what doesn’t resonate, not the content, just as there is no gorilla in your house. To veil this simple fact, stories of my anxiety are weaved, just like a story of ‘my gorilla’. Typically therapy focuses only on the content of the thought story which perpetuates & reinforces the idea of a separate self, and rather than simply liberating one of the anxiety. (Not trying to ‘bash’ any therapists or therapies. One who doesn’t know who they really are is just allegedly doing their best, unknowingly supporting the ‘problem’, keeping the carousel of rumination spinning.)