Sadhguru saying "Drugs will lead to America's Downfall"

[Gesundheit]

You're all (including Sadhguru) overestimating spirituality like it's the ultimate truth. But there is a higher force that governs spirituality and its relationship with evolution. This higher force does not care about anything. Maybe Sadhguru is more connected to that force than Leo. Maybe it's the other way around Idk. What it logically looks like is that psychedelics should be the future, but who knows? Really. If you think about it, it does make sense on some level that what Sadhguru is saying can be true. I don't see why it can't. I guess it's just too complicated for me to understand.

[Tanz]

On 11/10/2020 at 0:07 PM, Leo Gura said:

Firstly, on a strictly practical level, the war on drugs has been an abysmal racist failure. Countries which decriminalize drugs, even the worst drugs like meth and heroin, end up doing better, having less death, violence, and addiction. This has been scientifically measured.

Secondly, very very very few people will ever be able to develop the intoxication factory that Sadhguru is talking about. Less than 1% of the population will do it. Less than 1% of the population will awaken. For the other 99%, psychedelics are now scientifically proven to provide many benefits such a reducing depression, PTSD, social anxiety, fear of death, addiction recovery, anger reduction, healing childhood trauma, etc. This very important stuff strictly from a medical, social, and political perspective.

Thirdly, psychedelics open the doorway to mystical experience. Most people don't even believe mysticism is real. So they will never discover it through Sadhguru's methods. Psychedelics offer a way to access what Sadhguru is teaching in a more direct, scientific way.

Fourthly, you will never naturally reach the level of consciousness possible via psychedelics using Sadhguru's methods. Never.

Fifthly, of course coke and meth should be distinguished from psychedelics. To talk about these in the same conversation is absurd. We should treat coke and meth differently in that we should help people get off them and onto psychedelics instead. But total decriminalization is the way to go for all drugs. We have tried 50 years of prohibition and it's failed spectacularly.

Sixthly, once you get your hands on the right psychedelics, you will never need to listen to Sadhguru or any guru again. Psychedelics are a far better guru than a human could ever be. The only reason human gurus exist is because the psychedelic guru has been criminalized and demonized. Psychedelics serve an important function in deconstructing the spiritual and religion cults which inevitably arise around gurus. Once Sadhguru is dead, his organization will turn into just another cult religion. And his followers will become devils. Psychedelics are an antidote to that.

Sadhguru sounds wise here, but he's actually being dumb, impractical, and misleading his followers.

@Leo Gura I agree with all your points but what do you think about the corporatization and the greed that may happen if psychedelics were legalized?   

 

[ajai]

On 10/11/2020 at 0:27 PM, Lyubov said:

 He grew up in India where this stuff is super illegal and unheard of by his generation. 

 

Quote

Before 1985, cannabis was legal in India
The Narcotic Drugs and Psychotropic Substances Act (NDPS), 1985, was enacted to curb the usage and dealing of narcotic drugs and psychotropic substances. Until 1985, all cannabis derivatives – marijuana (grass or ganja),hashish (charas) and bhaang – were legally sold in India. For 25 years, India withstood American pressure to keep marijuana legal, after the US began to campaign for a worldwide law against all drugs, hard and soft, following the adoption of the Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs in 1961. Given that ganja, charas and bhaang were a way of life in India, this met with opposition. But by the early ’80s, American society was grappling with drug problems, and opinion – and pressure – had hardened. In 1985, the government buckled and enacted the NDPS Act.

For more information:

https://m.timesofindia.com/life-style/spotlight/cannabis-is-no-more-dangerous-than-alcohol-or-tobacco/amp_articleshow/78578539.cms

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Tanz said:

@Leo Gura I agree with all your points but what do you think about the corporatization and the greed that may happen if psychedelics were legalized?  

I don't think it's a big deal.

Once they are legalized you can grow them in your home like with weed.

And 99.9% pure research chemicals would be worth the price, it's not like stuff is cheap on the black market.

[AtheisticNonduality]

@Leo Gura Sadhguru is so advanced he thinks he doesn't need them. I think I saw he has this thing where he manipulates the four classical archetypal elements in the four cardinal directions and the fifth element in the sky every sunset and sunrise or something like that. So, either he's actually read some Western esotericism or he's so spiritually advanced he stumbled upon the LBRP himself.

[Leo Gura]

Which is why I keep telling you, you ain't Sadhguru.

This is the danger of looking up to gurus. You don't have their hardware.

[Marten]

I fully agree with Leo here. I see there's a lot of fear and skepticism against psychedelics. Check yourselves, where do these beliefs really come from? How much indoctrination have we gotten from gurus (esp from stage blue cultures), from society, school, culture, parents and science. We are so brainwashed and scared. Close minded. It is completely understandable considering what we have been through. But like Leo keeps saying, it is about time to grow up. A revolution is happening whether you like it or not. Whether your ego is on board or not. TEST these things for yourself. Perhaps you haven't found the right plant/ substance for you yet. Perhaps you haven't learned how to use it properly yet. Vaping techniques, sets and settings etc etc takes a lot of practice to get right FOR YOU. We are all different. Once you get a hundred trips into this things start clicking like magic. Miracles happen all the time. Unbelivable. You drop ego and trying to know and just fall backwards into it - being God - which you always were. Totally free. Go create the life of your dreams! 

Psychedelics have been by far the greatest tool for me. It's like a years progress in a few weeks of focused dilligent work. Words are not enough to describe what can be done. YOU ARE COMPLETELY LIMITLESS. You have to see it for yourself. Don't be afraid, just take all necessary precautions. It is all Love.

[Avidya]

16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You can go to the gym and lift weights, but you will never match a professional bodybuilder like Arnold.

No one can match Arnold because he was born specifically for that role.

I acknowledge that we can never fit into a role, that we were not designed/"born" for. Whether it'll be weightlifting or mastering spiritual metaphysics. 

However, the essence of self-actualisation is to fully realise and transcend oneself into one's unique role. The set-point of the experience, as you know ofc, is to know that one is god experientially. 

So each individual soul has its own ways and paths of knowing itself experientially, which was designed for it. This is commonly referred to as "Soul blueprint". 

So as each soul has its ready intelligence for knowing itself experientially, but through different pathways, why shouldn't everyone be able to raise their baseline consciousness given that they follow their own blueprint. Moreover, my belief is that each individual through epi-genetics can harness "the potential" that already exists in that DNA, therefore no need to "edit" genes.

It's like giving the one who goes to the gym a bunch of mental and physical steroids with no side effects or backlash. I bet sure that he would match Arnold at that point.

Another question, what do you imagine(or know) happens with a person, that raise their baseline consciousness x 1000? What are the parameters of distinction?

*This is my own exploration of the subject, and my direct knowingness of it is limited, although I've had some insights along the way.

[Michal__]

21 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

That's possible, but all that is still very limited.

You can go to the gym and lift weights, but you will never match a professional bodybuilder like Arnold.

No one can match Arnold because he was born specifically for that role.

Still anybody can get further with meditation than most meditators get, just like with lifting - everyone can bench 315 lbs within a few years but not everyone does.

Most people don't study what they want to get good at nearly enough.

[AtheisticNonduality]

17 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Which is why I keep telling you, you ain't Sadhguru. You don't have their hardware.

I bet you don't. 

[Nahm]

That higher force loves you more than can be believed, but, nonetheless, you’re right.

[Psychventure]

@Leo Gura @Leo Gura sadhguru told he had done intense tapas for his past 3 lifetimes. He is an ordinary human. He reached this state with meditation. There is nothing you can't achieve with persistent sadhana. 

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Psychventure said:

@Leo Gura @Leo Gura sadhguru told he had done intense tapas for his past 3 lifetimes. He is an ordinary human. He reached this state with meditation. There is nothing you can't achieve with persistent sadhana. 

We're kinda limited to one lifetime here in a way...

[Carl-Richard]

On 10.11.2020 at 1:14 PM, Leo Gura said:

Stop assuming that other humans are like you. Their consciousness can be totally different than yours.

Just based on the changes in consciousness I've had sober and the different nuances and flavors that correlates with different emotional/psychological/physical states, the huge diversity of experience that could potentially exist just blows my mind to pieces. We don't even have to talk about these extreme states of consciousness; just normal states of consciousness and the diversity that exists there is enough to make your head go around. I mean, the difference between how you experienced the world 10 years ago and now is extremely different in itself. Now imagine that you're given a completely new body, a new mind, and you've have also lived another lifetime ?

Edited November 14, 2020 by Carl-Richard

[Chi_]

Just gonna add to this.

 

Sadhguru really seems to give different answers according to his audience. In the last interview with Logan Paul, he said it's okay to try a Psychedelic once and realize that you can attain such levels of consciousness and then work on it by yourself without the substance. The video that OP referred to in this thread is from his Darshan where he has the biggest audience from all over the world (specially India), so it makes sense why he uses his words carefully. I'm saying this because in his "Mystics Musings" book, he mentions that taking such substances under a live Guru can make enormous spiritual progress.

How I see it is like this. If you say one sentence to a million people, each of them will interpret it differently depending on their experiences and level of consciousness. So you have to mold your words in a way that will cause the least harm and maximum impact. He says that he's on a certain mission to touch every human being on the planet. So, given the current societies in the world, he probably sees it wise to speak "against" Psychedelics when talking to millions of people at once in order for his mission to succeed and make the biggest impact. But it seems in close quarters he is more open about it because it will cause less harm and might be even beneficial to that specific audience.

Edited November 14, 2020 by Chi_

[Chi_]

Psychedelics, meditation and yoga are all tools. 

Meditation and yoga have been tested and made successful results for over ten thousand years and have created thousands of enlightened beings.

Psychedelics on the other hand have been tested much much less compared to how much meditation and yoga have been. That's why I respect Leo and others like him who are really pioneers in this field. Maybe it's more effective, maybe it's not. Leo is also still on his journey.

So I think it comes down to if you want to be a pioneer as well or do the methods that already made successful results. But most importantly, someone had to be a pioneer for meditation and yoga thousands of years ago. If it wasn't for them, who knows where humanity would be today. Same goes for Psychedelics.

[DreamScape]

@Leo Gura Leo, id have to agree, but to me awakening is different for everyone because of different consciousness structures. For example, yours is a masculine, mind oriented awakening, so yours will be way different and will have different abilities/attributes based on the way your consciousness works already. In a sense, were all gifted, just in different dimensions of consciousness. For some people spirituality could be a very sexual, creative and tantric act, and that could be their focus throughout their lifetime, or one could be very grounded, earthly, and thats their focus. if we look at spirituality instead of attaining enlightenment and put the focus on awakening our multidimensional nature, this could be recognized more. Im sure you've noticed this within your very logical and conceptual oriented mind. Also I wouldn't put the better/worse labels on it.

[Dilusuality]

Yes, they will lead to the downfall...of America's ego and overly gross disease of materialistic lust.

I wonder if the war on drugs is a by-product America's gross collective conscious ego seeing this as a threat.  I wonder if this is why its such a struggle. The Truth can hurt, but ultimately heal. I wish it'd happen sooner than later.

[PurpleTree]

1 hour ago, Chi_ said:

Psychedelics on the other hand have been tested much much less compared to how much meditation and yoga have been. That's why I respect Leo and others like him who are really pioneers in this field. Maybe it's more effective, maybe it's not. Leo is also still on his journey.

They've also been around for thousands maybe ten-thousands of years though

 

 

Sadhguru has been talking some silly stuff lately

[Moksha]

The 60s weren't ready for psychedelics. The 20s are even less ready, with our hyperpolarization. Individuals can be ready in any age. They can also be unready.