Simulation Theory Debunked?

[AtheisticNonduality]

Leo, you said in your recent video you'd debunked simulation, and I do remember watching your old video on that. However, I don't think your argument is sufficient, and the debunking is incomplete. Obviously, consciousness is the only thing that exists and all worlds are conceptual imaginations. But the brain still makes consciousness in the context of the world. And a computer could still make consciousness in the context of the world. So this is weird.

[Ponder]

Experience is direct. There can’t be anything behind the scenes creating consciousness because consciousness is literally God/formlessness. For us to be in a simulation implies that there’s separation between the simulated “reality” and our “reality,” but no such separation does or can exist. 
 

The idea of a simulation also is dependent on the belief in causality. But, once again, no formed thing causes anything else — that’s a materialistic fantasy. After all, if reality is one, there can’t be some form causing another form. 
 

Don’t think I explained that very well but whatever. It’s just words anyway at the end of the day. 

[AtheisticNonduality]

Ok then, there is no difference between a bat eating fruit and a brain flying with polar bear wings because everything is one. I think the best argument to debunk it in the context of the physical world we live in is that you could not run Minecraft in Minecraft, and you could not run real life in real life. Yet, couldn't you be a brain in a vat somewhere in the context of the creation? I suppose Occam's Razor is the best solution here.

[AtheisticNonduality]

I guess you must be able to tell the difference between machine and biology when it comes to brain in a vat. These thought experiments are annoying.

[AtheisticNonduality]

And also there's no evidence for it. My experience could be generated by monkey shitting, but I doubt it.

[Leo Gura]

59 minutes ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

Leo, you said in your recent video you'd debunked simulation, and I do remember watching your old video on that. However, I don't think your argument is sufficient, and the debunking is incomplete.

It seems insufficient and incomplete to you because you're not conscious of what consciousness is. And no one can ever fix that for you.

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Obviously, consciousness is the only thing that exists and all worlds are conceptual imaginations.

You parrot those words, but you are not directly conscious of what they mean.

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But the brain still makes consciousness in the context of the world.

No it doesn't.

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And a computer could still make consciousness in the context of the world.

No it couldn't. A computer is made out of consciousness.

Nothing makes consciousness.

All simulations are consciousness. But consciousness is not a simulation.

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

My experience could be generated by monkey shitting, but I doubt it.

No it couldn't. You're just engaging in fantasy.

Experience cannot have any cause at all.

[AtheisticNonduality]

48 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

No it couldn't. You're just engaging in fantasy.

Experience cannot have any cause at all.

Saying that I'm engaging in fantasy proves my point, that for me and the rest of the people in the world there is a fictional fantastical dreamworld where things happen and we live. Obviously, this would not exist if I decided to abandon my body.

Yeah, simulation theory is bullshit, but not for metaphysical reasons. You have practical videos on politics on whatnot. Do you want to shoot a video on why politics is bullshit since people and countries aren't real? Anyway, I basically answered my own questions here.

[Leo Gura]

24 minutes ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

Do you want to shoot a video on why politics is bullshit since people and countries aren't real?

You are conflating different discussions and levels of reality.

When I talk about politics I am talking within a relative domain of human survival.

When I talk about simulation theory I am talking about metaphysical issues which tap into the absolute domain.

[Member]

I wouldn't call it a computer but there is a Source code because existence is information, however the code doesn't define your entire existence like in a simulation or predetermined Universe. This code is infinite unbounded potential that you are using all the time but it feels like it defines you because your level of consciousness is low. You need to raise above all these concepts to run the simulation yourself. Forget about aliens with advanced computers, that won't get you anywhere.

[AtheisticNonduality]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You are conflating different discussions and levels of reality.

When I talk about politics I am talking within a relative domain of human survival.

When I talk about simulation theory I am talking about metaphysical issues which tap into the absolute domain.

Nope, the one thing occultism and magick will teach you is that there IS multiple levels of reality. You're just not currently aware of them. And the fact of the matter is that there's no difference ontologically between having an image of people and survival in your head and the idea that these people are subject to the rules of a simulation the same way they could be subject to neurology or neurochemistry. They are both equally conceptual and subject to logic.

[Osaid]

I can kind of see your point here, I had similar thoughts

I think Leo was specifically referring to the claim "reality is a simulation". Even within a simulation it would still just be consciousness. So, at the existential level, it is never true.

At the relative level, maybe. It could be possible that consciousness imagined a computer which then created more conscious experiences. But, in the end, this is all still relative to some story about computers and simulations. It still boils down to just consciousness imagining all of that.

 

[Someone here]

19 hours ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

 I think the best argument to debunk it in the context of the physical world we live in is that you could not run Minecraft in Minecraft, and you could not run real life in real life. Yet, couldn't you be a brain in a vat somewhere in the context of the creation? I 

That's right. But as Leo said you are just pushing the ground of reality one step down. You didn't solve anything. If there is a computer behind the scenes running real life.. What is running the computer?.. Computers all the way down?  Why can't just real life run itself then?  

[AlphaAbundance]

@AtheisticNonduality