Is wanting to understand the Truth just an ego-desire?

[Leo Gura]

@Member You gotta become independent. Stop caring about normal. Normal is shite.

You gotta really develop a strong trust in yourself without pinging off the approval of others.

[Member]

@Leo Gura I guess that's what meditation is good for because the closer you get to the Truth the more mindfucked you will get. Maybe anxiety is a normal reaction when the mind is programmed to think in clichés. But anyway, for me the Truth has been revealed in mysterious ways... and now that I'm connecting the dots, it is weird as fuck.

[Moksha]

2 hours ago, mandyjw said:

Hey Leo, this snake in the apple tree told me that this apple would not make me die, and that I'd be like God, knowing good and evil if I ate it. Want a bite? 

The promise of free truth was the original lie. Eve wanted to know good and evil, without realizing that knowledge would bring death.

The pursuit of anything: truth, happiness, even love, results in death. There is always a price to be paid.

All of these are different names for the same thing. Truth is Happiness is Love.

The price is always the same: Death of the illusionary self.

Enlightenment collapses into a singularity, like everything else.

Edited November 10, 2020 by Moksha

[Member]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

You gotta really develop a strong trust in yourself without pinging off the approval of others.

Ok, thank you ?

As for the OP's question, I think that not wanting to understand the Truth is an ego desire because it stems from being too comfortable with lies.

Not knowing lies is better than not knowing the Truth. The last is self-deception.

[mandyjw]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I would be more tempted by some BBQ ribs

Sigh... men. 

[mandyjw]

1 hour ago, Moksha said:

The promise of free truth was the original lie. Eve wanted to know good and evil, without realizing that knowledge would bring death.

 

No, it didn't bring death. It couldn't. There's no death, there never was death. Believe (belly of eve) in death or not, it doesn't make it actual. The snake was right. The snake never spoke a lie. 

Some asshole planted a tree in the garden that he told people they couldn't touch. 

But really I'm not blaming God but, the story speaks of the origins of blame and shame, which is only us. 

[Member]

The Tree of the Knowledge and the Tree of Life are one and the same thing

Surely the serpent will bite without enchantment.

[mandyjw]

25 minutes ago, Member said:

The Tree of the Knowledge and the Tree of Life are one and the same thing

Surely the serpent will bite without enchantment.

The snake symbolizes healing and kundalini awakening. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caduceus_as_a_symbol_of_medicine

I don't know but I suspect woman was the first to have a kundalini awakening. Women are still sitting around waiting for men's frontal lobes to mature. In the meantime there are more intellectually stimulating conversations to be had with snakes. 

[Moksha]

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

No, it didn't bring death. It couldn't. There's no death, there never was death. Believe (belly of eve) in death or not, it doesn't make it actual. The snake was right. The snake never spoke a lie. 

The snake was the most subtle beast in the garden. The best lies are founded in truth. The lie was not that there is no spiritual death, but that Eve and Adam would live in the garden forever.

Classic ego move: Swapping what seems to be changeless for what actually is changeless.

[Member]

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

The snake symbolizes healing and kundalini awakening. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caduceus_as_a_symbol_of_medicine

I don't know but I suspect woman was the first to have a kundalini awakening. Women are still sitting around waiting for men's frontal lobes to mature. In the meantime there are more intellectually stimulating conversations to be had with snakes. 

Not sure if the serpent from the Bible had anything to do with kundalini, though Kabbalah has some interesting interpretations on the tree of Life. Many years ago, I have found a book about it and the topic was truly fascinating. Fuck, sometimes I wish I wouldn't be so lazy and start studying more about these topics... but in a way I'm afraid to go too deep. I don't know about you guys, but each time I'm researching about these topics, weird things start to happen. So better stay safe than sorry (at least for the moment)

Edited November 10, 2020 by Member

[mandyjw]

8 minutes ago, Moksha said:

The snake was the most subtle beast in the garden. The best lies are founded in truth. The lie was not that there is no spiritual death, but that Eve and Adam would live in the garden forever.

Classic ego move: Swapping what seems to be changeless for what actually is changeless.

You could say the snake's speech was the first thought. You can say the snake is symbolized by the human spine. The thing about stories is that they are open for anyone's interpretation. 

7 minutes ago, Member said:

 I don't know about you guys, but each time I'm researching about these topics, weird things start to happen. So better stay safe than sorry

Spend time in nature with actual trees rather than reading about them then. Nature has a way of the being both the most boring, calming, mothering and the most fascinating teacher ever. 

fascinate (v.)

1590s, "bewitch, enchant," from French fasciner (14c.), from Latin fascinatus, past participle of fascinare "bewitch, enchant, fascinate," from fascinus "a charm, enchantment, spell, witchcraft," which is of uncertain origin. Earliest used of witches and of serpents, who were said to be able to cast a spell by a look that rendered one unable to move or resist. Sense of "delight, attract and hold the attention of" is first recorded ..1815. https://www.etymonline.com/word/fascinate

Edited November 10, 2020 by mandyjw

[The0Self]

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

I don't know but I suspect woman was the first to have a kundalini awakening. Women are still sitting around waiting for men's frontal lobes to mature. In the meantime there are more intellectually stimulating conversations to be had with snakes.

Probably... In all seriousness though I've noticed almost no distinction between men and women in actual maturity. Sure, women are far more apparently mature at any given age, but they're also just as ego-driven as any man. This is coming from an abundant perspective -- I haven't felt "slighted" by anyone in probably half a decade. There's just what seems to happen, and I have no fucking clue how to describe it. The man/woman dichotomy is a funny thing, isn't it? 

[Moksha]

9 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

You could say the snake's speech was the first thought. You can say the snake is symbolized by the human spine. The thing about stories is that they are open for anyone's interpretation.

Yes  The best stories open the most doors.

[mandyjw]

Just now, The0Self said:

Probably... In all seriousness though I've noticed almost no distinction between men and women in actual maturity. Sure, women are far more apparently mature at any given age, but they're also just as ego-driven as any man. This is coming from an abundant perspective -- I haven't felt "slighted" by anyone in probably half a decade. There's just what seems to happen, and I have no fucking clue how to describe it. The man/woman dichotomy is a funny thing, isn't it? 

Yeah, I admit it's stupid. Ken and Barbie are both just made of the same plastic. But you have to have a good imagination to keep that sexual tension alive. 

My obsession with the garden of Eden myth probably has something to do with my Christian upbringing, where the psychology of blame and fear of seduction by women is hard to ignore. It's not just religion though, you can also find plenty of it in the dating section of this forum for example. There is an element of the feminine and the feminine mystic side of things (the Occult actually celebrates a lot of it) that is demonized in Christianity, and sadly I often see the same thing going on throughout the more "woke" spiritual community to some degree. 

Also going into the deep metaphysics or whatever of spirituality, it is common for women to have very different awakenings than men, and to have different problems/openings with different chakras. They can open in reverse, supposedly. Many of the traditions still are aimed at men. Spirituality is a field where there should be very strong gender equality, but there isn't, nearly all the "superstars" of spirituality are male because we project the traits we think are superior onto spiritual teachers. Not sure if this comes from the fact that emotions are demonized at some stage of the path or what exactly. 

Again, it's all just dualities at play. If there no form or duality, we're just a molten puddle of plastic, not Barbie and Ken. It's just not as much fun.  But yes, it's funny. 

[The0Self]

@mandyjw

Men try to get.

Women try to be.

They both try though, and that's the human condition.

(Obviously that's just a story; just rings true to me in a sense.)

Edited November 10, 2020 by The0Self

[Moksha]

Consciousness has no gender. Maybe boring, but at the end of the day (which is always), there is no gender. Aren't puppets fun though?

[The0Self]

5 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Consciousness has no gender. Maybe boring, but at the end of the day (which is always), there is no gender. Aren't puppets fun though?

You could also say there is no consciousness. At least, no consciousness as anyone knows it. There's only _______. Emptiness; unconditional love; nondual awareness (appearance); etc. There's only is, which is and is not.

[mandyjw]

7 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Consciousness has no gender. Maybe boring, but at the end of the day (which is always), there is no gender. Aren't puppets fun though?

The real puppet is the mind. The mind isn't that much fun really, but mind fucks are. 

[Moksha]

3 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

The real puppet is the mind. The mind isn't that much fun really, but mind fucks are. 

Isn't that the purpose of the antagonist in every good story? 

[mandyjw]

5 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Isn't that the purpose of the antagonist in every good story? 

Luke, I am your Father.