For f*ck's sake Leo

[Tim R]

@Leo Gura Why do you keep insulting people? Since I started checking out the forum and your new video a couple of minutes ago I read two new cases of you insulting people.

1. Somewhere in the comment section of your new video about science, 2. in the thread about the presidential debate you said you'd gladly pay a shit load of money to get rid of dumb people 

Not no mention the other times you call people dumb straight to their face (and even dumbest, like in the conspiracy video).

This is not okay, at all. 

 

I politely ask you to stop doing this. You know how many good reasons everyone who backs this up has.

[electroBeam]

@Tim R out of pure curiosity, How does it make you feel when people are called dumb? 

[Leo Gura]

Did I say something false?

Are you seriously gonna argue that people aren't dumb?

[The Don]

Is this an insult to smart people?

Take a look:

I wanna know.

[Tim R]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Did I say something false?

Are you seriously gonna argue that people aren't dumb?

First of all, I could very well argue that there are no dumb people because everything is relative. 

But that's not the point. The point is, that you insult people. Why would you do that? 

This is like saying "oh but this person really IS fat!! I'm just stating the obvious!"

Doesn't matter. I know not a single teacher who calls people dumb only because they either have other views or are less developed. 

[Tim R]

1 hour ago, electroBeam said:

@Tim R out of pure curiosity, How does it make you feel when people are called dumb? 

In general? Well, since it's unnecessary and not helpful to anyone so I'd say disappointed. 

When Leo does it? Puzzled and a bit more disappointed. 

[Leo Gura]

8 minutes ago, Tim R said:

The point is, that you insult people. Why would you do that?

A) Develop a sense of humor.

B) I'm deliberately breaking your mold of trying to act like a saint. You need to see that conscious people can be crass. I know enlightened people who call others dumb. Why you assume they don't?

Sasaki Roshi would sometimes grab his students by the balls. Sometimes the mind requires a rude awakening.

You should be thankful I haven't yanked on your nutsack yet

[Rilles]

I dont know if this is Leo being in stage Coral, I get a sense that Red and Coral are similar but in different tiers. 

[Tim R]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

A) Develop a sense of humor.

B) I'm deliberately breaking your mold of trying to act like a saint. You need to see that conscious people can be crass. I know enlightened people who call others dumb. Why you assume they don't?

Sasaki Roshi would sometimes grab his students by the balls. Sometimes the mind requires a rude awakening.

You should be thankful I haven't yanked on your nutsack yet

I can accept that, at least partially. I didn't call you out because I personally feel attacked or anything, I just didn't understand this sort of behavior.

Of course you could argue "oh well sometimes people need a rude approach to shake them up", but how do you explain this for exapmle:

How is asking someone "how he/she can be so dumb" helpful? To me it just seems rude. 

 

Edited October 25, 2020 by Tim R

[electroBeam]

4 minutes ago, Tim R said:

I can accept that, at least partially. I didn't call you out because I personally feel attacked or anything, I just didn't understand this sort of behavior.

Of course you could argue "oh well sometimes people need a rude approach to shake them up", but how do you explain this for exapmle:

How is asking someone "how he/she can be so dumb" helpful? To me it just seems rude. 

 

the problem is you don't understand what religion is... you think it started by some person deciding "what valid and non valid religion is". Like its some kind of tribal ritual. That's tribalism. Religion is simple and logical. You read the text, listen to the pope, follow what the text and pope says. That's it. Religion has nothing to day about tribalism or amazon cultures because they don't have a book. Wasted 3 hours of your life. 

[Leo Gura]

@Tim R That was a very strategic reply. It's obvious that person is deeply asleep and needs a rude awakening.

There is no reasoning with that person.

[Gesundheit]

This one thing in particular I love about Leo. He is bro'ing you. That's the coolest thing a teacher could do if you ask me. It's a feature, not a bug. Other teachers treat you like a baby, Leo treats you like a bro and as an equal.

Edited October 25, 2020 by Gesundheit

[4201]

@Leo Gura Why do you actively try to avoid being an ideal to people?

Is this "I'm corrupt, don't follow me" idea really the best way to make people follow their own path instead of yours? At some point, they will be doomed to eventually question whether they are truly questioning or just following you anyway. It's not like denigrating your image to them will really help.

Perhaps yes, by being judgemental you'll force people to not like you and follow their own path. But much worse are the people who delude themselves into thinking it's ok to keep judging because "enlightened people" like Leo are judging all the time. And likewise, you justify your judgements using other people's behavior. Sure, you have the "I'm doing this purposefully for you" excuse, but people who are influenced by you do not.

This whole idea of enlightened people doing X is ridiculous to start with. There are no enlightened people. It's not the person that is enlightened, obviously.

At the end, that's not my business but yours. You do whatever you want, but if you behave like this then the frustration presented in this thread is to be expected.

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, 4201 said:

It's not like denigrating your image to them will really help.

I'm just being a normal human. But you guys expect something more.

[4201]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I'm just being a normal human. But you guys expect something more.

You are the one who claims to be awake, which means realizing there's no you in the first place. Perhaps it means more to you, because you went deeper but no-self is still an important component of being awake.

You cannot both be awake and behave like somebody that is not at the same time.

That doesn't mean you absolutely need to be awake, 5-MeO-DMT-everyday-for-a-month style. If you happen to backslide from time to time nobody will bitch about it if you admit it, we realize you are a human being. But if you keep claiming you are awake but not living to the standard of being awake, you feel like a fraud.

I do see how tricky it can be if "being awake" is part of your identity and your brand. But if it's not true it's not worth anything. 

Personally I don't expect anything. I don't see you like a fraud for claiming you are awake and not being it, because I see how thinking you are awake is probably a big part of not being awake. But we cannot expect others to realize it as well. 

Edited October 25, 2020 by 4201

[Shin]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I'm just being a normal human. But you guys expect something more.

Of course they expect more.

You're a father figure.

[Tim R]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

There is no reasoning with that person.

Agree. But you do see how this whole situation could be regarded to be just like any other "argument" (although this of course isn't one) that flew off the rails into the domain of insulting people? (aka someone doesn't agree with you and you call them dumb?)

You see, that's my whole point. Okay, you say you want to wake them up - great, keep doing that.

But I think calling people dumb does more harm than good. I doubt it very much that this particular person will have awakened to his/her ignorance by your comment.

 

1 hour ago, Gesundheit said:

This one thing in particular I love about Leo. He is bro'ing you. That's the coolest thing a teacher could do if you ask me. It's a feature, not a bug. Other teachers treat you like a baby, Leo treats you as an equal.

Yes, I like that too.

[Sempiternity]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I'm just being a normal human. But you guys expect something more.

I would think most here would expect a teacher that fully understands that they are God, there is no others, and all of reality is a dream they are dreaming, and has tapped into infinite Love, and understands that their ego self is all false, would act in a peaceful, wise, loving way. At least that's my perspective, and I'm sure others probably think similarly. So when that same teacher acts in a way that seems like Ego, experiencing other as real, and seemingly acting not from love, it could be maybe jarring for some. Not saying any of this is true or what's happening here, just a possibility for the conversations sake.

Leo is personally one of my favorite teachers. But I do sometimes wish he was exuding love, showing love verbally, to all. It's one thing to understand everything is Love, even hate. It's another to have your every action be one of love and connection. 

But in the grand scheme of things, everything is perfect as it is. 

[electroBeam]

1 minute ago, Sempiternity said:

I would think most here would expect a teacher that fully understands that they are God, there is no others, and all of reality is a dream they are dreaming, and has tapped into infinite Love, and understands that their ego self is all false, would act in a peaceful, wise, loving way. 

Well that's very silly, because you don't know what that state is, and therefore cannot know how someone acts from that state.

And its even more silly to assume that you (from a state that isn't what you describe Leo's to be) would know more about what wisdom, peace and love is, then what Leo does. Or to assume that you (from a lesser state) knows how a higher state should act lol. 

[Tim R]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

You should be thankful I haven't yanked on your nutsack yet

Dude, if it helps I'd be very thankful, so go ahead?