How to relate in a society you don't fit in?

[Blightlantern]

I basically live reading books and exploring areas and fields alone, I was never raised with my culture's way of living (I was an atheist when all they do here is pray, I love metal and old school music while all they listen to is pop, I even learned  programming alone, I perform seduction and hypnosis when they think it is just wrong/a sin or whatever, I learned the German language alone, lol I spoke to myself a lot). It is very hard to live exploring ideas that you know no one will ever open a discussion on them, no one will share the same thoughts you do, no one could even understand what you are talking about. I'm basicaly living planning in the back if my mind, that after years when I become old enough, I will travel, I will change what I call Home. But until then, I live with friends faking my interests, forcing myself to socialize their way. I understand that a good thing to do is to work on my skills, well I play bass guitar, I do bartending, I practice bug bounties, I read (this is too normal tho), I meditate, I go exercice. 

Anyone having the same issue? What are you doing to relate to your society in an authentic honest way? Any good advice?

Note: I really tried every possible way to believe in their god, do their practices, enter their kind of relationship (teens toxic relationships), play their games, but it is simply not me. And I am not searching for an "online" solution and I don't think radical honesty about my thoughts is helpful: I will be discriminated, excluded, even denied (they can't accept this level of radical open-mindedness), I don't fear this, I simply don't desire it.

Edited October 21, 2020 by Blightlantern

[ertopolice]

Be welcome

I can relate to that in some areas.

Most of my life I've felt i do not fit in at all. I got some interests not shared by most of my circle. I just fake i enjoy their chit chats and all but i normally enjoy some more deep conversations. Also, I am a very disciplined/ perfectionist person and i have to keep my ego in watch not to go too far with my perfectionism. I love exercising, also "extreme"/ metal bands, deep conversations, meditation and all this issues that keep us supporting actualized.org. 

Don't know. I acknowledged recently it's no use resisting if you wanna survive in this society but yeah..it's a pain relating or socializing in a sleep society.

 

Edited October 21, 2020 by ertopolice

[Applegarden]

11 minutes ago, ertopolice said:

Be welcome

I can relate to that in some areas.

Most of my life I've felt i do not fit in at all. I got some interests not shared by most of my circle. I just fake i enjoy their chit chats and all but i normally enjoy some more deep conversations. Also, I am a very disciplined/ perfectionist person and i have to keep my ego in watch not to go too far with my perfectionism. I love exercising, also "extreme"/ metal bands, deep conversations, meditation and all this issues that keep us supporting actualized.org. 

Don't know. I acknowledged recently it's no use resisting if you wanna survive in this society but yeah..it's a pain relating or socializing in a sleep society.

 

Same, lol, what bands are you into?

[Blightlantern]

3 hours ago, ertopolice said:

Be welcome

I can relate to that in some areas.

Most of my life I've felt i do not fit in at all. I got some interests not shared by most of my circle. I just fake i enjoy their chit chats and all but i normally enjoy some more deep conversations. Also, I am a very disciplined/ perfectionist person and i have to keep my ego in watch not to go too far with my perfectionism. I love exercising, also "extreme"/ metal bands, deep conversations, meditation and all this issues that keep us supporting actualized.org. 

Don't know. I acknowledged recently it's no use resisting if you wanna survive in this society but yeah..it's a pain relating or socializing in a sleep society.

 

Yeah mate, especially if you feel like having a lot of wasted potential in such society restricted areas.

[ertopolice]

1 hour ago, Blightlantern said:

Yeah mate, especially if you feel like having a lot of wasted potential in such society restricted areas.

In my case it's kinda i got no satisfaction with these interactions in most cases. 

Also, regarding dating in another big struggle. I observe the average woman behaviour and i try not to judge..i understand...but i cannot be like that.

 

[ertopolice]

4 hours ago, Applegarden said:

Same, lol, what bands are you into?

Huge list!! \m/

 

[ivory]

@Blightlantern Your situation is pretty common amongst those on a self-development journey. I have been through it as have many on this forum. The younger you are the more painful and isolating you will feel. Most don't consider deeper topics until they reach a certain level of maturity. How old are you?

 

I moved around quite a bit and have spent time in some liberal and some conservative cities and neighborhoods. Where you live matters so make sure you plant roots in an area with a lot of diversity. Keep in eye out for people who: travel, meditate, do yoga, study philosophy, read, watch documentaries, listen to podcasts, are politically liberal, nature lovers, activists, health conscious. If your social circle doesn't look like I just described then you need to get out as much as possible and find your tribe. Also, make sure you temper your expectations with a dose of reality. Don't expect to meet many who are truly on the spiritual path. Keep an open mind and try to find GREEN friends.

[ertopolice]

I really appreciate this thread and your posts too! well, in these lockdown times...it's get SO complicated 

Any tips on that?

[ivory]

@ertopolice Do you use meetup.com? I made most of my friends through discussion-oriented meetup groups. Before COVID we would meet at bars to discuss various topics. Politics, spirituality, science, history, health, etc. Once COVID hit the groups started meeting online via ZOOM. See if you can find any groups on meetup.com that are organizing online. If not, you can always start a new group to bring together people that interest you.

[ertopolice]

@ivory i considered paying the subscription for opening a new group in my area

seemed not so popular in here but perhaps nowadays got more active

thx!

[Blightlantern]

@modmyth Sorry for this late, really late.. reply. 

Well, I understand something about intelligence, and it is that "real intelligence" isn't about outsmarting people, but learning how to think with them (as them). And in fact there is no such thing as "real intelligence" there's only intelligence in one field or in all possible fields. I can connect with people. They seem to like it, I don't, because it is not my way, my field. I can master that field, but I can't tie emotions to it (Leo says otherwise :D).

From my perspective, it is not worth it anymore to waste time doing things that don't really mean anything to me, I've been over that. And honesty will not lead me anywhere. Oh yes, I live in a very culturally monolithic place.

Well, I do consider myself open-minded, and I will say that that's completely biased. Be ready. Open-mindedness for me is the will to observe (or to observe again) something and consider it to an amount of conscious time for it to deserve a permanent complete concept but a temporary or a permanent acceptance depending on the logical and emotional conclusion of my consideration.


Well, I can't claim that I can work with this always, in the end we are creatures of affect and some unpleasant truths will sometimes threaten our survival. So this proverb, that I really like, and that can never be translated correctly: " him who would claim all knowledge:
"You have learned some things, but much more escapes you..."", will always describe me. I'm not a god (Leo can't see this) and I know it.

[Blightlantern]

@ivory Sorry for my late reply

Yes you guessed it, I am 17.

Yes I need to find my tribe, but mate it isn't that easy:

For me, I can't travel anywhere without a VISA and if I got one. It will be a temporary one of course.

I seek knowledge of engineering, for this is the best field in which I get hopes of leaving my country. What is the point of letting new people in your country if they are not exceptional and needed?

I will at some point in time find my tribe, but I'm just looking for some people to live with now! I'm not struggling, believe me, but I think pure isolation and meditation is not for my adventurous age. And all exciting stuff is just on the World Wide Web.

In plain terms: all good stuff comes from here, the internet, I want it to be physical, social :D.

[Blightlantern]

@ertopolice thank you, well I didn't have a lockdown until two days ago, what happened for you?

[Origins]

@Blightlantern The best thing you can do is test your authentic condition against the environment and learn from the feedback you get. In reality, especially overtime the more you grow and develop yourself in various ways you're going to diverge from a great sum of the population and this is going to bring about communication difficulties as you speak about. Unless you and the other person/s are sincerely open to exploring one another as each are rather than playing a more prudent game the likelihood you're going to run into problems is naturally going to increase.

I say test your natural authentic condition against the environment as much as you need to in order to see this hypothesis come to light to bring confidence in it, then you'll see as I have, there's bugs in your wiring and there's bugs in the other persons wiring. If you run with completely no filter regarding what you say, the wiring between the two minds is going to intersect and that wiring is going to want to go in one direction not two directions, so either one person empathises and tries to relate or to the extent that there's mis-wiring there'll be mis-firing. Empathising with another person takes up more energy though so the better strategy is to filter yourself beforehand to do the other person a favour until you get to know each other more and hope that the other person will do the same so neither of you ruin what could have been a good interaction. This is why there's core principles to a good interaction and you'll learn your own core principles with experience (though feel free to research others) through this kind of trial and error. 

If you heed this advice, you'll take learning to interact with all kinds of people as something that will in the end contribute to you being able to interact with those most close to you, from improved self control to greater empathy and conversational strategies. If you don't heed this advice, you may not only end up being unsuccessful across a diverse set of situations but end up closing off interact with those who could have become closest to you because both or one of you unintentionally through a rock or two in one another's path before you got to properly know one another.

One of the biggest problems I see with two or one person that thinks they have a connection for example is that they drop all their filters in conversation and leaves them hoping for some kind of magical result where its all just going to workout. In reality though most of the time it doesn't, the more you violate basic communication principles the more its going to backfire with anyone not just  those that aren't closest to you. For those closest to you they'll tolerate more of your quirks because they've gotten to know you, this isn't going to happen for a complete stranger regardless as to whether there's a connection, often it'll be used to create the exact opposite result.

Systematic understanding, without fail for me, has been the best way to advance myself on this planet. I've tried many other ways, they do not work. Don't be a robot either of course (meaning don't be completely filtered) otherwise the person/s won't be able to get to know the real you, what you need is balance, and what I've found is that works best by approaching another with a genuine desire to understand combined with good intent for the both of you. It can't be for just the other person, otherwise its just a performance for the other person, there has to be that push and pull there, by looking out for each other in that regard, that'll create all the authenticity you need to progress the conversation. If that fails you, it likely wasn't meant to be. Sure you or the other person may have been having an off day and maybe in another situation it could have worked, etc, etc, but I wouldn't be clinging to that, sometimes you've just gotta play the cards as they present themselves and move forward as best as you can from there. In fact it can be argued as to why anyone would play any differently, but we do, and we have to learn from those situations just as much and sometimes that's what just a pure authentic trial and error approach has for us. We all have different histories, these histories have to be bridged by intelligent minds if we really want to connect beyond one another's bad experiences and through one another's good experiences with life so we can be of best positive influence where we can. 

Disclaimer: Naturally I don't always follow my own advice here but I do that to test my own theories and seems to prove itself time and time again. If you're following this formula, you'll find an awful lot out about the relationships around you as well, where there's cracks in how other's treat you and where's there's cracks in terms of how you're treating others for example and therefore where you want to move forward with that. We weren't all born to be with another, sometimes only for just a short while, but we're all born, although some more than others, with the capacity to learn from one another and how to apply those lessons on how we can relate to one another to higher and higher levels.

[Blightlantern]

@Origins I have definitly related to some examples you gave, and I did this stuff without actualy realizing that there is a term for it, thank you anyway that's something to do.

[IAmReallyImportant]

I can really identify with what you've written. It reminds me of my current situation. Because I don't want to be one person out of billions, but somehow special and want to be heard, understood, validated. I want to be seen as what I am as an ego. I saw too much direct evidence that I am not mediocre. Did IQ tests, delivered extraordinary work results, university grades and degrees.

At the same time, I don't really believe that I am special, I often feel unworthy. Currently, many things in my life change and sometimes it's hard regarding admitting where I am in life and that I am all alone. I am the only person who can see who I am as an ego. All other people want to be seen, too. They also want, that I see their potential. They are mostly concentrated on themselves - like myself - and thus are biased by this perspective. Everybody sees the world through their own lenses and so it is never possible to be really seen. Nobody will come in my life and see who I am really. Have to give myself the love and acknowledgement. Because all love and acknowledgement came, come and will come by myself alone.

It is time for me to realize that it is completely unimportant and does not matter who I become or who I am. Because, everyone will forget me anyway. It doesn't even matter how I felt or if I was happy in life when I die. But I do know that there is something I really want to decide about in life if I just want to feel good and have fun.

People who shit chat, do shit chat and don't do or like it. I realized that I liked the aspect of having fun and laughing together with other people. Because even if I was enlightened, there is nothing special about it, and being intellectual does not make me a better person, better than someone else, smarter or more intelligent. Being in my own head for too long gives me a feeling of disconnectedness. Philosophical discussions, for example, often lead nowhere and are therefore are also shit chat. Talking about theoretical stuff is interesting, but most of the time I don't learn much new things and using Google or reading books would be more efficient in this respect. I have realized that the main goal of a conversation is emotional exchange and therefore it is not wise, smart or intelligent to give intellectual discussions such weight.

I realized that behind all this there is only the ego, which is a highly intellectual/spiritual belief, and that it is the result of not getting enough love in my life because my life was hard and I had to go through too much shit. It takes courage to take a step back and tell me that I decide to live and let go of all the fantasies I have, but not my visions/dreams. The visions/dreams are just there and feel good, which is the main goal in life if I am honest with myself.

Edited November 17, 2020 by IAmReallyImportant

[IAmReallyImportant]

On 24/10/2020 at 10:53 AM, modmyth said:

@Blightlantern  My whole life I've been "different" and very aware of this, and sometimes very self-conscious about it.

Generally, the rule of thumb is to meet people where they are, and then people will be more open and receptive to who you are, no matter where you find yourself. Take an interest other people (but like, have some boundaries), and the urge to reciprocate may kick in. (Maybe not so much if you are living in very fundamentalist parts of the world... just keep it to yourself for your own safety.)

Find stuff you do have in common, even if it's not "super deep". Study and mirror people's communication style. Don't make things too heavy with people generally until you have a good idea about where their comfort zone is; it's a real conversation killer. People don't generally want to be stressed out by conversation. If you are pushing boundaries, you should do so mindfully while tuned in to the social atmosphere/ feeling.

This comes to some more naturally than others, I guess.

Also, if you really want to talk or connect with others, be open and give them an honest chance. You might be surprised. Be mindful of the tendency to type people as you see them.

Do you live in a very culturally monolithic place?

This sounds beautiful.

Edited November 17, 2020 by IAmReallyImportant

[Preety_India]

@Blightlantern

One thing to do is to stop caring what people think. You need to be firmly confident about who you are. Let not others have such an influence on you and your life. 

Also mixing with all kinds of people gives you the opportunities to learn about situations from different perspectives, allowing such a space needs radical open mindedness from you. 

You need to be willing to go to the deep end but this way you find true growth. You have an obligation to give constructive feedback to everyone around in your life, don't censor the feedback and care less about how they are going to react to it, there is an incredible sense of liberation when you do that. 

When you have the courage to accept and confront all the flaws in ourselves and others, we see true growth in our lives. This comes from a place of deep awareness and insight. 

 

[Darlisto]

On 21/10/2020 at 5:53 PM, Blightlantern said:

I basically live reading books and exploring areas and fields alone, I was never raised with my culture's way of living (I was an atheist when all they do here is pray, I love metal and old school music while all they listen to is pop, I even learned  programming alone, I perform seduction and hypnosis when they think it is just wrong/a sin or whatever, I learned the German language alone, lol I spoke to myself a lot). It is very hard to live exploring ideas that you know no one will ever open a discussion on them, no one will share the same thoughts you do, no one could even understand what you are talking about. I'm basicaly living planning in the back if my mind, that after years when I become old enough, I will travel, I will change what I call Home. But until then, I live with friends faking my interests, forcing myself to socialize their way. I understand that a good thing to do is to work on my skills, well I play bass guitar, I do bartending, I practice bug bounties, I read (this is too normal tho), I meditate, I go exercice. 

Anyone having the same issue? What are you doing to relate to your society in an authentic honest way? Any good advice?

Note: I really tried every possible way to believe in their god, do their practices, enter their kind of relationship (teens toxic relationships), play their games, but it is simply not me. And I am not searching for an "online" solution and I don't think radical honesty about my thoughts is helpful: I will be discriminated, excluded, even denied (they can't accept this level of radical open-mindedness), I don't fear this, I simply don't desire it.

Follow your satisfaction! You are your own best friend and if you find deep meaning, joy and fulfilment from exploring 'topics that won't open discussions', so be it. They make you more enlightened and aligned with your true self and that's number one. Your passion and sharing around these topics might even inspire others so follow your path, so actively looking for opportunities to share your meaningful insights on these subjects is something I'd highly recommend.

Obviously, there also has to be a balance between meaningful time alone and finding unity and joy with certain communities. You strike me as a generally very likeable and easy-going person so empathising with people from where they're at shouldn't be a problem for you. Remember that every person has something to teach you. Learn first to understand, then to be understood. Also, from what you wrote you have a lot of interest and skills that scream for communities. Playing bass in a band, bartend in a pub/restaurant where you might have the chance to meet like-minded people, find a harmonious gym with badass group lessons. A balance between both is key from my experience. 

We so often assume that we are alone in our authenticity and that society is this concrete, holistic and inauthentic machine when it's actually made up of 7 billion extraordinary people just like you. Look deeply into it and you might find the souls you're looking for. Don't expect people to match with your worldview entirely. You might resonate deeply on a few domains of life with one person, and there might be a mismatch on other domains. This is the beautify of life, this is how we learn and how we integrate ourselves, the other and ultimately humanity to a higher level of consciousness, love and understanding. By sharing your value, you enlighten us all

Keep shining your light brother!