Isn't Pickup Unconscious?

[Origins]

@Leo Gura People don't realise as well that true love has no evolutionary context, we forget that the average age of death used to once upon a time no greater than about 30 years. That means we had a life of "be grateful for what you have", with only the women and men that made it to that age which was very few. The feeling true love exists though, it created a bonding context in order for that love to survive environmental pressures and of course the more obvious one, for raising children. This is, among many other reasons like unemotionally balanced, unhealed trauma, lower intelligence (although not always) why cheating is more common in the modern world, especially when status becomes a feature in the context of always being surrounded by many other people, people don't understand various frames in which true love came into existence. I have "true love" for a certain person at the moment because you're right, my biology sees value and it believes its still in tribal times where there's nothing that compares, and that maybe its asking for me to "go out and look for her in the wilderness until I find her otherwise she might die" or something who knows, that I'm meant to impregnate her before some other guy, or something like that. 

These understandings and feelings are difficult for people to both accept and embrace but that just showed the positive influence it had on the development of the species in earlier times, moreover, in the modern world, love becomes an escape for people in a world/culture that gives us many reasons to want to escape it.

[Origins]

Stereotypically, in the modern world I'd predict higher stage relationships are the best prediction for a stable relationship (when compared to social norms that are actively ruining relationships like pickup culture, tinder apps, porn, etc), but they're naturally more rare. 

There's other forms that predict stability of course but that'd be my best bet as it predicts many other valuable things as well. 

We gotta remember that relationship trends have and always will be on a developmental trend as well, some demographics will have decreased contact others more contact in the context of producing a sustainable relationship.

A successful relationship today will be underpinned by different dynamics tomorrow (10, 20, etc years from now). 

So the "Higher Spiral Dynamic (SD)" stage prediction is actually a future forecast I'm making, its a novelty that is growing in culture as people learn to grow their awareness in unique ways, learning to become more balanced back to earlier periods of history (concerning how best relationships worked) while pairing themselves with the modern world. That's a higher intelligence relationship though. And again, just one form of potential stability, but just the horse I'm betting on as a future new trend, and those persons don't necessarily have to know anything about SD.

[molosku]

@Leo Gura Yes you have said that many times in many contexts, i get that. You didn't actually reply to anything I said or shamaanitar said. Why? Riddle me these:

Nah... women will always downplay their numbers because it increases your value. Your friend who fucked 55 dudes will never tell that to her future husband.

...and how would you know that? How much time are you actually spending time talking to women about these things? Where are your sources? From which cultural background are the women, with whom you have actually talked about this? Keep in mind that you use the term "women" and that literally mean EVERY woman out there. It is a HUGE thing to generalization  ALL women like that, but you seem to always do this willy nilly when discussing dating. 

What you really want is a player who will fall head over heels in love with only you. And I want to bang a new supermodel every night. The difference is, I understand the selfishness of my position.

You are wilfully projecting your mind to every one on the globe and in doing so, creating this neat shield for your projection: if someone were to deny this, you can just say "well you only think so because you are not as conscious as me!". Once again: to which cultures are you applying this? Which stages of the spiral? 
 

You're right, I would not believe it because you ladies love to not count all the guys you sleep with. You ain't fooling Leo with your coyness. I know how dirty you are inside. I bet you've opened it to some unworthy. It's okay. I won't judge.

Like shamaanitar said, if you said this to a person, they could literally sue you for sexual harasment and probably win. Is this some odd humour? I can't tell. If this is not some odd joke: projection projection projection, how do you not see this? Yes, you could whisper that to some girls ear in a nightclub setting and get away with it, but I don't think that you are keeping you high opinions of women to yourself, these ARE your opinions on women.

With all due respect: I don't know you, no one of your viewers really do, so it's impossible to tell what you mean with these types of comments, but I believe that you are capable of communicating about these things much more eloquently and skilfully, but for some reason you decide no to. Just my speculation.

 

Edited October 7, 2020 by molosku

[Origins]

21 minutes ago, Origins said:

@Leo GuraThese understandings and feelings are difficult for people to both accept and embrace

& *question (as opposed to embrace or --- accept both questioning and embracing), so the yin/yang there. Mucked that up.

[Origins]

People get that really wrong, they don't realise that the balance is in the middle.

Be as questioning as possible, run as many ethical experiments as possible while at the same time embracing the holism as it naturally stands during and after the experiments. Like if you think you're head over heels for someone, find several people that you find really handsome/beautiful on YouTube and just watch a lot of their videos for the next week to two weeks combined with meeting other new people. I reckon people have to reach the point where they realise than it eventually has to do with CHOOSING to be with someone that it really has anything to do with true love, meaning you CHOOSE your true love among other all the other true love you could have if you really did your experiments right and you do so after carefully evaluated reasons.

That's something that can be respected more, though everyone has their capacities for stress testing their, I mean I don't want to be with someone that either wouldn't want me to do that, and maybe even hasn't done that. I don't want someone to naively do the whole "true love" towards me, that's dangerous as I said especially when you're dealing with the big city. I want them to do so because they choose to in the context of having and pursuing other options for stress testing or that naivety has proved itself to be squashed by how self aware and questioning we both are about how we view the relationship. And for me, I want to be in a relationship in which we've discussed things so much that cultural ideas like cheating becomes a complete non issue, for example if they really want to fuck someone else, go do it but be open about why you're doing it, existentially and otherwise, which is why I wouldn't waste my time being intimate with someone that wasn't highly developed. Experimentally, not that I would do this but in the scenario that it occurred I'd want them to be able to have the emotional stability to allow me to just again, as an experiment, have sex with someone else without them worrying about me falling in love with someone else at the exclusion of the relationship. 

The way most people think about most subjects is wrapped up in the primordial soup of culture, its totally un-thought about properly, poorly modelled, unsynthesised, processed emotionally that you're just getting a large sand bag with a hole at the bottom that you have to carry several kilometres all the way home to get anywhere on a subject with someone and before you know it when you've arrived at your front door there's no sand in the bag and it was all for nothing.

Move up the spiral, move up the spiral. Enhance the perception of the subject, enhance the perception of the subject. Avoid the cultural norms at all costs, the only Christmas gifts you'll unwrap with every year spent taking in and believing culture is an unconscious future nightmare that you oughta just break a part and put back together again as soon as possible in a cool way only speaking about it with those that have the conversational strength to do so. 

 

Edited October 7, 2020 by Origins

[Origins]

And with the initial experiments mentioned, I recommend really imagining that you're in a relationship with the related people as well, just to observe yourself overtime unconsciously produce the experience of love. The more imaginative you are the more life like it'll feel and the more the spell will be broken and healed at the same time. But you've gotta be well developed, self-aware, etc. Please don't start stalking the YT's after you fall in love after imagining being in relationship with them repeatedly haha.

[Shunyata]

@Etherial Cat what do you look for in men?

[vizual]

The problem with Leo's perspective on dating and romantic relationships is that he will always view people of the opposite sex as a commodity, not as complete human being. And you can never have a deep connection with a commodity. Sure you can say that I'm denying the reality of dating, that I'm delusional and drinking the Disneyland Koolaid.

But at the same time, just because the current reality is certain way now, does not mean this is Truthful. And if something is not Truthful right now, does not mean it can't be Truthful in the future.

You can make the same argument as a business owner who exploits and screws over his employees. He is just being pragmatic so that he can stay competitive in the market place. From a pragmatist point of view he is completely justified in exploiting his employees. But we can all intuit something is off about it. Hell, Leo even made a video about the importance of looking at the world through a deeper intuition, not how things literally are.

 

 

[Shunyata]

@vizual and now he is gonna say that life is deeply counterintuitive.

[Beard]

6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

And how is that competence developed?

Hours of practice, trial and error. I was curious to see your take on confidence vs competence because theres a lot of fake confidnence fronting going on these days

[Recursoinominado]

If you do it to stick your dick into a hole and brag about it, yeah, it could be "unconscious".

If you do it to be a better man and meet quality women, it is awesome. 

[Javfly33]

9 hours ago, Preety_India said:

This is exactly why I started this thread. 

Totally agree 

How come nobody on this thread understands unconditional love? 

I have fallen in love with a broke guy. I cared for nothing. His money or status or anything.. So am I wrong?? 

I fell in love with him. I felt an intuitive deep connection with him. I wanted him and only him.. I never thought about his sexual value . 

I transcended his looks or money or status only because I wanted to be with him for the rest of my life. There was no game or sexual value there. 

It's sad how we are supposed to automatically believe that dating is this game like a contest to get high level contestant. 

I don't care how someone on this thread judges me. This was the main purpose of this thread.. 

I believe in unconditional love. I don't believe in all this dating rubbish and pua player nonsense. 

 

. 

 

You are not getting it.

All of those logical explanations are the self deception of the ego mind at play! Haha.

You want to practice unconditional love? Love the garbage container as you love your parents. That IS unconditional love. 

If you prefer your parents to a garbage can I got news for you; you are biased.

In the same way, you are clearly biased regarding sexual or romantic partner. There's no such a thing as romantic love. Is just survival. But the ego mind plays very well the self deception card. It will take a long time probably to realize this .

 

Edited October 7, 2020 by Javfly33

[Preety_India]

1 minute ago, Javfly33 said:

In the same way, you are clearly biased regarding sexual or romantic partner. There's no such a thing as romantic love. Is just survival.

What survival? 

 

[Javfly33]

2 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

What survival? 

 

The interests or agenda that you mind has in order to choose one man or other.

It doesn´t matter if the guy was broke. By some reason, you found it atractive. The WHY of why you found it attractive, that´s survival. Not mere coincidence. 

 

[Preety_India]

11 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

It doesn´t matter if the guy was broke. By some reason, you found it atractive. The WHY of why you found it attractive, that´s survival. Not mere coincidence. 

It's not just all about attraction as it is made to appear. 

Its also about values 

The love can last even if the attraction is faded. 

Love is a virtue independent of attraction. 

Of course much of dating is meant for best case survival but not everyone cares about survival all the time. 

We love someone because we have developed a friendship with them for some time and that connection blossoms into love..

When the human brain produces strong chemicals of bonding with a person, their looks and external factors are thrown out the window and you just want that person and nothing else. It's like soul bonding. 

All of this has nothing to do with dating strategies. 

All those high value creation dating techniques are fine within an Orange stage paradigm 

But at a certain point, you can transcend that for a soulmate. 

Such people can have lifetime relationships and they are more likely to look at pickup as very unconscious because they won't like the survival factor of it. 

It's like being versus shopping 

What I'm talking about is being and loving and asking nothing. Except that you don't want to be hurt. The relationship exists within an ambit of rules to preserve its sanity. 

Whereas all this stage orange dating is nothing but shopping. 

I don't believe in this type of dating. It can be conscious for those who look at it from a survival point.. 

But deep down I don't believe this. I believe it's possible for two people to simply find each other and be together transcending the rules of survival. 

That's true love 

 

I'm going to put effort into conscious dating. Not this type of dating. 

It looks very unconscious to me 

 

 

Edited October 7, 2020 by Preety_India

[vizual]

@Preety_India You said it very well. I think the romantic love we are talking about is not necessarily the highest level of enlightened unconditional love of a zen master. But it is of a higher vibration and consciousness than the Orange kind of relationships the people in this topic are talking about.

[Preety_India]

@vizual

Exactly exactly exactly 

 

[Thestarguitarist14]

@Preety_India You live in India right?

Because your way of thinking is very idealistic and no woman in the West (especially North America) thinks that way.

[Preety_India]

@vizual it's just that them and us have a paradigm lock. That's all. 

They don't get it because they don't feel like we do 

 

That's understandable. 

 

[Preety_India]

@Thestarguitarist14

Yea I live in India.

Our culture of dating is little different from the west.

In many ways.. 

We don't believe in dating 

 

We don't even have such a word.