Who Are The Proud Boys?

[dyslexicCnut]

Just now, Forestluv said:

Spoken like an Orange Champion of intellectual prowess! Defend your castle! 

Sounds like something a white supremacist would say 

[Willie]

1 minute ago, dyslexicCnut said:

Sounds like something a white supremacist would say 

?

??‍♂️

[dyslexicCnut]

7 minutes ago, Willie said:

?

??‍♂️

r/wooosh

[Carl-Richard]

26 minutes ago, dyslexicCnut said:

This forum sure does love to ascribe these flimsy color model labels to anything but themselves. As if merely defending a position against a race-realist automatically puts me in an unflattering category of personal development.

Here, I can put it in a way that doesn't include scary colors: there are many different styles of conversation, different ways of formulating and responding to arguments, and this conversation is following a certain pattern with respect to that fact . It's not so much about the content as it's about the structure of the lines of reasoning and ways of expression. 

[commie]

The dearth of worthwhile content on this forum is in no small part due to the games of one-upmanship played with "the structure of the lines of reasoning and ways of expression". Colors, delusions with regard to "personal" this or that, pseudo-spirituality and so forth all routinely serve this purpose.

@Forestluv You don't conjure a castle to defend against online drivel (a cat video does that job just fine) but against voices within. One can't commission the arifa here but I know what character I don't want to be playing.

[Forestluv]

40 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Here, I can put it in a way that doesn't include scary colors: there are many different styles of conversation, different ways of formulating and responding to arguments, and this conversation is following a certain pattern with respect to that fact . It's not so much about the content as it's about the structure of the lines of reasoning and ways of expression. 

So smooth.

56 minutes ago, dyslexicCnut said:

Sounds like something a white supremacist would say 

I'm pointing to structure, not content. 

[Thewritersunion]

@Forestluv

 

But in what cases are structure and content the same 

[Zega]

On 10/3/2020 at 3:38 PM, Leo Gura said:

 

I think the most disturbing part of this for me is the attacks on independent journalists going to the rally. Once a group shouts the right word ("ANTIFA press!") they are surrounded by dangerous people who will..."defend" themselves.
The mob mentality is so ugly, and they have justified their own bullshit to the point of it being their identity.

Side note: Did anyone else raise an eyebrow over the Russian (I think?) lady talking about Putin?

Edited October 6, 2020 by Zega

[Thewritersunion]

Has anyone mentioned that the founder of Proud Boys was a cofounder of Vice Media. 

[StephenK]

13 hours ago, dyslexicCnut said:

Yet again you fail to muster any semblance of academic citation.

No need. Your line of questioning to your mother points to implicit errors in your phrasing of the problem, and hence exposes errors in your reasoning. You can't go forward. Anything you assert downstream becomes strawman gibberish with citations on top. If you're willing to admit that you phrased the problem badly to your mother, then perhaps some traction could be found in this argument.

13 hours ago, dyslexicCnut said:

I grew up extremely privileged, am at no risk of poverty, nor have I been at any point in my life, so there goes your "blame others for your problems" argument.

13 hours ago, dyslexicCnut said:

but in the mind of someone like yourself I suppose just being black is enough to warrant misery.

Do you think that just because you're wealthy you can't have a victim mentality and be miserable? You truly are privileged. But let's drop the personal back and forth, since it's not getting to the root of the issue.

1) Do you admit that you phrased the questions to your mother poorly?

2) What percentage of the negative attitudes and behaviors within the black community can be attributed exclusively to socio-economic factors and slavery?

3) What socio-economic factors in particular do you think are to blame?

4) Is it possible for a black person to fall into poverty without slavery and socioeconomic factors being the cause?

5) If you say 100% to question 2, do you then deny that there is any genetic component to the negative attitudes and behaviors that we (the human race) exhibit? That is, is there a biological or genetic component to the condition we collectively as humans experience (things like fear, anger, pain, etc)? That is, does our biology as human beings play no role in our experience of the world? Does it play no role in the human condition?  Answer this carefully and please don't conflate the statement that humans have genetics with some kind of appeal to 'race realism'. Saying that genetics influence our experience of the world is not the same as ascribing to race-realism, for without genetics, we could not exist.

6) If you give an answer less than 100%, what is that percentage then? And how much of that do you take personal responsibility for?

7) What percentage of negative attitudes and behaviors is slavery responsible for?

8) What percentage of the negative attitudes and behaviors is modern socio-economics responsible for?

@Forestluv I'd like to see your answer to these questions as well, as you seem to be firmly grounded in the biological sciences.

Edited October 6, 2020 by StephenK

[dyslexicCnut]

10 hours ago, Etherial Cat said:

@dyslexicCnut

I get that you're angry, hurt and tired at the ignorance because I feel the same, but your suffering is blinding you and is deserving your cause.

Forestluv has been spending countless hours writing quality post to get people to understand systemic racism and bigotry in general. Calling him a white supremacist is just total bullshit and make you sound foolish.

I've learned on this forum how to be kinder, wiser, more patient and compassionate, even to those whose ignorance is causing harm. Your education and perspective, to some extend, puts you as well in a position of privilege next to people who fail to see what is obvious to you. Trying to humiliate them with your wit and knowledge isn't going to do anything but create more resentment and self-deception on their part. 

Be a bit more strategic. 

Haha, can't say I'm too surprised someone actually thought I was calling him a white supremacist? r/woooooooosh

The joke is that anyone can call someone anything for any reason, and it will sound foolish when there is no merit behind it.... I've overestimated the intellect of this forum unfortunately.

Edit: Like, seriously, he said nothing that could conceivably be racist, and to address his meritless aspersion of me being "stage orange", I made an equally insubstantial accusation his way as a joke.. Like, c'mon. It was obvious. 

Edited October 6, 2020 by dyslexicCnut

[dyslexicCnut]

@neutralempty Yeah I guess you wouldn't, haha

[dyslexicCnut]

@Etherial CatNo, you should absolutely be called out with strong language for misinterpretting something yet having the confidence to rebuke it despite being unaware what you're referring to. I apologize for nothing, but I'll rephrase it a bit since it was so triggering.

@neutralempty You say it sarcastically, but....

[commie]

16 minutes ago, Etherial Cat said:

Well, English isn't my mother tongue and I haven't followed thoroughly the whole discussions so I can lack context to pick up on irony. And your tone and general aggressiveness to members doesn't favor a charitable interpretation of your words.

It's not my mother tongue either but I had no trouble getting it. You seem to be paying too much attention to the package and not enough to the content.

10 hours ago, Etherial Cat said:

Trying to humiliate them with your wit and knowledge isn't going to do anything but create more resentment and self-deception on their part.

As far as I can tell, Dyslexic wasn't trying to humiliate anyone. Indeed they have shown a remarkable amount of patience by trying to inform people. I don't remember anyone in this thread doing even a tenth of the work they did.

You are limiting your own intellectual development by ascribing ego stuff to the exposition of facts and theories. I realize this is quite common (just look at the rest of the thread) but that doesn't make it any healthier.

Just in case anyone gets the wrong idea, I should add I disagree with Dyslexic. Only I take note of the information provided.

Edited October 6, 2020 by commie

[dyslexicCnut]

@neutralempty Imagine thinking your sarcasm has even a modicum of merit when you've come here, giving credence to another user's misunderstanding of an obvious joke, and then reacting with scorn once I rightfully correct them. Don't get too upset if I make some unflattering remarks about the level of wits you've committed to this discussion. 

@commie My dude! Finally somebody gets it. I find it troubling that people like @Etherial Cat have no trouble flinging unpleasant remarks (while misinterpreting me entirely) like "that's bullshit and makes you look foolish", but I'm not allowed to address them with the same disrespect since apparently they think I'm doing it from a position of unwarranted authority? As if I'm somehow in the wrong for articulating my viewpoints with the level of finesse I admittedly tend to.

Edit: have a follow, sir, you've earned it.

Edited October 6, 2020 by dyslexicCnut

[commie]

I'm talking about the way you (among others) are reacting to what Dyslexic is saying. That is, you are dealing with it as a move in some kind of one-upmanship game (just in case: that's a reference to the entertaining musings of one Alan Watts which should be familiar to every native English speaker here) instead of examining what's actually being said.

[dyslexicCnut]

@neutralempty Big ooof

[Preety_India]

What's this fuss about? 

 

[commie]

1 minute ago, Etherial Cat said:

So you mean that you think I was trying to feel superior to Dysexlic or something?

No, I have no idea why you reacted to Dyslexic posts that way. Maybe it is projection (that's common enough) and maybe it isn't. The problem as I see it is the way you read their posts, irrespective of your motives.

That said, sure: Dyslexic could be less confrontational.

[commie]

6 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

What's this fuss about?

Racism. The issue gets gringos very defensive for some reason.