Neither Monism, Nor Duality

[Someone here]

26 minutes ago, communitybuilder said:

how do you know that this feeling isn't still an illusion? How do you know that, even though you're convinced that you are God / the floor of consciousness, that there isn't something behind that still. 

There is always something behind anything. Infinity. But what is behind nothing aka God? 

[Nahm]

11 minutes ago, Someone here said:

It's all relative baby.

I agree. Yet, only up to the point where the infinity you speak of is direct experience. Then, it is most definitely not all relative, baby. 

[Tim R]

Ahh yes. Welcome to another episode of "Classical Actualized.org Forum Conversation". Gotta love it.

[Moksha]

Ego is complete identification with the conditioned mind.

Awakening is the experiential realization that you are not the conditioned mind. You are consciousness itself.

Enlightenment is the spiritual practice of learning to stay awake, until the ego is completely dissolved.

People sometimes mistake ego for arrogance. It can manifest in that way, but it is the complete complex of aversions and desires that distract us from the experience of ourselves as consciousness. It is always divisive, and is insidiously adept at seizing our awareness and plummeting us back into unconsciousness. 

Ultimately, all suffering is the result of the ego. Pain is unavoidable, but pain is different from suffering. Suffering results from a refusal to accept the isness of the present moment, and live in the Now.

[Someone here]

15 minutes ago, Nahm said:

I agree. Yet, only up to the point where the infinity you speak of is direct experience. Then, it is most definitely not all relative, baby. 

Infinity is not an experience within direct experience. How can the infinite be couched within the finite?. If there is infinity.. There is nothing but infinity. Direct experience is infinity. There is nothing but infinity.  Just look inside of you.. In your imagination alone there are infinte worlds inside infinite worlds.    There is your direct experience.  Is there a limit to what your mind could imagine or dream up?.. No.  And so you find yourself inside one of your imaginations. intellectually.. Experientially.. And intuitively clear.   

 Btw.. What's relative and what's not relative is itself relative. Because it's all relative and that's the absolute. Don't try to ground the conversation. There is no ground here. It's infinte. Baby. 

 

 

 

Edited October 5, 2020 by Someone here

[Moksha]

@Someone here If you don't mind me asking, how does any of this apply to your life? I understand that you believe you are God and everything (including your so-called life) is an illusion, But are there any pragmatic implications to your realization? Do you suffer less as a result? Are you more loving, more humble, more patient, and more at peace in your life? Is all of this conceptual or has it meaningfully improved the quality of your life? If you have experienced less suffering and more joy, do you see this upward trajectory continuing for the rest of your life and if so why?

Edited October 5, 2020 by Moksha

[Nahm]

10 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Infinity is not an experience within direct experience. How can the infinite be couched within the finite?. If there is infinity.. There is nothing but infinity. Direct experience is infinity. There is nothing but infinity.  Just look inside of you.. In your imagination alone there are infinte worlds inside infinite worlds.    There is your direct experience.  Is there a limit to what your mind could imagine or dream up?.. No.  And so you find yourself inside one of your imaginations. intellectually.. Experientially.. And intuitively clear.   

 Btw.. What's relative and what's not relative is itself relative. Because it's all relative and that's the absolute. Don't try to ground the conversation. There is no ground here. It's infinte. Baby. 

 

? I love ya and wish ya the best. 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, communitybuilder said:

When you guys ( @Leo Gura and @Someone here) become conscious that you're God... how do you know that this feeling isn't still an illusion? How do you know that, even though you're convinced that you are God / the floor of consciousness, that there isn't something behind that still?

Contemplate this question:

Assume God really did exist. How could God ever be sure he was God? Who would he ask? since anyone he asked would be himself. What if God asked himself but then lied to himself? Would that mean God exists but never knows he is God?

- - - - - -

God is not merely a feeling. It is TOTAL OMNISCIENCE of all of reality in one fell swoop. Imagine if you understood in one fell swoop how you designed every hair on your head and every molecule in your parents' bodies.

What you're not appreciating is that the Universe is capable of TOTAL OMNISCIENCE. It can know itself perfectly.

[Someone here]

8 minutes ago, Moksha said:

@Someone here If you don't mind me asking, how does any of this apply to your life? I understand that you believe you are God and everything (including your so-called life) is an illusion, But are there any pragmatic implications to your realization? Do you suffer less as a result? Are you more loving, more humble, more patient, and more at peace in your life? Is all of this conceptual or has it meaningfully improved the quality of your life? If you have experienced less suffering and more joy, do you see this upward trajectory continuing for the rest of your life and if so why?

Not necessarily to have practical implications.  This stuff won't buy you a house or pay your bills.  It's just do you care about knowing what the hell is reality. That's all. I care. 

[Moksha]

12 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Not necessarily to have practical implications.  This stuff won't buy you a house or pay your bills.  It's just do you care about knowing what the hell is reality. That's all. I care. 

Thank you for your answer. I agree that enlightenment won't buy you a house or pay your bills. However, it does let you tap into a deeper Source of intelligence to help you do those things. I believe, and have experienced, that it is a journey that engenders more love, more creativity, more wisdom, and less suffering in my life.

Edited October 5, 2020 by Moksha

[Leo Gura]

7 minutes ago, Moksha said:

enlightenment won't buy you a house

Osho told me to tell you this

[Nahm]

27 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Not necessarily to have practical implications.  This stuff won't buy you a house or pay your bills.  It's just do you care about knowing what the hell is reality. That's all. I care. 

Ya buuuuuut.....what if it’s literally actually true that there’s no you? In that case, “you’d” be telling infinity (yourself) what it can’t give an apparent ‘you’ (itself), and missing the Message of the intuition and suffering. “You” would be attracting precisely that. 

“This stuff” could not be more about, more intrinsically, more indicative of, ‘your life’. 

“It” is only bypassing if “it” is utilized as such.

[Moksha]

7 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Osho told me to tell you this

Lol, touche. In fairness, I did say, "However, it does let you tap into a deeper Source of intelligence to help you do those things".  The difference is that we are no longer attached to the fruits of our actions. Not to say we can't enjoy them for what they are

[Someone here]

6 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Ya buuuuuut.....what if it’s literally actually true that there’s no you? In that case, “you’d” be telling infinity (yourself) what it can’t give an apparent ‘you’ (itself), and missing the Message of the intuition and suffering. “You” would be attracting precisely that. 

“This stuff” could not be more about, more intrinsically, more indicative of, ‘your life’. 

Well if there is no me.. Do I have a say?  Not-two there is no me in front of it. It is me and me is it. Let me-it all unfold.  From this infinity consciousness you are  the owner of everything that can be owned everywhere.  What is lacking? The suffering is inevitable. The more you resist the more it persist. 

Talking about practical areas.. I will get a degree in philosophy and have a vision of changing academic philosophy. What people need is not to learn philosophy.. But to learn how to philosophize.  So that's for life purpose.  financially I'm pretty stabled.  Literally every girl passing the streets flirts with me ?. I happend to find myself in the good corner of infinity. It's all good I guess. 

 

[VeganAwake]

If you guys are God you still have to figure out who or what created God... ? and you can't say God created itself because maybe you're just not fully conscious yet of your Ultimate Creator... and even if God became fully conscious of its Ultimate Creator, God then has to become fully conscious of who created the Ultimate Creator.

Like Osho said, it's better not to create the first delusion. 

 

 

[Nahm]

@Someone here

It might sound odd at first but one can get so lost in conception one misses the actuality of it, infinite creation. 
“The first time you feel it, it might make you sad, the next time you feel it, it might make you mad, but you’ll be glad baby when you’ve found, that’s the power makes the world go round.” - Huey Lewis & The Message

@VeganAwake Well said not God. ?? 

[Leo Gura]

9 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

If you guys are God you still have to figure out who or what created God...

Ahahahaha...

Who created God?

Hahahahaha......

[Someone here]

@Nahm I get you. But that's not happening. Fortunately. 

@VeganAwake God is that which is uncreated. Smarto.. 

[Nahm]

@Someone here

Well, what’s ‘the finite mind’?

[Moksha]

47 minutes ago, Someone here said:

What people need is not to learn philosophy.. But to learn how to philosophize. 

What people need is not to philosophize, but to accept the isness of the present moment. Everything else, including the past and the future, is an illusion.