First 2020 Presidential Debate

[Hardkill]

11 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I think people who love a strong-man will love Trump's aggressive style. That is all his supporters already though. They love him regardless. They will see it as a clear victory against sleepy Joe.

Overall it seems like Trump's over-aggressive style turned off most centrist/undecided voters, which is who matters most:

 

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I did actually watch that one before along with a bunch of other news media panelists, commentators, and analysts from CNN, MSNBC, The hill/Rising TV, TYT channel, etc. They pretty much all say that Trump really blew it for this debate.

[DocWatts]

13 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Anyone who isn't obviously anti-Trump at this point is so dumb and uninformed that it's hard to even justify allowing them vote. But here we are. Democracy by the selfish and ignorant.

Yup, and one of the inherent contradictions is that people who don't believe in democracy (and would rather be living in a white ethno-state) can use thier votes to elect candidates to dismantle and destroy Democracy.

[DocWatts]

On another note I've heard good arguments that a lot of the 'undecideds' are actually Trump voters who are too ashamed to admit it.

[Lyubov]

32 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I think people who love a strong-man will love Trump's aggressive style. That is all his supporters already though. They love him regardless. They will see it as a clear victory against sleepy Joe.

Overall it seems like Trump's over-aggressive style turned off most centrist/undecided voters, which is who matters most:

But don't forget, the dumber people are, the more they will be swayed by aggression and bullying. And the American voters have always been pretty dumb.

Anyone who isn't obviously anti-Trump at this point is so dumb and uninformed that it's hard to even justify allowing them vote. But here we are. Democracy by the selfish and ignorant.

My IQ goes down just imagining being around this group of people. Imagine being undecided in 2020 They didn't even have an excuse in 2016. Now they are just taking the piss...

[Hardkill]

14 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

My IQ goes down just imagining being around this group of people. Imagine being undecided in 2020 They didn't even have an excuse in 2016. Now they are just taking the piss...

I know, right?! I mean, I know that people like me have a significant degree of bias for someone like Biden, but it truly blows my mind, that undecided voters like that group in that CNN vid clip still are having such a hard time recognizing, especially with only 34 days now until election night, that Trump is the true villain. What kind of evidence are they waiting for to prove that he is the real menace? Or is it because they believe that they are not hearing enough policies with sufficient substance or practical plans for our country from either Biden or Trump?

Edited October 1, 2020 by Hardkill

[Leo Gura]

You have to understand that most people simply do not follow politics.

For example, my brother hadn't followed the news for like 3 years since Trump got elected. So he basically knew nothing about what was going on other than what he heard from me or from his wife. And he's a smart, college-educated guy. He just doesn't care about politics or government.

Of course he knows Trump is a fool, but still. It's easy to never follow politics at all.

Most people have simply tuned out of politics and government. As if it wasn't even a thing. Such people don't see all the harm being done by the Trump admin. They just assume it's gov as usual. But it isn't.

[Forestluv]

The most common adjective for Trump given by an undecided focus group was ‘Crackhead”’. That aint a good sign. 

[Gidiot]

Yes undecided is another word for uninformed. You can look at that as bad or as an opportunity, I like looking it as an opportunity and having a 50 state strategy like Bernie says, no one should feel shunned by a party’s ideals unless they are supporting hate and division.

Politics just needs to be more sexy, like people should be taught about it in schools and have a government class required just like social studies which teaches about different methods of governments and philosophy and voting etc etc, 

ultimately it just needs to be more personal to people , at the federal level it’s too out of sight and even at the local level it’s hard to have a sense of community if you live in a mid size to big city. 
 

I definitely support mini collectives within cities like neighborhood planning with officials that give updates on local activities and news. The news does a good job but it’s still through a tv, I think with a stronger communal sense we would feel a lot more involved and motivated to vote. 
 

the threat of trump is a good motivator but the joy of community and individual symbiosis  is far greater. 
 

going to work this into my life purpose

[Matt Skinner]

5 hours ago, Forestluv said:

The most common adjective for Trump given by an undecided focus group was ‘Crackhead”’. That aint a good sign.

Accurate but....wow...........

[DocWatts]

"What's going on right now isn't normal" is a mantra everyone should be repeating to themselves right now.

I think of people like my grandparents, who are sweet lovely people, but think Trump is off putting because he's a loudmouth who insults people, and not because he's a authoritarian con man who's looting the country and causing long term damage to democratic institutions.

[DocWatts]

I also think that if a compelling argument isn't made as to why politics is relevant to someone's day to day life, the default position is to treat politics as an abstract notion that they pay attention to once every four years, then forget about for the times in between.

[Forestluv]

The nonpartisan commission on debates said there will be changes to debate rules to prevent interruptions. The only way I see is if they actually cut off mics - saying they will give warnings or the candidate loses time won't do any good. As long as Trump's mic is live he won't stop ranting. 

[Leo Gura]

16 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

The nonpartisan commission on debates said there will be changes to debate rules to prevent interruptions. The only way I see is if they actually cut off mics - saying they will give warnings or the candidate loses time won't do any good. As long as Trump's mic is live he won't stop ranting. 

I propose they equip Trump with a bluetooth shock collar.

[Enlightenment]

 

[Danioover9000]

@Gili Trawangan

On 9/30/2020 at 2:55 AM, Leo Gura said:

Not good for Biden. His points are far too weak.

Trump has the better optics and tone.

Biden is not leveling any kind of serious critique of the Trump administration's devilry, corruption, and incompetence.

 

On 9/30/2020 at 3:14 AM, Gili Trawangan said:

I've watched some of it, it's actually the first time I've ever seen Biden speak for more than a couple of minutes. Biden has no fluency in speech, has poor body language, and can't handle Trump's "all over the place" rhetoric. Biden is just too slow-witted, he stands no chance. And he looks desperate too.

It will be four more years of Trump, I've seen enough.

   I've seen the debate, and how Donald Trump dismantles Joe Biden's scripted responses is masterful manipulation of frames. And the part where Joe's scripted emotional rebuttal against Donald Trump's inflammatory remarks about his son in the military, Donald Trump is able to naturally interrupt and slip in his other son's dishonorable discharge, while making Joe Biden look like an emotionally stunted person. It's too painful to watch. There's links below by Charisma Matrix and Charisma on Command on some analysis on this dynamic:

 

[Leo Gura]

It's not genius. It's devilry.

[Danioover9000]

 

28 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It's not genius. It's devilry.

   semantics and catch words aside, it's basic manipulation. It's difficult if you can't skillfully manage another's manipulations, whilst trying to gain more voters. 

[Forestluv]

2 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

 

And the part where Joe's scripted emotional rebuttal against Donald Trump's inflammatory remarks about his son in the military, Donald Trump is able to naturally interrupt and slip in his other son's dishonorable discharge

What-aboutism, chest pounding and aggression is low level and primitive.

Calling Trump a skillful genius is what Ken Wilber describes as “elevationalism”. 

[Fadl]

58 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It's not genius. It's devilry.

You keep using this word "devilry", what is the difference between devilry and God?

Edited October 1, 2020 by Fadl

[Danioover9000]

5 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

What-aboutism, chest pounding and aggression is low level and primitive.

Calling Trump a skillful genius is what Ken Wilber describes as “elevationalism”. 

   I'm only focused on how Donald Trump manipulated Joe Biden in the debate. It's up to those observing to decide who will win and pick particular skills demonstrated.