How many of you actually practice law of attraction?

[Consept]

22 minutes ago, Michal__ said:

This whole perspective flies out the window after you experience/witness literal miracles.

So do you think its a coincidence that theres quite a reasonable scientific explanation for LOA? There is also a part of your brain called the Reticular Activating System (RAS) which ill put a short excerpt about below. 

What literal miracles have you experienced? you are being a bit vague in your responses. But lets say you have, would this explanation of LOA be the only reasonable one?

"Your RAS takes what you focus on and creates a filter for it. It then sifts through the data and presents only the pieces that are important to you. All of this happens without you noticing, of course. The RAS programs itself to work in your favor without you actively doing anything. Pretty awesome, right?

In the same way, the RAS seeks information that validates your beliefs. It filters the world through the parameters you give it, and your beliefs shape those parameters. If you think you are bad at giving speeches, you probably will be. If you believe you work efficiently, you most likely do. The RAS helps you see what you want to see and in doing so, influences your actions.

Some people suggest that you can train your RAS by taking your subconscious thoughts and marrying them to your conscious thoughts. They call it “setting your intent.” This basically means that if you focus hard on your goals, your RAS will reveal the people, information and opportunities that help you achieve them.

If you care about positivity, for example, you will become more aware of and seek positivity. If you really want a pet turtle and set your intent on getting one, you’ll tune in to the right information that helps you do that.

When you look at it this way, The Law of Attraction doesn’t seem so mystical. Focus on the bad things and you will invite negativity into your life. Focus on the good things and they will come to you, because your brain is seeking them out. It’s not magic, it’s your Reticular Activating System influencing the world you see around you."

 

24 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

An idea of oneness is NOT oneness, so can you see the potential value in a contradiction to the idea of oneness? 

Well really a contradiction can only exist in your mind, there is only oneness, so if you as a particle say 'im a separate individual' that would be an illusion. It would be like your finger saying 'im separate from the hand' because it hasnt got a full view of the whole body, it may say that its responsible for everything in its life but really thats just its internal dialogue.   

[Consept]

34 minutes ago, Michal__ said:

Have you tried contemplating LOA while under the influence of consciousness expanding chemicals? Or after heavy meditation? You should. The whole point of LOA is that external world = your perception of it, therefore the theory presented by you can be true from one POV and false from another.

I personally manifested a lot of money without doing much and much more (including healing). I know multiple people who cured cancer trough the principles I talk about. Also I already talked about the dude accidientaly changing the age of his parents.

This is why I say you have to experience it yourself to have a valid opinion about whether it is LOA or something else going on.

Your external world would be your perception of it yes, but it doesnt equal an objective external world. For example if someone has psychosis and believes theyre a chicken, to them that is definitely true but to everyone else its not true. Thats why relative truth is also important as its pretty impossible to get to an objective truth. 

What we know is that there is some kind of phenomena where if you think about something enough you start noticing it more and maybe more opportunities arise around that thing. Ive noticed it as i wanted to buy a particular car and i started seeing this type of car everywhere and started seeing more people selling it and became much more aware of it, then eventually bought it. So did some unknown forces come together and start creating and manifesting this car in the external world because i said in my head i wanted it or were these cars always in the world and my brain just started paying attention to this car more and more because i attached importance to it? I can imagine we evolved in this way because early humans would need to be able to spot food that was nutritious, so they would need their brain to focus on finding this food, it would be a matter of survival. Maybe they didnt have an explanation for this phenomena either and thought it was a sun god that gave them this food. 

Now, however we do have an explanation for it which is actually a lot more simple than the one proposed by LOA. 

Can you expand on this parents aging thing by the way im really curious 

 

[Fran11]

47 minutes ago, Consept said:

What we know is that there is some kind of phenomena where if you think about something enough you start noticing it more and maybe more opportunities arise around that thing. Ive noticed it as i wanted to buy a particular car and i started seeing this type of car everywhere and started seeing more people selling it and became much more aware of it, then eventually bought it. So did some unknown forces come together and start creating and manifesting this car in the external world because i said in my head i wanted it or were these cars always in the world and my brain just started paying attention to this car more and more because i attached importance to it?

Why do you make a duality beetween "material explainations" and "spiritual ones"?

Even if what happened was just that you started paying more attention to the car, reductionist materialism cannot completely explain this, as it happens with all psychological phenomena in fact.

It is a common materialistic bias to assume correlation means causality when dealing with conciousness and psychology.

Just like when a scientist sees neurons firing as you see the color red, he mistakenly assumes that your brain is generating the color red and that is all there is to it. Although the color red itself cannot be reduced to neurons.

I assume if you are on this forum you understand that that's not all there is to it, although a material correlation can be found.

The same happens with all psychological phenomena, like attention. Be careful assuming that just because a material correlation can be found that's all there is to it.

You are taking psychological phenomena for granted and think there cannot be anything "spiritual" about it.

Edited September 25, 2020 by Fran11

[Michal__]

50 minutes ago, Consept said:

Your external world would be your perception of it yes, but it doesnt equal an objective external world. For example if someone has psychosis and believes theyre a chicken, to them that is definitely true but to everyone else its not true. Thats why relative truth is also important as its pretty impossible to get to an objective truth. 

What we know is that there is some kind of phenomena where if you think about something enough you start noticing it more and maybe more opportunities arise around that thing. Ive noticed it as i wanted to buy a particular car and i started seeing this type of car everywhere and started seeing more people selling it and became much more aware of it, then eventually bought it. So did some unknown forces come together and start creating and manifesting this car in the external world because i said in my head i wanted it or were these cars always in the world and my brain just started paying attention to this car more and more because i attached importance to it? I can imagine we evolved in this way because early humans would need to be able to spot food that was nutritious, so they would need their brain to focus on finding this food, it would be a matter of survival. Maybe they didnt have an explanation for this phenomena either and thought it was a sun god that gave them this food. 

Now, however we do have an explanation for it which is actually a lot more simple than the one proposed by LOA. 

Can you expand on this parents aging thing by the way im really curious 

 

No, your perception changes other peoples perception too. Again, arguing is pointless - you have to raise your consciousness.

Edited September 25, 2020 by Michal__

[purerogue]

Maybe both of you are right 

[Consept]

1 minute ago, Fran11 said:

Why do you make a duality beetween "material explainations" and "spiritual ones"?

Even if what happened was just that you started paying more attention to the car, reductionist materialism cannot completely explain this, as it happens with all psychological phenomena in fact.

It is a common materialistic bias to assume correlation means causality when dealing with conciousness and psychology.

Just like when a scientist sees neurons firing as you see the color red, he mistakenly assumes that your brain is generating the color red and that is all there is to it. Although the color red itself cannot be reducet to neurons.

I assume if you are on this forum you understand that that's not all there is to it, although a material correlation can be found.

The same happens with all psychological phenomena, like attention. Don't just assume that because a material correlation can be found that's all there is to it.

I agree with you, im not really a materialist or have that bias. Of course there is more to consciousness than what is physically there i have experienced it through direct experience. 

My argument is that just because there isnt a full explanation for something we shouldnt jump to some conclusion that 'feels' good. I think any certainty about something that is essentially uncertain limits your understanding or potential understanding of that thing, this goes both ways for materialist and spiritual. What i see with LOA is that the explanation for it as spiritual is very certain to the point of almost a religious belief that doesnt take into account psychology, neuroscience and evolution, which would be like saying gravity exists because we all think it exists, which could be true but we dont know that, if we were told that over and over again maybe we'd believe it but how we got there wouldnt be epistemologically sound.

Yes to your point causation doesnt equal correlation, but wouldnt this be the same for people that believe in LOA? Just because they got the car or money they were constantly thinking about does that automatically mean it was a spiritual thing? It could be or it could be connected but to assert that you know would be a massive jump. 

The other thing is that this new understanding popularised by the Secret is relatively new, so the language used around thought manifestation, including calling it LOA has only been around for the last few years, before that it was 'think and grow rich' and other more psychological based terms. So is it a coincidence that this has happened or have people taken on board what books like the secret have said and run with with them as almost sacred? Im all for spiritual and mystical ideas but i think false spirituality ultimately sets people back and they miss what true spirituality is, this has been the case in the past with religion being watered down and fed to the masses to keep control, i see LOA in a similar way 

 

[Fran11]

30 minutes ago, Consept said:

What i see with LOA is that the explanation for it as spiritual is very certain to the point of almost a religious belief that doesnt take into account psychology, neuroscience and evolution.

Yes, I agree that some people's explainations for certain phenomena are plain childish magical thinking.

But it's also true that physics, psychology and neuroscience are extremely bought into the materialist paradigm, and therefore make the laws of nature seem much more rigid and deterministic than they really are. 

So lets not swing the pendulum too much towards that side either and play the "debunker".

Edited September 25, 2020 by Fran11

[Dodo]

On 22/09/2020 at 9:59 PM, Thestarguitarist14 said:

I have just always thought it was interesting how a good bit of people seem to be connected to the universe, but never become a conscious creator.  Never ever become good manifestos.

 

I have been working with the law of attraction for the last five years.  Truth be told, I was very hit and miss.  I say that it wasn’t until 2018 when I truly understood it and not until the pandemic when I began to be more consistent with it.  I have studied a few teachers, but Richard Dotts’ books have been the most helpful.  How to quit worrying and stop living has been the most helpful for manifesting money (Richard Dotts highly recommends this book) and it is not even about manifesting money.

Basically: You have to drop all negativity 

You have to have a high vibration 

You have to set intentions 

You have to release all resistance before taking action 

Any action that you do take has to be inspired action 

You have to maintain a state of peace

You have to let go and be perfectly happy without or without your desire manifesting.  This is critical.

 

If you are able to do this, then you will be in alignment with your desires and the universe will align people, places and things to bring these intentions to fruition.  This is because your actions are now backed by universal energy.

 

It is amazing when this works, it feels like magic.

 

When it all boils down to it, we are manifesting every minute of our lives.  How many of you are working with universal energy?

 

On 22/09/2020 at 10:04 PM, rav said:

Maybe the law of attraction is a concept?

And where do concepts come from?

If you were God (or the Universe for that matter) and able to manifest anything you wanted, would you manifest anything related to human attraction/aversion?

Or would you rather manifest attraction/aversion itself?

Would there be any "rather" for that matter?

 

On 22/09/2020 at 10:18 PM, Tim R said:

There's woo-woo and then there's woo-woo.

"Law of attraction" is the useless type of woo-woo. It's a childish fantasy, wishful thinking paired  with terms like "vibration" and "universal energy"... 

"Raise you vibration to align universal energy in order to manifest whatever you wish for!" is a typical LoA thing to say. It's foolish esotericism and nonsense - and I am not saying this from a purely rationalistic perspective.

 

Let's study this topic's title

"How many of you actually practice the law of attraction"

Now let's apply the same question to other laws in our experience:

How many of you actually practice the law of gravity?

How many of you actually practice the laws of thermodynamics? 

 

If you can opt out of practicing it, it's not a law  

 

I believe strongly in synchronicities etc, but also it is the exact nature of the Law of Attraction that it DOES NOT EXIST for those who do not believe in it. Because it is always practiced as any other law, if you do not believe it, IT REALLY doesn't work and its not there. So those who say there is the law of attraction are correct and those saying its not there are also correct. 

If those who say that LOA is not there are wrong, then the LOA is not working for them, since that's what they are trying to attract - the absence of the Law of attraction.. 

If you understand  

Edited September 25, 2020 by Dodo

[Michal__]

9 minutes ago, Dodo said:

 

 

 

Let's study this topic's title

"How many of you actually practice the law of attraction"

Now let's apply the same question to other laws in our experience:

How many of you actually practice the law of gravity?

How many of you actually practice the laws of thermodynamics? 

 

If you can opt out of practicing it, it's not a law  

 

I believe strongly in synchronicities etc, but also it is the exact nature of the Law of Attraction that it DOES NOT EXIST for those who do not believe in it. Because it is always practiced as any other law, if you do not believe it, IT REALLY doesn't work and its not there. So those who say there is the law of attraction are correct and those saying its not there are also correct. 

If those who say that LOA is not there are wrong, then the LOA is not working for them, since that's what they are trying to attract - the absence of the Law of attraction.. 

If you understand  

This

[Consept]

25 minutes ago, Fran11 said:

Yes, I agree that some people's explainations for certain phenomena are plain childish magical thinking.

But it's also true that physics, psychology and neuroscience are extremely bought into the materialist paradigm, and therefore make the laws of nature seem much more rigid and deterministic than they really are. 

So lets not swing the pendulum too much towards that side either and play the "debunker".

I agree with you some people treat the sciences as sacred and of course we know that to not be the case, again it is a way for humans to understand the world around them but at least there is some kind of method that can come to a relative truth, definitely not an objective one though. But if youre going to throw all science out and go with 'i feel that this is true because', (not saying you) youre going into a territory of anything and everything can be true including cults, qanon and whatever other magical thinking you can think of. 

What people that believe in the Secret usually say when you question it is - 'If you dont believe it, it wont work for you', so essentially the key thing that makes this true is that you have to believe in it, i could say the same for literally any kind of magical belief, in fact it is the logic that underpins every magical belief. So in that way if i believe the Secret Id realistically have to believe anything, or i could choose what i wanted to believe and it would automatically be true, be it qanon or whatever else. I dont see how this type of thinking could lead you to any kind of truth and if it does its complete luck. 

Non-duality is actually the taking away of beliefs, the taking away of content and being left with whatevers there, what is. LOA is more content, theres a reason why non-duality teachers dont really talk about law of attraction and why Leo hasnt talked about it for years. This is a summary that he wrote from his video on the Secret from 6 years ago - 

"Video Summary: Were you one of those swept up in the clamor about "The Secret" (the movie and / or the book)? Were you convicted by it to make your thoughts more optimistic and focused? How long did that last? A day? A week? Or did you miss the movie, and wonder what you missed as your friends enthusiastically raved about how great it was? While the movie was based on the Law of Attraction, a well-respected precept of psychology that states "like attracts like," the movie fails to equip the most disciplined among us to make those inspiring changes. Perhaps it would be unfair to expect that much from any movie. But it also is not a fair representation of Law of Attraction. Neither has it been much of a secret. If you didn't know about it, perhaps you haven't been listening. The movie is more an unnecessary justification for Law of Attraction drawn from metaphysics, paranormal phenomenon, and quantum physics, overlaid with slick marketing techniques, couched in the words of "experts." More disturbing, viewers may come away with the impression that they've been relieved of the responsibility to strive for success -- they need but "put it out to the universe" to get their just desserts. Just as disturbing, those who are beating their heads against walls trying to be a success may interpret that delay as a sign from the universe that it's not meant to be. The Law of Attraction does not give you a pass."

This is not a call to authority, im just saying 

[Consept]

Heres the vid btw - 

 

[Michal__]

Believe whatever you want. Also if you do consciousness work you will understand what I was talking about, sooner or later.

[Consept]

2 minutes ago, Michal__ said:

Believe whatever you want. Also if you do consciousness work you will understand what I was talking about, sooner or later.

Ive done it and got what i wanted but i wouldnt put it down to meta physics and quantum law

 

[purerogue]

4 minutes ago, Mikael89 said:

I would rather have Truth.

It's frustrating because I'm allergic to delusion wherever I see it. I can't help myself reacting to it.

Yes they probably achieve their goals faster than me and are more happy. But it's not because l.o.a. is true. It's because it's a false belief, and it has positive effects which has a normal ordinary psychological explanation.

Like children get happy etc. from believing in santa claus. Or christians believing in christianity, etc. Bullshit/false belief which gives real benefits, which has normal ordrinary explanations.

I prefer to not believe in santa claus or any other lie. If that makes my life more shitty so be it. I'm a Truthlover.

You don't have to believe, or not believe, best to describe is to be unlimited, or not knowing in deepest layer, you can still have knowledge and theories in top layer. 

 

 

[Michal__]

1 minute ago, Consept said:

Ive done it and got what i wanted but i wouldnt put it down to meta physics and quantum law

 

Well, you evidently haven't done enough.

[Fran11]

26 minutes ago, Consept said:

But if youre going to throw all science out and go with 'i feel that this is true because', (not saying you) youre going into a territory of anything and everything can be true including cults, qanon and whatever other magical thinking you can think of.

Yes, I agree with that perspective, I'm also against taking things by blind faith.

I feel many people here deny the occult because they are very biased towards Eastern spirituality, in which the occult is looked down on because they believe in renouncing life and going straight for liberation. Although they do recognize the existance of these possibilities.

In the Western esoteric traditions the occult is more mainstream. But they also talk about non-duality and enlightenment as the ultimate goal.

About LoA in particular, to me it's a rather sloppy new age way of calling various occult teachings and practices.

I personally know by direct experience that the occult is real because I've experimented with it. But I would not try conviencing people to just believe me but rather making their own experience.

 

[mandyjw]

40 minutes ago, Mikael89 said:

I would rather have Truth.

It's frustrating because I'm allergic to delusion wherever I see it. I can't help myself reacting to it.

Allergies are an autoimmune response, in other words attacking yourSelf.  

[Michal__]

Anyway law of attraction not working is clear sign of not having high enough consciousness.

[TheSunKing]

2 minutes ago, Mikael89 said:

It's really a ugly but also convenient way of forcing beliefs on people.

Another example is christianity. If you believe in Jesus and all that you will go to Heaven, and if you don't believe it then you will go to eternal Heaven. It's really effective, and probably the biggest reason why christianity is so wide spread. In the same way LOA is popular because it has a mechanism which kind of forces people to believe in it.

I agree. However, there's a stark difference between believing I am a sinner who must repent, vs. Believing that feeling good will bring good things into my experience. Even if it's false, I don't see the issue with feeling good.  

[mandyjw]

I loved Jesus so much I killed him. Opps. Kinda like the pet toad I tried to keep when I was four. Hugged him just a little too hard.