Psychiatry vs Psychology

[australia1]

Hey Everyone,

I'm an undergrad studying psychology. Despite disagreeing with a few philosophies I am taught, I love my degree. I have a strong pull to helping people and society through therapy, and to help fix some of the issues that I see in therapy. In my experience (in Australia), psychology and psychiatry are pretty hopeless. I've paid $250 to a psychiatrist for them to tell me to stay on antidepressants for the rest of my life - luckily I didn't listen and weaned off them, feeling better than ever. 

There's too much to go into here, but I'm very excited and passionate about this path for a number of reasons.

I'm deciding whether to go on to be a clinical psychologist or complete a doctor of medicine and go on to become a psychiatrist. I love psychology, however I know psychiatrists are qualified to administer all types of therapy, and this flexibility of resources appeals to me a lot. I am also vaguely interested in the possibility of psychedelic therapy, however this is not an essential avenue for me to go down.

I am worried though that psychiatrists end up solely focusing on prescribing medication, which is really not what I want to do.

Are there any psychologists/psychiatrists or people with insight into this matter that could share their perspective?

Thanks a lot

[australia1]

Yeah I've noticed that too. However psychiatrists are trained in psychology and psychotherapy too, they just often don't use it (where I'm from in Australia). I think there are limitations where they get paid more to prescribe medication than they do to administer talk therapy.

[tsuki]

20 hours ago, australia1 said:

I am worried though that psychiatrists end up solely focusing on prescribing medication, which is really not what I want to do.

I've never been on psychiatric medication but I've been going through therapy for 5 years with great success.
My wife is both on antidepressants and in therapy and these approaches seem to compliment each other for her. 

In some cases, we need help to regain chemical balance via medication, but medication in itself will not fix any problems. It may open a window to seek help from a psychologist, but in most cases - people are just looking for a superficial fix to their problems. I think that if you genuinely want to help people, you're better off practicing psychology. 

[Lyubov]

10 hours ago, neutralempty said:

Psychology is vastly superior to psychiatry. Psychiatry is sort of a toxic Blue stage system, not appreciating individuality and relativity and honestly the psychiatric knowledge is simple. From my experiences.

Psychiatry is almost pure rational orange. There is little to do with blue in the field.

[Lyubov]

Just now, neutralempty said:

@Lyubov No, it's completely norm and behavior based. 

Orange people don't like psychiatry either by the way, they see it's limits.

Psychiatry isn't science, it's a behavior structure for its own sake, that's why it is toxic Blue. And Orange people see through that limitation psychiatry would oppose onto them . Psychiatrist are also often Red.

What country are you in? Maybe it's different where you are. I think your interpretation is wayyyy off from the Spiral Dynamics model. Psychiatry here is basically all about quantifying subjective emotions and using research models to try and develop pharmaceuticals that sway these models. Almost pure orange. I don't even think the field originated during predominately blue times. 

[Lyubov]

2 minutes ago, neutralempty said:

@Lyubov

"quantifying subjective emotions and using research models to try and develop pharmaceuticals that sway these models."

T

That's the image portrait to the public, but no the actuality. Psychiatry is not about quantify emotions, it is about developing behavior models based on social norms for Pharmacies to sell their drugs. It is situated within Orange society and sold that way and it's front actors ( non-clinical psychiatrists ) may be Orange.

sounds like your own conspiratorial negative take on the field. you've posted a few times in here dogmatic disdain for the field. 

Edited September 20, 2020 by Lyubov

[australia1]

@Lyubov @neutralempty psychiatry is orange for sure - psychiatrists are medical doctors. It'd be tough to find someone with the work ethic and intelligence to become a qualified doctor in stage red or blue. The only stage blue I could see is maybe blindly following scientific principals. Still don't think that makes psychiatry a stage blue field. 

Some of the greatest books out there are written by psychiatrists. But unfortunately a lot seem to lazily prescribe medicine. 

[australia1]

@tsuki Thanks for your insight. Seems like your wife has found someone that works really well with her. I definitely agree with your view on medication - it's like a bandaid and should be used to help heal a deeper would. Such a shame that some psychiatrists believe that medication is a lifelong regime and the only way to help people. 

I am leaning towards psychology now actually. 

[Carl-Richard]

14 minutes ago, neutralempty said:

@australia1

"The only stage blue I could see is maybe blindly following scientific principals. Still don't think that makes psychiatry a stage blue field. "

That is exactly what makes it Blue. Medical field in general is Blue ( for now ), psychiatry on the other hand is in addition to that mostly useless to say the least. Intelligence isn't the key factor, and you don't need to have a good intelligence to be a doctor, you need discipline and will to sacrifice for given procedure.

Do you have experience in healthcare?

[kag101]

So you had experience with only one psychiatrist?

How about psychotherapy? Have you ever done it?

[Carl-Richard]

32 minutes ago, neutralempty said:

@Carl-Richard No, i am just writing fanfiction.

Ok good.

[Samuel Garcia]

Hey mate,

Psychiatry as you already know is a much more valued profession than being a clinical psychologist. I was living with a junior doctor who wants to become a psychiatrist and he's into spirituality and has seen alot issues within the profession. I'd recommend being a psychiatrist if you can as you have a lot more to work as you can work in more broader fields of both psychology and psychiatry where as a clinical psychologist is inferior to a psychiatrist Of course you'll have to study medicine and do more work in things which may not interest you.

Many psychiatrists do suck and are clueless as far as the ones I've met -  but maybe you could change that. I did meet one psychiatrist who saw behaviour and mental health in a clearer light but he said he was having time convincing others of his views. He was clear on trying to avoid medication. But a lot of people do need medication -- because in psychiatry, doctors deal with all sorts of people in more extreme circumstances. But perhaps you could be part of the change that is needed in psychiatry.

Definitely talk to professionals in both fields and see what they have to say. That's the best place for advice on your dilemma here.

[Jacobsrw]

On 19/09/2020 at 8:19 PM, australia1 said:

Hey Everyone,

I'm an undergrad studying psychology. Despite disagreeing with a few philosophies I am taught, I love my degree. I have a strong pull to helping people and society through therapy, and to help fix some of the issues that I see in therapy. In my experience (in Australia), psychology and psychiatry are pretty hopeless. I've paid $250 to a psychiatrist for them to tell me to stay on antidepressants for the rest of my life - luckily I didn't listen and weaned off them, feeling better than ever. 

There's too much to go into here, but I'm very excited and passionate about this path for a number of reasons.

I'm deciding whether to go on to be a clinical psychologist or complete a doctor of medicine and go on to become a psychiatrist. I love psychology, however I know psychiatrists are qualified to administer all types of therapy, and this flexibility of resources appeals to me a lot. I am also vaguely interested in the possibility of psychedelic therapy, however this is not an essential avenue for me to go down.

I am worried though that psychiatrists end up solely focusing on prescribing medication, which is really not what I want to do.

Are there any psychologists/psychiatrists or people with insight into this matter that could share their perspective?

Thanks a lot

Great to hear you are pursuing a career in psychology. Lots to learn there. I also am about to graduate with a degree in psychology in Australia. Great to meet a fellow student haha.

You raise a point I resonate with. There are many limitations in the field of psychology, namely its dogmatic paradigm shift into science and materialistic assumptions.

Psychiatry itself is heavily strong armed by the medical model and for a large part so too is psychology and these are the foundations of the present paradigm. This is extremely problematic as the problems in psychological health stem far deeper than the assumed material neurochemical instabilities.

Our current system maintains a demonstrable reliance on pharmaceutical intervention for existential problems of the mind. No pill will ever solve this. All it can do is simply mitigate the symptomology precipitated from it.

If you wish to pursue this field, you could consider looking into the counselling/psychoanalytic field within psychology opposed to the clinical. The clinical are inherently saturated by the medical model. Of recent years I’ve developed a deep passion for counselling and really see its value. It’s far more epistemological, philosophical and conversational rather than rigid, categorical and diagnostic.

Or even consider research as well. There’s plenty of areas in research that require advancing. If you are passionate about medicine maybe consider areas of study which explore how it can be used as instructive tool instead of a diagnostic liability.

I think that’s lots of opportunities in this field. Be open and see what how could contribute something advancing.

Edited September 24, 2020 by Jacobsrw

[australia1]

@Samuel Garcia Thanks so much, I really appreciate your reply. Great to know that other psychiatrists out there (or future ones) have similar aspirations to change things. I'll definitely try and have a chat to some professionals. 

[australia1]

@Jacobsrw Thanks for your reply! Absolutely agree with all that you said. Psychotherapy is actually something I'm really interested in - partly the reason I am considering psychiatry (I've seen that you can study/administer psychotherapy in psychiatry, but not in psychology - this could be totally wrong, it's really just what the internet has told me). The issue with counselling for me is that it may be harder to really gain significant influence and resources to make change. I do know a counsellor/psychotherapist who also finds it difficult to get clients sometimes, as his work isn't subsidised by medicare.

Anyway, lots to think about. Congrats on graduating, I'm sure you'll do awesome things

[Jacobsrw]

On 27/09/2020 at 1:00 PM, australia1 said:

@Jacobsrw Thanks for your reply! Absolutely agree with all that you said. Psychotherapy is actually something I'm really interested in - partly the reason I am considering psychiatry (I've seen that you can study/administer psychotherapy in psychiatry, but not in psychology - this could be totally wrong, it's really just what the internet has told me). The issue with counselling for me is that it may be harder to really gain significant influence and resources to make change. I do know a counsellor/psychotherapist who also finds it difficult to get clients sometimes, as his work isn't subsidised by medicare.

Anyway, lots to think about. Congrats on graduating, I'm sure you'll do awesome things

Anytime! These are some valid points you raise. Yeah counselling is somewhat a position of mediation opposed to one of leadership support, complementary and optional in nature so to speak. But I’d say from what I know so far, a counselling therapist could assist ones emotional discrepancies to a high degree if not more than that of a clinical method. Just depends on the approach, the current reliance on medical strategies can only do so much until they become redundant and this we seem to be now seeing. Would be good to see the clinical field expand into metaphysics and consciousness work.

In the end it’s what suits your skill set most and what you feel you will be able to contribute to the field most. Be aligned to that actuality more than anything I’d say. You’ll do great I’m sure ?

Edited October 4, 2020 by Jacobsrw