Trump admits on tape to downplaying Covid in March

[Forestluv]

29 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

The Donald, however, is at Stage Red. Hypocrisy doesn't count as a bad thing for him. This means that he can get very sneaky with ideology. He can claim to believe one thing today because it suits him, then claim to believe the exact opposite tomorrow if it suits him! His ego will trick him into genuinely believing that he does indeed believe the thing he's espousing in that specific moment.

Yep, self-centered immediacy of the person's survival and desires without regard to the welfare of others or future consequences is red mentality. Yet I would question the idea that "the ego tricks him into genuinely believing that he does indeed believe the thing he's espousing in that specific moment.". That would suggest some from of self reflection which comes after Red. Red mentality just is without ego tricking itself. I suppose we could say a subconscious ego is tricking the conscious ego into beliefs, yet I think that enters a new realm. . . Since there is zero conscious self reflection at red, I don't see a need for an ego to trick itself. 

[Parththakkar12]

18 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

Yep, self-centered immediacy of the person's survival and desires without regard to the welfare of others or future consequences is red mentality. Yet I would question the idea that "the ego tricks him into genuinely believing that he does indeed believe the thing he's espousing in that specific moment.". That would suggest some from of self reflection which comes after Red. Red mentality just is without ego tricking itself. i suppose would could say a subconscious ego is tricking the conscious ego, yet I think that enters a new realm. . . Since there is zero conscious self reflection, there is no need for an ego to trick itself. 

Oh yeah! The thing is, the human mind is ideological, regardless of whether you see that or not. At Blue, you gain a certain degree of ideological autonomy, in that you clearly know what you believe/stand for and you will be able to set aside your emotions and act according to your ideology.

At Red, you don't have that level of personal empowerment. Your mind has not developed to the point where you can hold on to a fixed ideology. You aren't owning your ideology and standing for it. But, the human mind is ideological by nature. This means that the ideological nature of your mind is subconscious. What will then happen is that your ego will subconsciously co-opt the ideological nature of your mind to suit itself. This is how the mind of a sociopath works.

This is how Red survives in a Blue world, by trying to trick Stage Blue people by presenting an ideology that suits itself. The way Blue people can counter this is by rigidly holding a Red person accountable for their actions, by using rigid rules to force them to walk their talk.

Edited September 10, 2020 by Parththakkar12

[Forestluv]

12 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

The thing is, the human mind is ideological, regardless of whether you see that or not. At Blue, you gain a certain degree of ideological autonomy, in that you clearly know what you believe/stand for and you will be able to set aside your emotions and act according to your ideology.

What??!! One is not able to simply 'set aside' their emotions at Blue. One of the major fundamental features of Blue is repression of emotions through guilt, shame, punishment on earth, punishment in hell etc. There are enormous internal and blue societal forces suppressing Blue emotions.

12 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

At Red, you don't have that level of personal empowerment. Your mind has not developed to the point where you can hold on to a fixed ideology.

Red has enormous personal empowerment!! Go to Liberia and interact with some gang leaders to see personal empowerment. Red has immense personal courage and power. Blue is self sacrificing. Blue is pressured to surrender their personal power to serve their community and a higher authority. Ask a Mormon on a mission about his "personal power" and he'd be like "Huh?? I'm just a vessel of the Lord, doing his will".

12 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

This is how Red survives in a Blue world, by trying to trick Stage Blue people by presenting an ideology that suits itself. The way Blue people can counter this is by rigidly holding a Red person accountable for their actions, by using rigid rules to force them to walk their talk.

You seem to give to little credit to Red on personal empowerment, yet give to much credit to Red for strategizing. Red's 'ideology' is  you f--- with me and I'll cut your arm off. Red does not have some ideology it consciously uses to strategically trick Blue. That is giving Red waaaay too much credit. 

Yet this is pure Red. When we mix some Red, Blue, Orange together - then we can enter these types of ideological games. And it would be fair to say the Trump is a red/blue/orange mix playing the games you describe. But pure red is more limbic system animalistic. 

[Parththakkar12]

19 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

What??!! One is not able to simply 'set aside' their emotions at Blue. Core features of Blue are repression of emotions through guilt, shame, punishment on earth, punishment in hell etc. There are enormous internal and blue societal forces suppressing Blue emotions.

Yeah well, I guess repression is better than just reacting to your emotions. It's better to suppress your anger than to punch someone in the face because you felt like it. When I said 'set aside', that included repression in this context.

19 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

Red has enormous personal empowerment!! Go to Liberia and interact with some gang leaders to see personal empowerment. Red has immense personal courage and power. Blue is self sacrificing. Blue is pressure to surrender their personal power to serve their community and a higher authority.

Of course! I will give them credit for being physically big and strong and having weapons and being able to fight. When I said personal empowerment, I meant on a mental level. It takes a certain degree of mental empowerment to be a good person, live peacefully and not be a gang-banger.

It takes even more strength to lay down your weapons, trusting that other people around you will not pick up their weapons against you. Here, you're creating a world that will give you your individual safety, instead of fighting for your own individual safety.

19 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

You seem to give to little credit to Red on personal empowerment, yet give to much credit to Red for strategizing. Red's 'ideology' is  you f--- with me and I'll cut your arm off. Red does not have some ideology it consciously uses to strategically trick Red. That is giving Red way too much credit. 

I said it's subconscious! It's not strategic. Strategy is not even a concept at Red.

The whole 'you f with me and I cut your arm off' is a more crude version of Red, the gangster types. There's also white-collar con-artists, like The Donald. These are more sophisticated in their ways of opportunistically exploiting systems, hacking through them, etc. Red people can be smart!

Edited September 10, 2020 by Parththakkar12

[Forestluv]

36 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

Yeah well, I guess repression is better than just reacting to your emotions. It's better to suppress your anger than to punch someone in the face because you felt like it. When I said 'set aside', that included repression in this context.

It's not just anger. It is also repression of personal pleasure, such as sexual repression. That is part of surrendering oneself to a higher authority. 

36 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

Of course! I will give them credit for being physically big and strong and having weapons and being able to fight. When I said personal empowerment, I meant on a mental level. It takes a certain degree of mental empowerment to be a good person, live peacefully and not be a gang-banger.

Being a red level man takes an immense amount of personal mental empowerment. I've been in red level environments and I did not have sufficient red level mental power. I couldn't handle it. Watch UFC fighter as they do their walk out. Entering that ring takes ENORMOUS mental power.

36 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

It takes even more strength to lay down your weapons, trusting that other people around you will not pick up their weapons against you. Here, you're creating a world that will give you your individual safety, instead of fighting for your own individual safety.

You are defining what counts as "strength" based on your conscious level. I'm not saying it isn't a form of strength, I'm saying it is biased. Living Red takes strength, transitioning to Blue also takes strength - a different type of strength. 

36 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

The whole 'you f with me and I cut your arm off' is a more crude version of Red, the gangster types. There's also white-collar con-artists, like The Donald. These are more sophisticated in their ways of opportunistically exploiting systems, hacking through them, etc. Red people can be smart!

Pure Red is the gangster types. There are also mixtures of red, blue, orange. White-collar con-artists are red-orange mixtures. A white-collar con artist has some sense of strategic planning, cost-benefit analysis, consequences and longer term vision. 

[Akemrelax]

On 9/10/2020 at 3:36 PM, Parththakkar12 said:

Yeah well, I guess repression is better than just reacting to your emotions. It's better to suppress your anger than to punch someone in the face because you felt like it. When I said 'set aside', that included repression in this context.

I think suppression of emotions is necessary to some extent to function properly. Things we spiritual people consider 'wrong' like ambition, greed, fear, desire, and anger are necessary to function in everyday life. I tried to exterminate these things in me, but I find it impossible to be a functioning human being without them. It's also near impossible to get rid of them as long as one lives.

I would say these need to be cultivated. A healthy amount of fear and desires are necessary to have a motivated life. These stage red and blue traits need to integrated to live a good and balanced life according to me.

Edited September 13, 2020 by Akemrelax

[Gidiot]

@Akemrelax You don’t need to suppress you emotions to deal with them, there are unhealthy and healthy ways of doing things. People who defend trump say he’s being loving and caring and downplaying it to keep everything cool and under control as if that’s his M.O. there are trump ads on YouTube of Joe Biden wants to defund the police and when you call no one will pick up how is that not inducing a panic? 

What he said to Woodward wasn’t surprising and calling it no greater than the flu in public constantly downplaying It saying it will go away and everything will be under control Democrat’s are overblowing it no mask mandate/ while  saying it’s deadlier than the flu in private is just political bullshit but you won’t convince a trump supporter that. 

cant wait for election week
 

 

Edited September 14, 2020 by Gidiot

[Ananta]

I'm not a political person. I'm just not too interested. Some of you probably find that despicable and that's okay. It is what it is.

I'm posting to say that If I had been in power I would've probably down played it a bit too. You have to remember that we didn't have enough masks or tests or ventilators...

dang, we didn't even have enough toilet paper!! I almost got mauled by a crowd the day after the "downplayed" news hit when I stopped at the store to get chips and dip for a work event. I soon realized how stupid that was when ppl had carts fulls of lysol and toilet paper and almost ran me down.

So, the downplayed version was still enough to cause panic in my neck of the woods. Several times I went to the store and there was no meat and little selection from a once huge grocery store..and this was many months ago when this news was downplayed.

So, I'm not saying anything about Trump per se, but I don't disagree with downplaying sometimes when you know ppl are going to freak the hell out and lose their minds...which still happened.

 I have been more afraid of unpredictable people with this crisis then the actual Covid-19. You know the type, the person that will scream at you at wal-mart for not following the directional lines on the floor or god forbid they want to beat you up in the parking lot for your groceries. 

Anyways, just my 2 cents

[DrewNows]

15 minutes ago, Ananta said:

dang, we didn't even have enough toilet paper!!

??

Aww you’re such a gem ? 

typically they say it’s best not to follow the crowd, especially when it comes to politics and propaganda. 

Im with you, walking the unshakable path of inner peace and knowing, for all I know, trump is the savior of these assbackwards societal norms, spitting the unexpected, fire ? ( it’s always been emanating from his crazy ass hair)  

over-rationalizing should be considered a mental illness, not that this term holds much cohesion in my reality 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 16, 2020 by DrewNows

[Akemrelax]

On 9/14/2020 at 3:07 AM, Gidiot said:

@Akemrelax You don’t need to suppress you emotions to deal with them, there are unhealthy and healthy ways of doing things. People who defend trump say he’s being loving and caring and downplaying it to keep everything cool and under control as if that’s his M.O. there are trump ads on YouTube of Joe Biden wants to defund the police and when you call no one will pick up how is that not inducing a panic? 

What he said to Woodward wasn’t surprising and calling it no greater than the flu in public constantly downplaying It saying it will go away and everything will be under control Democrat’s are overblowing it no mask mandate/ while  saying it’s deadlier than the flu in private is just political bullshit but you won’t convince a trump supporter that. 

cant wait for election week
 

 

I'm was not talking about Trump. I was making a general point.... 

 

[Danioover9000]

   It's very twisted that projection is everywhere; users here can't relate to normal mainstream folk like Trump supporters, projects that onto users that support Trump or have agnostic positions, and project religious/political beliefs and their own failures and humiliations on Trump's mistakes, while a teacher once condemns all forms of criticism, criticizes and bashes Trump, lovingly going along with the mass projections of Trump's failings. Friendly reminder: You create your own hell and misery, and blame everyone and everything else but yourself, hypocrite. 

[Danioover9000]

@Ananta

On 9/16/2020 at 4:38 AM, Ananta said:

I'm not a political person. I'm just not too interested. Some of you probably find that despicable and that's okay. It is what it is.

I'm posting to say that If I had been in power I would've probably down played it a bit too. You have to remember that we didn't have enough masks or tests or ventilators...

dang, we didn't even have enough toilet paper!! I almost got mauled by a crowd the day after the "downplayed" news hit when I stopped at the store to get chips and dip for a work event. I soon realized how stupid that was when ppl had carts fulls of lysol and toilet paper and almost ran me down.

So, the downplayed version was still enough to cause panic in my neck of the woods. Several times I went to the store and there was no meat and little selection from a once huge grocery store..and this was many months ago when this news was downplayed.

So, I'm not saying anything about Trump per se, but I don't disagree with downplaying sometimes when you know ppl are going to freak the hell out and lose their minds...which still happened.

 I have been more afraid of unpredictable people with this crisis then the actual Covid-19. You know the type, the person that will scream at you at wal-mart for not following the directional lines on the floor or god forbid they want to beat you up in the parking lot for your groceries. 

Anyways, just my 2 cents

 Wow, sorry to hear that happening. It's good that you're being agnostic in his discussion, cuz either side is going to lose much more.

[Ananta]

6 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said:

 Wow, sorry to hear that happening.

It's fine now, many months later. I go and do what I need/want, but I don't shop in stores too often. Mostly pick-up and on-line to avoid the crazy ppl when possible.  We are all adjusting to the new normal. As weird as it is...