How can I love anything.....

[Gesundheit]

When I am deeply traumatized?

This might sound weird but it feels like I've lost all feelings of love and appreciation after everything I ever loved always betrayed me and in best case scenarios, didn't come through. This didn't happen all at once, but gradually and over time. Right now I'm too cynical of life and of others. I can't trust even my best friend. To love, feels like unnecessary attachment. Teal Swan says that cynicism is a coping mechanism after the failure of expectations as to make us lower our expectations in the future so that we don't feel betrayed once again. And I agree with her. And I don't want to sound like a victim, but I actually am to a certain extent. The things that happened and are still happening to me are very limiting and against human growth. I feel like with all the knowledge and experience I currently have that I can make something out of it. The only problem is that there's no soil to nurture the seeds I have. I'm all by myself and no one can help me.

P.S. in practice, it's not as bad as it might sound. I don't feel any negative feelings so don't start weeping for me just yet.

Edited September 2, 2020 by Gesundheit

[Harmony342]

Don't lose hope my friend. There really are good people out there that are genuinely caring and loving, it's just difficult to find them. It's easy to lump everyone together but there is so much variation between people, you just have to keep going and you're bound to find someone that makes your life worth it in time.

[Chris365]

On 9/2/2020 at 1:41 PM, Gesundheit said:

When I am deeply traumatized?

This might sound weird but it feels like I've lost all feelings of love and appreciation after everything I ever loved always betrayed me and in best case scenarios, didn't come through. This didn't happen all at once, but gradually and over time. Right now I'm too cynical of life and of others. I can't trust even my best friend. To love, feels like unnecessary attachment. Teal Swan says that cynicism is a coping mechanism after the failure of expectations as to make us lower our expectations in the future so that we don't feel betrayed once again. And I agree with her. And I don't want to sound like a victim, but I actually am to a certain extent. The things that happened and are still happening to me are very limiting and against human growth. I feel like with all the knowledge and experience I currently have that I can make something out of it. The only problem is that there's no soil to nurture the seeds I have. I'm all by myself and no one can help me.

P.S. in practice, it's not as bad as it might sound. I don't feel any negative feelings so don't start weeping for me just yet.

The love you're talking about is egoic love, that expects something in return (even if not explicitly stated). You're waiting for the world to 'get in shape' to be worthy of your love.

Who is feeling betrayed? It's just a case of mistaken identity, who you really are, your true nature, cannot be hurt or betrayed.

Work on discovering this true nature, then you'll see everyone's actions are not 'evil', only 'insane', coming from the same case of identifying with their ego, and from ignorance of the Truth...

You then won't need anything from anyone, and will be free to give your Love, with no attachment, no expectation...

[Gesundheit]

1 minute ago, Chris365 said:

The love you're talking about is egoic love, that expects something in return (even if not explicitly stated). You're waiting for the world to 'get in shape' to be worthy of your love.

Maybe it's not really my problem. Maybe the world needs to love and understand me instead. Maybe it's my right to have an ego and give and receive egoic love.

2 minutes ago, Chris365 said:

Who is feeling betrayed? It's just a case of mistaken identity, who you really are, your true nature, cannot be hurt or betrayed.

Work on discovering this true nature, then you'll see everyone's actions are not 'evil', only 'insane', coming from the same case of identifying with their ego, and from ignorance of the Truth...

You then won't need anything from anyone, and will be free to give your Love, with no attachment, no expectation...

I understand all this awakening stuff, I've been practising it for years. But I don't feel the love anymore. It's empty here. No love and no hatred either. I understand that nothing is personal because there is no person here anymore. The person died each time it got betrayed.

[Chris365]

17 minutes ago, Gesundheit said:

Maybe it's not really my problem. Maybe the world needs to love and understand me instead. Maybe it's my right to have an ego and give and receive egoic love.

You might think it's not your problem, but until you transcend/integrate the ego fully, these sort of thoughts will keep appearing, along with suffering.

18 minutes ago, Gesundheit said:

I understand all this awakening stuff, I've been practising it for years. But I don't feel the love anymore. It's empty here. No love and no hatred either. I understand that nothing is personal because there is no person here anymore. The person died each time it got betrayed.

Hmm... normally with each betrayal, the person/ego only adds to itself, not diminishes.

You know this, but 'understanding' (at the level of mind/ego) and 'experiencing' (awareness) are slightly different... try working on experiencing.

If you're right and you're empty, that's good news, more space for God to enter...

[Gesundheit]

@Chris365 you don't understand.

[universe]

At that point the first step I'd recommend is forgiveness. You have to start to take the power back. Don't give it to people who mistreated or betrayed you. Also therapy can be helpful.

Is there something specific you want to love?

[Gesundheit]

13 minutes ago, universe said:

At that point the first step I'd recommend is forgiveness.

I don't know why would you recommend this. I don't feel bitter about the past or any person or anything at all. I don't feel love either. I just feel neutral about everything. Love is advocated within spiritual circles and that's why I'm asking. If I don't feel it, does this indicate that I'm doing something wrong? Or is it because of the traumatic past I have? Or is it simply BS and I am normal?

25 minutes ago, universe said:

You have to start to take the power back. Don't give it to people who mistreated or betrayed you.

I used to feel love in different flavors in the past. I used to love the poor and give money away. Now I don't give a fuck. In the back of my mind, I think that I need the money more than they do and that most of them are making a business out of faking poverty (it's a thing where I live) and that they are selfish devils.

I am no longer in contact with the people I consider toxic. I have cut them out of my life completely long ago.

28 minutes ago, universe said:

Is there something specific you want to love?

I don't think so. Like I said above, I'm mainly concerned about whether there's something wrong with me that I am not able to feel the love advocated within spiritual circles. I also don't have any passions or a direction in life, and I think that may be related.

[universe]

Well there is never anything wrong with you. But it could be that you are missing out on some parts of life.

How is your connection with your emotions in general? Do you feel anything. Any weak or strong emotions, ups and downs? Do you feel sensations in your body while experiencing these emotions?

 

What happens when you do this 5 minute guided visualization? (Starts 20:40)

 

[allislove]

?

[Gesundheit]

1 hour ago, universe said:

How is your connection with your emotions in general? Do you feel anything. Any weak or strong emotions, ups and downs? Do you feel sensations in your body while experiencing these emotions?

I believe I am well aware of my emotions. Aside from any major events, I could feel bliss at times during meditation. And sometimes I feel stress throughout life, but I remember to bring awareness onto it and it vanishes immediately. Major events may cause a lot of stress for me. Those are the ones I consider traumatizing. They usually are overwhelming and not located in a certain area. The minor stress I can easily locate, usually in my stomach area.

1 hour ago, universe said:

What happens when you do this 5 minute guided visualization? (Starts 20:40)

 

I tried it now. I felt extremely faint sparks of love at first, especially when Leo was naming different memories. But they didn't last long. And when he started talking about magnifying the feeling, I lost track because there was nothing to magnify.

[Gesundheit]

@universe I think I've found something. I tried listening to a music song that is linked with someone I loved once and did not come through for me. They were very special and I loved them so much, and they did actually want to come through but they could not because they were from a different religious background and that was the reason why we broke up.

The feeling of love is accompanied with sadness for me. I can't feel love without feeling sad. And now I'm crying as I'm typing this. Love gives me depression and I don't want to be depressed.

Edited September 4, 2020 by Gesundheit

[Farnaby]

2 hours ago, Gesundheit said:

@universe I think I've found something. I tried listening to a music song that is linked with someone I loved once and did not come through for me. They were very special and I loved them so much, and they did actually want to come through but they could not because they were from a different religious background and that was the reason why we broke up.

The feeling of love is accompanied with sadness for me. I can't feel love without feeling sad. And now I'm crying as I'm typing this. Love gives me depression and I don't want to be depressed.

Sounds like an important discovery, good job! 

I resonate with your neutral feelings towards everything, because I go through phases like that as well. 

My hypothesis is that part of it is just the nature of emotions (they come and go pretty quickly if you don't attach any thought stories) and another part is psychological coping mechanisms. To love is a big risk because if you "open your heart" you can get hurt and it will seem like it's more painful than just being detached from everything. 

Maybe deep down you are afraid of getting hurt (and feeling depressed) and automatic coping mechanisms kick in that repress any hint of love as soon as you notice it.

To reconnect with love, I often find it easier through animals (especially dogs) because your ego doesn't need to be on guard with them. 

Hope this helps!

[Gesundheit]

@Farnaby Yeah I agree with everything you said. Although now the real question for me is: Is it really worth it? Should I try to

Quote

reconnect with love

Or not?

I think I can do that if I work at it. But should I?

Edited September 4, 2020 by Gesundheit

[Bulgarianspirit]

I had this happen to me as well. The way i got past it is i told myself not to invest too much in people and if they go ,let them go if they want to stay,let them. However never let your happiness depend on them,they are like clouds they come and go.Love yourself first always,because you are most important

Edited September 5, 2020 by Bulgarianspirit

[Carl-Richard]

What you're talking about is survival. When the organism feels threatened by its environment, it starts building walls to protect itself, and it's based on fear (Trump's whole campaign summed up in one sentence). This is a natural response, and when the organism gets out of that environment, it will take work to unwind those old patterns.

I also suffered with this for a long time (still do to some extent), essentially distancing myself from my emotions and not wanting to feel them, and that made me numb and unable to truly connect with people and things that I used to love.

The way I started to untangle this problem was that I revamped my meditation habit. I started trying to provoke stuck emotional energies by focusing on a particular area in my body (primarily the stomach area) and trying to probe for tensions and "let go", cry, breathe, relax, forgive, surrender. Don't be afraid to feel vulnerable - welcome it, it's the point.

After doing this for a while, things started to change for me, and I realized the thing that lies at the core of all that bodily tension; it's the impulse of survival, and ultimately the fear of death; the ultimate threat of the small self (the last "wall"). I still struggle with that one.

The more you let go of tensions, the more you unwind these cyclical energy patterns, the more you let go of control, and the more you open up yourself up and get in touch with your emotional vulnerability again and your true authentic self. If your purpose is to seek what is true for you, try this simple practice.

Edited September 5, 2020 by Carl-Richard

[Mu_]

On 9/4/2020 at 6:29 AM, Gesundheit said:

@Farnaby Yeah I agree with everything you said. Although now the real question for me is: Is it really worth it? Should I try to

Or not?

I think I can do that if I work at it. But should I?

Hey man, its great that your open to this and willing to explore beyond what it is your familiar with.  I will say that its worth it, even if its not easy. 

It may feel scary because your going to feel things that may challenge idea's you have about how your supposed to feel or want to feel or if you feel may mean your not as enlightened or free as you want to feel or believe you should be.  Go into this with no need to be a example of enlightened or have all your shit together or figured out.  I feel like this will make it much easier, I know if I hold onto any such notions it limits and stumps all possible growth or ability to find out something new.

Life's infinitely explorable even in so called enlightenment, its not the end of feeling, exploring, understanding, being right, being wrong,

 

[Gesundheit]

8 hours ago, Bulgarianspirit said:

I had this happen to me as well. The way i got past it is i told myself not to invest too much in people and if they go ,let them go if they want to stay,let them. However never let your happiness depend on them,they are like clouds they come and go.Love yourself first always,because you are most important

Yeah that's what I'm doing actually. I don't have high expectations of people anymore. In fact at this point I wouldn't mind them all disappearing the next day. But that's called cynicism, and spiritual people think it's a "low consciousness" thing that should be replaced with love.

Edited September 6, 2020 by Gesundheit

[Gesundheit]

7 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

This is a natural response, and when the organism gets out of that environment, it will take work to unwind those old patterns.

What if I never got out yet of that environment?

7 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

I also suffered with this for a long time (still do to some extent), essentially distancing myself from my emotions and not wanting to feel them, and that made me numb and unable to truly connect with people and things that I used to love.

At this point, I find it actually pointless to connect with people emotionally. I don't think I'm repressing anything in that process. I find it the natural way to go about life, i.e. without attachments. And I don't think I'm numb. I can feel my emotions deeply and I am generally well present in my body. It's just the love emotion that seems unnecessary, and rather wicked to me at this point.

7 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

The way I started to untangle this problem was that I revamped my meditation habit. I started trying to provoke stuck emotional energies by focusing on a particular area in my body (primarily the stomach area) and trying to probe for tensions and "let go", cry, breathe, relax, forgive, surrender. Don't be afraid to feel vulnerable - welcome it, it's the point.

That's what I do. But to me, love still feels like unnecessary delusion tbh.

[Carl-Richard]

7 hours ago, Gesundheit said:

What if I never got out yet of that environment?

You said you were deepy traumatized, so I assumed that happened in the past and isn't an ongoing process.

 

7 hours ago, Gesundheit said:

At this point, I find it actually pointless to connect with people emotionally. I don't think I'm repressing anything in that process. I find it the natural way to go about life, i.e. without attachments. 

Then why do you reach out for help?

 

7 hours ago, Gesundheit said:

And I don't think I'm numb. I can feel my emotions deeply and I am generally well present in my body. It's just the love emotion that seems unnecessary, and rather wicked to me at this point.

Love isn't just an emotion; it's the fabric of reality. When you close yourself off from love, you close yourself off from reality.

 

7 hours ago, Gesundheit said:

That's what I do. But to me, love still feels like unnecessary delusion tbh.

Maybe you should re-investigate what you believe love is. For me, love is what happens when you're intimately involved with any aspect of reality. It doesn't have to be flowery and sentimental, or "hippy-dippy" love. It's just truth.