The Illusion Of Love

[Guest username]

For the first time, I have become really conscious of how illusory any relationship is. I see how they are rooted selfishness, despite all the sacrifice, despite the facade of selflessness it really is selfishness and manipulation. Before, I could see this on an abstract, intellectual level. Now I have really internalized and become aware of this.

 

Likewise, I can finally see that the whole narrative of self is all lies. The "good" and "bad" things we say and believe about ourselves is simply not the truth. 

[Frogfucius]

Hey, good job, man! I came to these realizations not too long ago too. It's absolutely liberating, isn't it? We can see through the guise of human relationships, whereas 99% of the people out there aren't aware that they're actually just illusions! When nothing no longer holds value in the mind, we can finally start living in reality.

Good luck on your journey!

[Leo Gura]

Good, but don't forget that GENUINE relationship is possible.

As is GENUINE love.

What is that?

Good question. That requires some serious investigating.

[Guest username]

@Leo Gura I suspected that was what Jesus meant by the Great Commandment, "Love God (the Self) above all else, and love thy neighbor as thyself." This is done through becoming aware of the non-disinaction between self and other.

 

I am speculating and relying on abstraction to deduce this rather than from a place of deep awareness.

[Nexeternity]

I know what true love is!  hehe <3

Here is a love letter to my girlfriend that I think expresses it

God = Reality, Existence, Universe

I love her.  For no reason at all, I simply love her.  Emotions well up inside me because it's so pure, and again it's for no reason at all.  And that means there's no thing, no reason that can change to take it away.  It comes from the deepest core of my Being.  It's in every breath, every thought, every feeling.  It's a direct manifestation of my love for God.  God put us together to experience true love, it's one of his things.  He knows we don't take it for granted, that we don't take credit for it arrogantly, that we nurture and grow it so he gladly lets it happen.  He's seen we've learned our lessons, and though there are many more, he's seen us ready for this new expression of his glory, his majesty, his self discovery of his mystery through us.  Who are we to oppose, to doubt the beauty of what is happening to us.

[ArabiaNytes]

I hate absolutes. In that form, they mean nothing. Hard facts are excluded from this opinion. You cannot constrain an abstraction with a hard absolute. It just sounds ignorant. 

[FindingPeace]

On 07/08/2016 at 4:47 AM, username said:

For the first time, I have become really conscious of how illusory any relationship is. I see how they are rooted selfishness, despite all the sacrifice, despite the facade of selflessness it really is selfishness and manipulation. Before, I could see this on an abstract, intellectual level. Now I have really internalized and become aware of this.

 

Likewise, I can finally see that the whole narrative of self is all lies. The "good" and "bad" things we say and believe about ourselves is simply not the truth. 

I second this.

Traditional love, or romantic love, standard love or whatever you want to call it is actually attachment. It is also selfish and conditional. Sounds harsh but it's very easy to prove this to yourself. Think about someone you love and then list the reasons that you love that person. Reasons. That, in itself, right there, is the evidence. If you love someone for 'reasons' then it can be assumed that you wouldn't love them if those reasons were no longer present. The love is conditional on those reasons. It is selfish, because those reasons are things that serve your own self agenda. It is selfish because it is judgmental and critical of the person being loved. The love is conditional on those judgements. In many ways, 'love' is just another word for 'like'. Or, basically, the value assigned to someone when an ego sees that there is something in it for itself.

And it's easy to see that many (or most) relationships are based upon a co-dependency and the ensuing battle of self-agendas and egos between the two people. Each person wanting what suits them and trying their best to engineer the relationship and their partner to acheive this.

Sounds cynical. The evidence is all around us. I don't think I've ever witnessed a truly functional and fulfilling relationship. More often what I see are mutualy beneficial arrangements. Mutually beneficial - in other words both people get something out of it that serves them is some way.

True, authentic love, has no reasons. It is simply the absence of judgment and criticism. The complete acceptance of someone or something. The allowing of someone to just 'be' as they are. Authentic love is not dependent on 'like' either. Authentic love is independent of your own ego and self-agenda. With authentic love, there is nothing in it for you. It is just an end in itself.

[egoeimai]

1 hour ago, FindingPeace said:

1. it is actually attachment. 

2. True, authentic love, has no reasons. It is simply the absence of judgment and criticism. The complete acceptance of someone or something. The allowing of someone to just 'be' as they are. Authentic love is not dependent on 'like' either. Authentic love is independent of your own ego and self-agenda. With authentic love, there is nothing in it for you. It is just an end in itself.

1. I see this. Its true.

2. I hate true love. Noone deserves it actually....but yourself. 

[ttm]

3 minutes ago, popi said:

2. I hate true love. Noone deserves it actually....

Why do you think so?

[egoeimai]

@ttm  because people are selfish. And they dont deserve true love. Kindness. At the end,If they have to choose themselves or their loved ones,to live,they will choose themselves! Yeah  

[ttm]

49 minutes ago, popi said:

@ttm  because people are selfish. And they dont deserve true love.

I do not see the connection there. Maybe it's the lack of true love in their lives that make them selfish?

Why do you hate true love?

[egoeimai]

19 minutes ago, ttm said:

I do not see the connection there. Maybe it's the lack of true love in their lives that make them selfish?

Why do you hate true love?

So you dont see the connection.

If true love has big value and its pure, selfish and dumb people cannot receive it and dont worth it. Its like comparing two dissimilar things. They dont match.

True love is something that you give most of the times. And you accept the object/subject in front of you.

Its matter of choice. If you choose to give it to someone or something who will not appreciate it. Waste of effort. And I know my words seem to contradict each other. But thats it 

[electroBeam]

4 hours ago, FindingPeace said:

I second this.

Traditional love, or romantic love, standard love or whatever you want to call it is actually attachment. It is also selfish and conditional. Sounds harsh but it's very easy to prove this to yourself. Think about someone you love and then list the reasons that you love that person. Reasons. That, in itself, right there, is the evidence. If you love someone for 'reasons' then it can be assumed that you wouldn't love them if those reasons were no longer present. The love is conditional on those reasons. It is selfish, because those reasons are things that serve your own self agenda. It is selfish because it is judgmental and critical of the person being loved. The love is conditional on those judgements. In many ways, 'love' is just another word for 'like'. Or, basically, the value assigned to someone when an ego sees that there is something in it for itself.

And it's easy to see that many (or most) relationships are based upon a co-dependency and the ensuing battle of self-agendas and egos between the two people. Each person wanting what suits them and trying their best to engineer the relationship and their partner to acheive this.

Sounds cynical. The evidence is all around us. I don't think I've ever witnessed a truly functional and fulfilling relationship. More often what I see are mutualy beneficial arrangements. Mutually beneficial - in other words both people get something out of it that serves them is some way.

True, authentic love, has no reasons. It is simply the absence of judgment and criticism. The complete acceptance of someone or something. The allowing of someone to just 'be' as they are. Authentic love is not dependent on 'like' either. Authentic love is independent of your own ego and self-agenda. With authentic love, there is nothing in it for you. It is just an end in itself.

what about if one of those reasons are to develop a connection with someone to sequentially care for them? The reason why you want to enter a relationship is to learn about another individual, develop a better understanding about them, and then to help and care for them, to gain fulfillment from helping someone you share similarities with, and know deeply?

 

Yeah your message does sound cynical, but is there really anything cynical about the selfishness of a relationship? Like what a brilliant way of gaining benefits! Use other people and come up with an arragement to do so! Its much more sophisticated and smart than trying to reap those benefits independently.

But you make relationships sound like business deals, there aren't quite business deals, there are(potentially) much more deep and fulfilling rewards from being in a relationship, then comming up with a deal with some bank to rip off civillians. 

[egoeimai]

3 minutes ago, electroBeam said:

what about if one of those reasons are to develop a connection with someone to sequentially care for them? The reason why you want to enter a relationship is to learn about another individual, develop a better understanding about them, and then to help and care for them, to gain fulfillment from helping someone you share similarities with, and know deeply?

Its more selfish than that. I think you approach someone,like someone,just to know more about yourself.

How they interract with you,what are you.

[electroBeam]

@popi why is being selfish a bad thing? I know we have been socially conditioned to put shame upon people who are selfish, but why? Why do you hate selfish people? They are apart, and accepted by this universe as much as you are. God created them

[egoeimai]

Just now, electroBeam said:

@popi why is being selfish a bad thing? I know we have been socially conditioned to put shame upon people who are selfish, but why? Why do you hate selfish people? They are apart, and accepted by this universe as much as you are. God created them

The only thing they care of is themselves and they do harm to the other people in order to sustain themselves and the ruin humanity.

They actually create destruction.

[electroBeam]

@popi People are complex, sometimes they are selfish, but sometimes they are selfless. They may be selfish in relationships, but selfless in their charity work. Its much greyer than what you think. You can't paint a range of people with just one brush. 

Edited August 11, 2016 by electroBeam

[egoeimai]

@electroBeam  we talk about relationships (love) so i thought it was obvious.

[Matthew Lamot]

I don ' t agree.

Reality is non-dual.

This means you are limitless, untouched, pure, unconcerned, ordinary, non-dual awareness.

You ARE love!

The reason you don 't believe that already is because conditioned ignorance of this is hard wired. 

Don't make the hard wiring even stronger by believing the illusion of separation ! 

Move in the other direction and believe the counter intuitive reality and live that inside the illusion until it becomes real  for you and real for others in your presence

 

[egoeimai]

@Matthew Lamot  I wanted to ask you sth but I couldnt find the thread we posted in.

This guy on the videos you shared,to whom he interacts with??