How to become Enlightened without meditation or psychedelics

[Nak Khid]

 Sadhguru said he knews nothing about meditation or metaphysics, he was a businessman and he sat on a hill one day he says he was not a meditator he  become spontaneously  enlightened
Eckhart Tolle at the age of 29, after having suffered from long periods of depression says he experienced an "inner transformation". He said>

I couldn’t live with myself any longer. And in this a question arose without an answer: who is the ‘I’ that cannot live with the self? What is the self? I felt drawn into a void! I didn’t know at the time that what really happened was the mind-made self, with its heaviness, its problems, that lives between the unsatisfying past and the fearful future, collapsed. It dissolved. The next morning I woke up and everything was so peaceful. The peace was there because there was no self. Just a sense of presence or "beingness," just observing and watching

So if this is true meditation is not required to become enlightened.  Neither are psychedelics (but try to even think of a few  people who are regraded as enlightened and did it by psychedelics) 

However one can't rely on these spontaneous events to occur out of nowhere either.
There is no standard or way of testing to see if someone is enlightened
so being enlightened is a matter of claiming you're enlightened and other people thinking you are,
if not,  acting enlightened and  people claiming  you are enlightened 

So how can one become enlightened? 

Answer: Just say you are or act in a way that people will assume you are enlightened.

And the mores you act this way and the more  you will be regarded as enlightened. You could act differently in private 
but  the more you do that  the more chance you  being exposed as hypocritical 

So to begin this process you  study the behavior of other people regarded to be enlightened closely and imitate what they say and do
but you don't imitate ant  one person word for word, you take for here and there and mix it together and put your own touch to it 
You have to give up your attachments and bad habits so you do as much as possible. 

Once you do this for a while you adapt more and more to it
and you speak to people on spiritual topics and how they can improve their lives.

Then the good karma comes back and people help you and sometimes give you things. 

This is how you become enlightened.
It's a lifestyle choice 

You make a choice
"I am going to live the way a enlightened person lives and in doing so I am enlightened"

and you don't look back

that's how it's done. 

Sitting in meditation is good for settling the mind but alone it doesn't make you enlightened. 
You have to choose to be enlightened. 
But people can see what it is to live like this and they say they want to become enlightened
but they actually fear living this way. 
So they sit and they sit for hours and years hoping that this fear will go away and something all of the sudden
something will hit them and make them want to become enlightened with their full being. 
But that is not going to happen, You have to make the choice in your default state not during meditation.
So if you stop wanting to become enlightened is that when it comes? 
No,  it doesn't come from a burning desire to become enlightened or somehow come to you when you don't cling to the idea. 
It comes about by choosing to live this was and then doing it 

So you say that sounds easy. Why doesn't everybody do it? 
It is because once you do it people will question you, you may have been living quietly
but now people question everything you say and try to make you into a fraud.
You may have to be poor for a while or you may not 

But all that goes with it. 
It is part of the choice  
 

[traveler]

Yea, there are probably a couple of sociopaths claiming to be enlightened. People are attracted to them because they play the role so well.

Every person claiming to be enlightened are frauds, apparently.

This is just play, bearded people sitting on thrones acting like they have something that you need to become like them, subtlety implying that you're not whole already.  

The search for enlightenment is an illusory reality, everything dreaming.

Edited August 8, 2020 by traveler

[wavydude]

so how's that working out for ya ?

[cobalto]

You always have to doubt when someone claims to be enlightened, it is something that cannot be verified and in many cases it is a great deal. Any of us who are interested in this know that it is enlightenment, the upanishads, non-duality, etc, and if you have also had experience with 5 meo, even better. you can go on saying that you live in total absence of ego and compulsive thinking and surround yourself with groupies. I would like to know if there are authentic illuminated ones. I recently read a certain melvin wartella, who also claimed to have found enlightenment spontaneously, as shadguru (my alarms sound with him) or tolle. It seemed to me that maybe it was sincere, but you never know

[Kalki Avatar]

@traveler Dont fool yourself so easily. 

[iamthat]

4 hours ago, Nak Khid said:

There is no standard or way of testing to see if someone is enlightened
so being enlightened is a matter of claiming you're enlightened and other people thinking you are,
if not,  acting enlightened and  people claiming  you are enlightened 

So how can one become enlightened? 

Answer: Just say you are or act in a way that people will assume you are enlightened.

that's how it's done. 

Sitting in meditation is good for settling the mind but alone it doesn't make you enlightened.

You have to choose to be enlightened.

Actually enlightenment is nothing to do with what someone may claim or other people may think.

Enlightenment is realisation, a profound shift in consciousness. This does not occur by simply choosing to be enlightened.

When this realisation occurs, when there is this profound shift in consciousness, there is no need to claim anything.

It is also irrelevant what other people may think.

But some people choose to share their experience because it may help those who still seek that realisation.

And then they find themselves in the position of being seen as a Teacher.

But not all teachers are enlightened. And not all enlightened beings are teachers.

Peace

Edited August 9, 2020 by iamthat

[Mu_]

9 hours ago, Nak Khid said:

 Sadhguru said he knews nothing about meditation or metaphysics, he was a businessman and he sat on a hill one day he says he was not a meditator he  become spontaneously  enlightened
Eckhart Tolle at the age of 29, after having suffered from long periods of depression says he experienced an "inner transformation". He said>

I couldn’t live with myself any longer. And in this a question arose without an answer: who is the ‘I’ that cannot live with the self? What is the self? I felt drawn into a void! I didn’t know at the time that what really happened was the mind-made self, with its heaviness, its problems, that lives between the unsatisfying past and the fearful future, collapsed. It dissolved. The next morning I woke up and everything was so peaceful. The peace was there because there was no self. Just a sense of presence or "beingness," just observing and watching

So if this is true meditation is not required to become enlightened.  Neither are psychedelics (but try to even think of a few  people who are regraded as enlightened and did it by psychedelics) 

However one can't rely on these spontaneous events to occur out of nowhere either.
There is no standard or way of testing to see if someone is enlightened
so being enlightened is a matter of claiming you're enlightened and other people thinking you are,
if not,  acting enlightened and  people claiming  you are enlightened 

So how can one become enlightened? 

Answer: Just say you are or act in a way that people will assume you are enlightened.

And the mores you act this way and the more  you will be regarded as enlightened. You could act differently in private 
but  the more you do that  the more chance you  being exposed as hypocritical 

So to begin this process you  study the behavior of other people regarded to be enlightened closely and imitate what they say and do
but you don't imitate ant  one person word for word, you take for here and there and mix it together and put your own touch to it 
You have to give up your attachments and bad habits so you do as much as possible. 

Once you do this for a while you adapt more and more to it
and you speak to people on spiritual topics and how they can improve their lives.

Then the good karma comes back and people help you and sometimes give you things. 

This is how you become enlightened.
It's a lifestyle choice 

You make a choice
"I am going to live the way a enlightened person lives and in doing so I am enlightened"

and you don't look back

that's how it's done. 

Sitting in meditation is good for settling the mind but alone it doesn't make you enlightened. 
You have to choose to be enlightened. 
But people can see what it is to live like this and they say they want to become enlightened
but they actually fear living this way. 
So they sit and they sit for hours and years hoping that this fear will go away and something all of the sudden
something will hit them and make them want to become enlightened with their full being. 
But that is not going to happen, You have to make the choice in your default state not during meditation.
So if you stop wanting to become enlightened is that when it comes? 
No,  it doesn't come from a burning desire to become enlightened or somehow come to you when you don't cling to the idea. 
It comes about by choosing to live this was and then doing it 

So you say that sounds easy. Why doesn't everybody do it? 
It is because once you do it people will question you, you may have been living quietly
but now people question everything you say and try to make you into a fraud.
You may have to be poor for a while or you may not 

But all that goes with it. 
It is part of the choice  
 

Thanks for the laugh, I needed that.  The whole enlightenment idea is funny.  Its really just a word.  But experience and life and the breath, depth and variety is another thing all together.  Sure you can bundle this stuff into paradigms such as the body/mind/nervous system belief framework , or the ego/soul/god consciousness framework, or realize its just happening framework,, or theres really no-one or no-self framework, or the its all in your hands framework.  These are all just "....." or words, or what ever comes out of a mouth, lol.

But real talk man, there's some mind blowing stuff all over the place, ranging from science to awakening type stuff, to stuff there's no current frame work to relate to, to psychedelics.  And some of this stuff is LIT AS FUCK and will forever change your tune and expression and leave no trace of the same old same old mumbo jumbo simple down to earth shit most people think that reality or human life is.....

Just my two cents but if you havent gotten to the holy shit lit as fuck and it majorly or even radically shifting and opening up to the unbelievable, then enlightenment shouldn't be used, even though its all the same fundamentally.

[Nak Khid]

1 hour ago, Mu_ said:

Thanks for the laugh, I needed that.  The whole enlightenment is funny. 

It's not a joke

you decide you are enlightened and the you act enlightened 
it's a choice

they don't tell you that in the manual 
meanwhile the next guy is mediation in a cave for six hours a day in Thailand
getting bitten by mosquitoes wondering why he's still not enlightened 

remember nonduality ?   > no distinction 

there is no distinction between being "getting" enlightened and choosing to be enlightened 
the "getting" part was the illusion
You choose it 
But people don't want to give up everything, their attachments and especially their security 
It's not like actualization where you first establish your basic survival needs
that type of safety net will not test you 
No, in fact the most profound enlightenment is often in the middle of a disaster or struggle 
where your survival may be insecure
That may not happen but security is not guaranteed  
then you may suddenly break out laughing.. ha  ha ha 

But if you do this in the U.S. or if you do it somewhere else
each place will have it's unique conditions and response or lack of 
So after you are enlightened to you give up meditation? 
no, that has it's place as well,  look at the leaf of an oak
two hours have passed 
 


 

Edited August 9, 2020 by Nak Khid

[Mu_]

4 minutes ago, Nak Khid said:

It's not a joke

you decide you are enlightened and the you act enlightened 
it's a choice

they don't tell you that in the manual 
meanwhile the next guy is mediation in a cave for six hours a day in Thailand
getting bitten by mosquitoes wondering why he's still not enlightened 

remember nonduality ?   > no distinction 

there is no distinction between being "getting" enlightened and choosing to be enlightened 
the "getting" part was the illusion
You choose it 
But people don't want to give up everything, their attachments and especially their security 
It's not like actualization where you first establish your basic survival needs
that type of safety net will not test you 
No, in fact the most profound enlightenment is often in the middle of a disaster or struggle 
where your survival may be insecure
That may not happen but security is not guaranteed  
then you may suddenly break out laughing.. ha  ha ha 

But if you do this in the U.S. or if you do it somewhere else
each place will have it's unique conditions and response or lack of 
So after you are enlightened to you give up mediation? 
no, that has it's place as well,  look at the leaf of an oak
two hours have passed 
 


 

Yaya yaya, just laugh man.  If you've really gotten what you speak, just let it go and laugh a little.

[Nahm]

@Nak Khid

What is choice?

[Nak Khid]

11 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Nak Khid

What is choice?

You can become enlightened by choice 
rather than mediating or taking a psychedelic and expecting it to come to you 

but it's not an easy choice to make because you have to start living it 
and many people don't really want everything that comes with it 
just what they select out of it 

[James123]

@Nak Khid these are just thoughts brother, enlightenment has nothing to do with thoughts or choice. Self must be exist to make a choice. Self, being existed, choices these are just thoughts and language. Whatever you saying is just a belief, because it is within the language. 
 

 

 

you are just trying to learn now with expressing your thoughts. 

Edited August 9, 2020 by James123

[Gesundheit]

You took your time to come up with this theory, didn't you?

[traveler]

8 hours ago, Kalki Avatar said:

@traveler Dont fool yourself so easily. 

Why not? Who is making the rules? Who is afraid of getting this wrong? Who is fooling itself? 

Authority gets destroyed when the person falls away, it is the end of the games. 

No one has the truth, that is the last thing you want to hear, but it is also the freedom and unconditional love that is longed for, but you can't have it.

Giving others the authority of supreme knowing is a security blanket for 'me', at least I know that there is a truth that will some day make me whole: There isn't, there is only wholeness, which can appear as anything including an experience of lacking wholeness. 

[WaveInTheOcean]

10 hours ago, traveler said:

The search for enlightenment is an illusory reality, everything dreaming.

Sure, but so is every other 'search' in your life, even the path of not trying to search, hehe.

[traveler]

9 minutes ago, WaveInTheOcean said:

Sure, but so is every other 'search' in your life, even the path of not trying to search, hehe.

Not trying to search is not a path. Not trying to search = Not on a path. 

Trying not to search is different, here there is someone searching to stop searching, and that is right, all seeking is equally pointless. 

Edited August 9, 2020 by traveler

[Grateful Dead]

fake it till you make it

[Marten]

@Nak Khid  This is what beginners do until they realize everything is Love and that what makes you happy is to just BE YOURSELF.

[Nate0068]

How to become enlightened? Well your the one who’s gonna be enlightened and only you so it’s up to you to enlighten yourself l.

[Nahm]

8 hours ago, Nak Khid said:

You can become enlightened by choice 

What do you mean by enlightenment? 

What do you mean by choice?

What is it, literally?

8 hours ago, Nak Khid said:

rather than mediating or taking a psychedelic and expecting it to come to you 
but it's not an easy choice to make because you have to start living it 
and many people don't really want everything that comes with it 
just what they select out of it 

What does living it look like to you?