All About Pleasures?

[Electron]

The only reason enlightenment sounds plausible to us is because it too has a price of bliss in the end. If enlightenment would offer a lot of awareness with a lot of pain and misery instead, why would someone want to go that road.  More generally, the only reason people sacrifice pleasures is to gain a more permanent state of pleasure in the future. So one way or another, there is always a higher price of pleasure we seek. When we are kids, we are involved in instant gratification, then as we mature we realize that there is a more effective way to gain pleasures which are more permanent and that is to get out of our habits of instant gratification and sacrifice certain things for the future, then as we mature even further we realize that there is an even more permanent state which involves the surrender of our ego. 

So  Isn't everything that we do is a trajectory from pain to pleasure ?

[Flicker_boy]

fortunatelly it also takes away your need for pleasure eventually, so all is well. just die already

[Atom]

@InsidesOutDon't die Lorenzo 

Edited August 5, 2016 by Atom

[Atom]

22 minutes ago, InsidesOut said:

just die already

Are you talking to your ego? 

Edited August 5, 2016 by Atom

[FindingPeace]

1 hour ago, Electron said:

So  Isn't everything that we do is a trajectory from pain to pleasure ?

This is still operating from a paradigm of duality. In enlightenment, in theory, we become no-dual. So there are no more opposites or divisions: no more pain and pleasure, good or bad, right or wrong. It is to assume that in enlightenment the absence of suffering equals the presence of joy - that if it isn't one thing it must be the other. My interpretation is that things become neural and peaceful. Peace of mind. Perhaps this is bliss, but that doesn't make it either pain or pleasure. Just peace.

Enlightenment isn't a hedonic pursuit of constant gratification. It is the absense of all of these things. Including any negative emotions. It is simply just 'being' and just 'allowing' life to live.

 

[Falk]

2 hours ago, Electron said:

The only reason enlightenment sounds plausible to us is because it too has a price of bliss in the end. 

So  Isn't everything that we do is a trajectory from pain to pleasure ?

Funny, i was thinking the same yesterday, and the answer might be yes, maybe...  But i decided this isn´t a very profound or meaningful realization i made. It is just another idea we can have ... 

Who is asking this question? What implications does this question have? 

Is the ego proud that it can make such statements as "everything is just a trajectory from pain to pleasure?"

And do you ultimately limit yourself by taking these questions too serious?

(and is my ego proud, that it gave this reply? or what are my intentions? who am i anyways?  )

Edited August 5, 2016 by Falk

[Falk]

1 minute ago, Wormon Blatburm said:

The pursuit of egoic pleasure is hell. It looks nice, but its like chasing the horizon, you never really get ahold of it.

says who?

[Falk]

8 minutes ago, Wormon Blatburm said:

Your entire life and goals are about the ego. 

 

Beeing all about the ego is the first step in psychological evolution, having an ego feels relativly pleasurable, we feel "powerful" or "safe" in a context where our ego "wins".

This state is better than total unawareness, the ego-state is a primitive state of awareness, but the journey must go on...

As i understand @Electron he isn´t promoting egoic pursuit of pleasure, he just stated that enlightenment wouldn´t be a "goal" for most people if it would mean more suffering.

[Falk]

5 minutes ago, Wormon Blatburm said:

My post is still on point because ...

You noticed how funny this statement is in the context of talking about the ego?  

[Falk]

6 minutes ago, Wormon Blatburm said:

You seem to think ego = arrogance. The arrogant side of human beings. But that's not really the case if you study enlightenment.

That´s an interessting question, what is the ego, how to define it?

I would say the ego might be defined as : the sum of your thoughts, feelings, visions & hearings, interpreted as beeing a solid self. 

(so the idea of the ego is based on the idea ... "here is a bunch of input... that it you!!" without doing the meta-analysis and asking "who is taking up all this input?")

[Eelco1981]

@Electron Pleasure implies there is an opposite: pain. Enlightenment has no opposites. it is peace. Peace with what is. That is why I pursue enlightenment. The second reason for me personally is Truth; I want to know what is the Truth. But yes, on the other hand, you might want to promise your mind/ego some pleasure to convince it to commit suicide. Maybe that is comparable to Islamic promises (I am no way expert in that field BTW) that if you kill your Self, you will get some virgins in the end. Isn't that the promise of peace after your ego is annihilated?  If so, it is completely misinterpreted by Islamic suicide bombers....

[Flicker_boy]

7 hours ago, Atom said:

Are you talking to your ego? 

maybe. but then, who is talking to it?? is it the bag of attention?

[Atom]

1 minute ago, InsidesOut said:

maybe. but then, who is talking to it?? is it the bag of attention?

I know who you are talking to 

[Flicker_boy]

@FindingPeace  don't forget the incredible awesomeness of anything existing at all

[Flicker_boy]

@Atom prove it or I declare witchcraft and/or bullshit

[Atom]

12 hours ago, InsidesOut said:

@Atom prove it or I declare witchcraft and/or bullshit

I've been called worse.. 

You know my grandfather was from Brazil?

Take care brother and I didn't mean to come off as a wiseguy when I shared the Google Search link instead of a direct link to the video you requested last night.. Hope I didn't offend you doing so

[WelcometoReality]

@Electron For me it was all about finding the truth.  No matter what obstacles there was,  including pain,  I just had to know. So the driving force does not need to be pleasure. But we will always prefer pleasure over pain, that is just a part of the humaness.

[Flicker_boy]

@Atom no offense s2s2s2

Edited August 6, 2016 by InsidesOut

[key]

@Electron

The majority probably shoot for enlightenment on the promise of peaceful bliss, but I find the search for Truth to be more alluring. To find what's real.

Question everything and you'll find your life is mostly led by illusions, without any great awakening needed, and those realisations can be more than enough motivation for our 'search'

[Leo Gura]

You have no idea yet how radical enlightenment insights are. They will utterly transform your entire relationship to reality. You cannot judge enlightenment from your current position AT ALL. Like ZERO. You have no idea how radical it is. Your wildest imaginations of it are still infinitely far away from the majesty of Absolute Truth. It's more radical than being abducted by aliens and taken to live on an alien planet. Everything gets turned upside down. The pursuit of anything becomes laughable. You are already 100% complete, infinite! There is nothing to pursue, and nothing to avoid.

Imagine you became God. Now... do you still care about pleasure & pain? Do you care about anything human at all? What can you do but just cry and laugh in delight at your own infinite magnificence and limitless, boundless being?