Using Spiral Dynamics to Help Get Sex Offenders Punished?

[Consciousone35]

https://rainn.org/statistics/scope-problem

Only 5 out of every 1000 sex offenders will spend a day in prison. Clearly something is very wrong with society and the way our system deals with sexual predators. As my life purpose is helping to get sexual offenders punished more and help launch investigations into sex trafficking and pedophile rings, how can I utilize spiral dynamics to accomplish these goals? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. 

[Rilles]

Why do you assume SD would help you with that?

[Parththakkar12]

1 hour ago, Consciousone35 said:

https://rainn.org/statistics/scope-problem

Only 5 out of every 1000 sex offenders will spend a day in prison. Clearly something is very wrong with society and the way our system deals with sexual predators. As my life purpose is helping to get sexual offenders punished more and help launch investigations into sex trafficking and pedophile rings, how can I utilize spiral dynamics to accomplish these goals? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. 

You're looking to evolve the people in these rings, who are at Stage Red to Blue.

If you really want to help them, I'd suggest studying the psychology of psychopaths, sociopaths and narcissists. Psychopaths and sociopaths get stuck at Red because they don't have the capacity to prioritize acting according to a moral ideology, the way most normal people can. Normal people who are at Blue and above can suppress their emotions and act according to an ideology, which helps us have basic integrity of action, i.e. our actions can match our words. This isn't the case for them.

The mind needs to be able to rationalize why it did what it did. So, once they go through an ego reaction, their mind will come up with a moral justification for why they did that. You may feel like you have their morality. But, the next time, they will do something opposite of their previously held morality and their mind will come up with a totally different morality to justify what they did! Because this whole process is subconscious, they will not see themselves doing this. In fact, they themselves will fully believe that they did it because of the morality they stated. This isn't true morality, it's ego-reactivity covered by fake morality. This is Red that's unable to evolve to Blue.

Integrity will not be important to them. If you show them a lack of integrity, they will not feel shame for having broken their integrity, in fact they will have a reaction of 'Haha! Gotcha, didn't I?'

A lot of times they're physically unable to suppress their emotions. You need that ability in order to decide to act according to your moral ideology. There is only one way with them. Give them emotional mastery practices. If their emotional reactivity has gotten them in a lot of trouble in the past, they will grab it with both hands. This could involve psychedelics. When they see their connection to other people, they won't need a morality to act like a good person.

[Forestluv]

In terms of higher SD levels, I would suggest expanding beyond simply catching and imprisoning sex offenders. That is certainly an important component, yet if we want to actually reduce the numbers of sex offenses in society we would also need to consider an address other components that contribute to high rates of sex offenses. 

[Leo Gura]

7 hours ago, Consciousone35 said:

As my life purpose is helping to get sexual offenders punished

Be careful, this is a toxic life purpose that will take you down a dark road.

This is a misuse of the teachings.

This is the classic trap of the lesser Jihad.

It is a distraction from uprooting your own devilry.

[Carl-Richard]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Be careful, this is a toxic life purpose that will take you down a dark road.

This is a misuse of the teachings.

This is the classic trap of the lesser Jihad.

It is a distraction from uprooting your own devilry.

 

[VerballyHazardous]

Would be more positive if your life purpose was to stop people from becoming sex offenders.

Edited July 28, 2020 by VerballyHazardous

[LaucherJunge]

Right a good life purpose would be either helping the victims or prevention.
But of course a punishment which is taken seriously might prevent it to a small degree as well.

[Hansu]

Something is a little off about this thread. Seems like a troll to me.

On the off chance tho, do you want sex offenders to spend more time in prisons to punish them or to reform them? You do know that USA prisons are more like relapse centers than reform centers right?

[Consciousone35]

I want sex offenders to both get sent to prison more and face harsher sentences and for the public to learn to detect and out sex offenders more. I want to help fund and support investigations into pedophile rings and so on. Yes, this is a life purpose that delves into very dark stuff but simply meditating and being nice isn’t going to help it. Most sex offenders could hardly care less about “love” and they take an extremely narcissistic form of enlightenment and spirituality where people are objects sent to them by the gods. Notice how pedophiles describe children like objects. You can’t simply just “reform” sex offenders. They are hungry for power and dominance and know they’re ruining people’s lives but don’t care.

 

I think a mauve perspective doesn’t have any views on sexual assault. A red perspective simply wants to punish sex offenders, blue is also like that but views the issue as having a root cause. Green focuses more and “reforming” them but once that doesn’t work a yellow perspective is formed where sexual assault is a power issue enabled by root flaws in society.

I have no idea what a coral perspective on sexual assault would be.

I love applying spiral dynamics to topics like sexual assault, diet, and domestic abuse. I think the model has a lot of potential in things even like how to play Chess, it’s such a diverse model

[Apparition of Jack]

@Consciousone35 Listen dude, I don't know you and I have no idea what your life situation is like, but I can't help but feel there's a really unhealthy reason behind you wanting to do this. You mention sex offenders taking an extremely narcissistic form of enlightenment, which is weird because I assume most sex offenders don't even know about or care what enlightenment is. It sounds like to me are you are dealing with some sort of need for revenge or "justice" from something you may or may not have witnessed personally that you want to enact out in the world but aren't fully thinking through the consequences of such a path.

Yes a life purpose isn't about being "nice" but it isn't about being needlessly vindictive and single-minded either. Put it this way - if you put all your time and effort into prosecuting sex offenders (and only sex offenders for some reason), you'll have wasted all that time you could've used to find a more holistic and uplifting life purpose and developed and grown as a person yourself. Focusing on this one, singular issue will keep you undeveloped and surrounded by negative energy preventing you from living a better life.

There's probably a much healthier, visionary and holistic life purpose for you out there. It could even involve the legal system, but just not in a way that's focused on hate / revenge and instead focused on love / upliftment. You could be a public defender for instance, helping to defend people who don't have the money for a private lawyer, or you could get into corporate law and hold corporations to account for this misdeeds, and so on.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Apparition of Jack

[Carl-Richard]

2 hours ago, Consciousone35 said:

I want sex offenders to both get sent to prison more and face harsher sentences and for the public to learn to detect and out sex offenders more.

This is a fault of stage blue thinking: dividing people into offenders and victims and focusing on the offenders. The law is supposed to protect the people, not punish them.

[Parththakkar12]

3 hours ago, Consciousone35 said:

I want sex offenders to both get sent to prison more and face harsher sentences and for the public to learn to detect and out sex offenders more. I want to help fund and support investigations into pedophile rings and so on. Yes, this is a life purpose that delves into very dark stuff but simply meditating and being nice isn’t going to help it. Most sex offenders could hardly care less about “love” and they take an extremely narcissistic form of enlightenment and spirituality where people are objects sent to them by the gods. Notice how pedophiles describe children like objects. You can’t simply just “reform” sex offenders. They are hungry for power and dominance and know they’re ruining people’s lives but don’t care.

 

I think a mauve perspective doesn’t have any views on sexual assault. A red perspective simply wants to punish sex offenders, blue is also like that but views the issue as having a root cause. Green focuses more and “reforming” them but once that doesn’t work a yellow perspective is formed where sexual assault is a power issue enabled by root flaws in society.

I have no idea what a coral perspective on sexual assault would be.

I love applying spiral dynamics to topics like sexual assault, diet, and domestic abuse. I think the model has a lot of potential in things even like how to play Chess, it’s such a diverse model

You do sound like you have a chip on your shoulder on this issue. I'd put you on Stage Green relative to this issue. I'd suggest you do activism relative to this issue. You'd be able to maybe resurrect #MeToo or start something else like that on social media.

When I say activism I mean going on the streets and protesting, doing ground-level activism. You can join some sort of NGO that does this. They'll have their policy proposals they'll push for. You can choose which one you're passionate about and be the loud voice that gets it done.

[Consciousone35]

25 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

You do sound like you have a chip on your shoulder on this issue. I'd put you on Stage Green relative to this issue. I'd suggest you do activism relative to this issue. You'd be able to maybe resurrect #MeToo or start something else like that on social media.

When I say activism I mean going on the streets and protesting, doing ground-level activism. You can join some sort of NGO that does this. They'll have their policy proposals they'll push for. You can choose which one you're passionate about and be the loud voice that gets it done.

 

I could very well try to resurrect #metoo. I also want to help fund investigations into pedophile rings and help reform laws that make it to where reports of sexual offense are taken more seriously. There are a lot of things I could to help out this massive issue, nearly all of us know someone who is the victim of a sexual predator.

I’ve learned a lot from getting that psychopath sex offender a permanent record. Keep in mind he was someone who not only sexually assaulted multiple women, in one instance a child, he would threaten to murder families and children if his victims wouldn’t fulfill his demands, and he did things like beat up his victims, break into their houses, do meth, bash their heads against the wall, try to kill their fetuses by kicking them even though he was the one who got them pregnant against their will, so many things I’ve forgotten some of it. It’s important to gather evidence and report it to the proper authorities so investigatons can be launched. I could help set up a system where it’s easier for Sexual Assault survivors to report. Survivors not reporting is a huge issue because it can cause them to relive the trauma. I can use spiral dynamics to set up systems where it’s easier and less stressful for survivors to report but how would I do that, any ideas?

Edited July 28, 2020 by Consciousone35

[Raze]

On 7/27/2020 at 1:08 PM, Consciousone35 said:

https://rainn.org/statistics/scope-problem

Only 5 out of every 1000 sex offenders will spend a day in prison. Clearly something is very wrong with society and the way our system deals with sexual predators. As my life purpose is helping to get sexual offenders punished more and help launch investigations into sex trafficking and pedophile rings, how can I utilize spiral dynamics to accomplish these goals? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. 

Rainn uses many exaggerated or false statistics, find better sources for raw data like the FBI. Using the wrong data can result in time wasting or hurt the cause, there are many instances of this.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Raze

[AlwaysBeNice]

18 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Be careful, this is a toxic life purpose that will take you down a dark road.

This is a misuse of the teachings.

This is the classic trap of the lesser Jihad.

It is a distraction from uprooting your own devilry.

No it's not. Well depends on how you define punished, but served justice and be put to jail, and help these people be kept from damaging others and themselves... "Justice, not revenge". If you've seen some of the damage they caused, you wouldn't speak like this, I think it's a topic of research still new to you. Seeing some of these documentaries can make you livid truly.

I can very much understand OP. It's also true that helping yourself connects us with the good and also helps the good overall, we don't necessarily need to bust criminals but that's good.

[Parththakkar12]

1 hour ago, Consciousone35 said:

I could help set up a system where it’s easier for Sexual Assault survivors to report. Survivors not reporting is a huge issue because it can cause them to relive the trauma. I can use spiral dynamics to set up systems where it’s easier and less stressful for survivors to report but how would I do that, any ideas?

You're not gonna like my answer to this one. Reporting is fully the responsibility of the survivor. If the survivor doesn't report, nobody can save them.

Don't mistake the following for victim-blaming. I'm looking at the objective facts here.

If you are a survivor, you have gotten yourself in a position in life where you're getting abused. Technically you are responsible for where you stand. It's an unbelievably bitter pill to swallow, but it is the unfortunate reality. Now, this is your fight. You're gonna have to be willing to use all your strength to fight your abuser, no matter the consequences. You are dealing with someone who is willing to cause you more harm than you are to them. This will have to change.

The system is a tool you can use to fight them. It is also a tool they can use to fight you. We know how court cases go, shit gets ugly. This is the real reason for under-reporting - that the fight for justice can get ugly and brutal. A survivor will have to be willing to fight hard, reporting is only step 1.

Edit: I'll mention why nobody can save a survivor who doesn't report. Because if there's no victim on paper, there's no crime, so no action.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Parththakkar12

[Consciousone35]

9 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

You're not gonna like my answer to this one. Reporting is fully the responsibility of the survivor. If the survivor doesn't report, nobody can save them.

Don't mistake the following for victim-blaming. I'm looking at the objective facts here.

If you are a survivor, you have gotten yourself in a position in life where you're getting abused. Technically you are responsible for where you stand. It's an unbelievably bitter pill to swallow, but it is the unfortunate reality. Now, this is your fight. You're gonna have to be willing to use all your strength to fight your abuser, no matter the consequences. You are dealing with someone who is willing to cause you more harm than you are to them. This will have to change.

The system is a tool you can use to fight them. It is also a tool they can use to fight you. We know how court cases go, shit gets ugly. This is the real reason for under-reporting - that the fight for justice can get ugly and brutal. A survivor will have to be willing to fight hard, reporting is only step 1.

Edit: I'll mention why nobody can save a survivor who doesn't report. Because if there's no victim on paper, there's no crime, so no action.

Definitely with the current system not only do survivors have to report, they have to fight just to get those who hurt them to face justice. Out of the entire group of women the offender I got a permanent record on, only one was willing to fight. I actually had to contact his other victims and even still only some of them even reported to the police even though they all confirmed to me who he is. Clearly the way our system deals with sexual assault is beyond incompetent and needs changes. However it’s a tricky topic and it’s quite a journey to use spiral dynamics to help evolve the system to deal with this heinous issue.

The issue is most survivors simply want to get past the trauma and simply reporting leads to flashbacks. Sexual assault is one of the most traumatizing things that can happen to you. There needs to be a system in place where victims are encouraged and congratulated for reporting in our culture instead of being dismissed as they often are.

[Parththakkar12]

48 minutes ago, Consciousone35 said:

The issue is most survivors simply want to get past the trauma and simply reporting leads to flashbacks. Sexual assault is one of the most traumatizing things that can happen to you. There needs to be a system in place where victims are encouraged and congratulated for reporting in our culture instead of being dismissed as they often are.

There is a deep reason society doesn't like victims reporting and why it's a fight. Collectively, we'd rather turn a blind eye to sexual assault rather than face the reality. If we face the reality, we'll have to take responsibility for it and admit to enabling it.

I'd highly recommend you watch Leo's video on The Devil, or 'The Mechanics of Evil'. If you understand that video, you'll understand me when I say this: A fight for justice doesn't really contribute much to society. I mean yeah, it puts a bad actor in jail, but we're still resisting the problem of evil. Justice is fundamentally about survival of the collective. It is fundamentally about upholding the integrity of the rules of the community, which is a collective survival function. This is why it can get very difficult for you to create a society where victims are encouraged to report and fight for it, because survival isn't inherently exciting, or inspiring, or meaningful. I'm not commenting on the fairness/unfairness of this, the point is to look at it from society's perspective.

If you really want a solution to the issue of sexual assault, I have a much better solution. Start by looking at your life and seeing how you enable the issue of sexual assault. Leo talks about this in his video on Evil, that it is a part of You. I'd highly recommend waking up to this reality first, before you really take action.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Parththakkar12

[Consciousone35]

23 minutes ago, Parththakkar12 said:

There is a deep reason society doesn't like victims reporting and why it's a fight. Collectively, we'd rather turn a blind eye to sexual assault rather than face the reality. If we face the reality, we'll have to take responsibility for it and admit to enabling it.

I'd highly recommend you watch Leo's video on The Devil, or 'The Mechanics of Evil'. If you understand that video, you'll understand me when I say this: A fight for justice doesn't really contribute much to society. I mean yeah, it puts a bad actor in jail, but we're still resisting the problem of evil. Justice is fundamentally about survival of the collective. It is fundamentally about upholding the integrity of the rules of the community, which is a collective survival function. This is why it can get very difficult for you to create a society where victims are encouraged to report and fight for it, because survival isn't inherently exciting, or inspiring, or meaningful. I'm not commenting on the fairness/unfairness of this, the point is to look at it from society's perspective.

If you really want a solution to the issue of sexual assault, I have a much better solution. Start by looking at your life and seeing how you enable the issue of sexual assault. Leo talks about this in his video on Evil, that it is a part of You. I'd highly recommend waking up to this reality first, before you really take action.

A large part of the solution is to use Stage 2 thinking to help reform laws and engineer society to take it more seriously and perhaps even create a cultural meme where reporting on and exposing predators is seen as brave and honorable. Can you tell me how I am misunderstanding reality?