Posted July 26, 2020 3 minutes ago, VeganAwake said: its unknowable How do you know? “If you have no confidence in yourself, you are twice defeated in the race of life. But with confidence you have won, even before you start.” -- Marcus Garvey Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 45 minutes ago, RedLine said: Yes, I know you are very practical-oriented; but the point is it this is not about me, this is not about subjectivity. How "my" subjectivity is does not change how the subjectiviy of the rest of the people is. I'm just a speck of dust in a world of 6.000 M people. I feel like we’re playing Headbands. It is about you. The problem you’re encountering is the belief love isn’t about you. It’s like a car talking about metal saying it’s not about me while the car is essentially metal. There are other people only due to “your” subjectivity, which is why the inquiry is looping back to you. The belief “everything is love is subjective bias” is the subjective bias. MEDITATIONS TOOLS ActualityOfBeing.com GUIDANCE SESSIONS NONDUALITY LOA My Youtube Channel THE TRUE NATURE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 @RedLine also another valuable thing to consider is that despite each perspective having its own view , suffering/love, doesn’t necessarily mean anything about Reality or a possible Creator. Lots of people get bent out of shape and feel horrible about life because suffering exists or even worse that because suffering exists it means that Reality or a Creator is flawed, twisted or evil. These are just idea’s with no real basis other then logic that make sense to them. Again this is not arguing for or proving the good of or existence of Reality, just pointing to assumptions that are held as Truths and cause degrees of suffering. I’m sure you’ve heard this before but there’s pain and then there’s fear, tightening, dreading, anger, frustration and all sorts of added reactions to pain or the possibility of pain happening again and/or again every time that familiar habit you or I have that always seems to cause pain or discomfort. For a lot its the dreaded work day and the all sorts of suffering people have about it. But it’s often not work itself but the ideas around work or a particular boss or person or emotions that come up at work or how work takes you away from what you prefer. More for others it’s a trauma around something and every time that particular thing occurs the pain in relationship to the trauma happens and the person things it’s the thing itself and not the trauma they had anbout the thing. I’m rambling now, but I hope your seeing the direction I’m pointing towards Guidance and Awakening into the Unknown My YouTube Insights Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Nahm said: . The belief “everything is love is subjective bias” is the subjective bias. Finally you get the point. Everything is subjective is a bias. Why I am doing by stating " Everything is Love is subjective bias" is denying the beleief Being=Love. I am not defining Being nor giving it properties. 11 minutes ago, Nahm said: The problem you’re encountering is the belief love isn’t about you. It’s like a car talking about metal saying it’s not about me while the car is essentially metal. There are other people only due to “your” subjectivity, which is why the inquiry is looping back to you. Just go to the question men: do you think people in concentration camps, people dying of hunger or wars, regular people suffering day to day are enjoying life? is it a Love manifestation? is it God manifesting through them? So what if I become enlighten, does it change the suffer of that poor people? Edited July 26, 2020 by RedLine Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 @RedLine 3 hours ago, RedLine said: If you are in a non-dual state and you experience God, you experience that everything is love, but it does not mean that the rest of the people are experience that. The same happens when you are depress and you deeply think the world is shit; an on the contrary, when you are very glad you think the world is wonderful. Maybe the world is Love from your enlighment perspective, you can deeply feeling it, but it does not mean that the world is Love, in general terms. What about the holocaust? What about the daily suffering of people? Oh yeah they are not actually suffering, it is just an illusion! You founding it through enlighment! It is bullshit. You are prioritizing your subjectivity over that of others. Why should your subjectivity be more important than that of others? In short: even though you may have the deepest experience / intuition that the world is love, this does not imply that the Being is love; it only implies that the Being is love FOR YOU. The proof that everything is not love is that you chose the path of enlightenment over not taking it, because you knew there is suffering, and that it is better to get out of that suffering than to be in that suffering. The misunderstandings of non-duality and being God is true, because people misunderstand what the Ein Sof is, why the Ein Sof reincarnates in each sephirot, and why the Kabbala/tree of life is structured, why each sephirot's are arranged separately as realms yet are connected to each other. The misunderstanding lies mostly with existing within Malkuth, the physical realm, and interpreting other realms and spirit through Malkuth and not, say, raising your consciousness using spiritual methods, astral projecting and channeling into each sphere energetically and so on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 @RedLine Almost, but you missed what I said there. MEDITATIONS TOOLS ActualityOfBeing.com GUIDANCE SESSIONS NONDUALITY LOA My Youtube Channel THE TRUE NATURE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 40 minutes ago, Gesundheit said: How do you know? 'I' don't know... but it could be said that a limited mind cannot grasp Infinity. How can sense be made out of something that's senseless infinite purposeless pointless. How can everything be grasped. It can't be pinned down because it's infinite. So when you unknow it, you get to Dance with the Devil in the pale moonlight. “Everything is honoured, but nothing matters.” — Eckhart Tolle. "I have lived on the lip of insanity, wanting to know reasons, knocking on a door. It opens. I've been knocking from the inside." -- Rumi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Nahm said: @RedLine Almost, but you missed what I said there. The key question is: is suffer also love? My answer is no. Your answer is yes. Maybe I change my mind in the future if a go deep in spirituality and see reality whith new eyes so I start to believe that experience in concentration camps or the death of your sons is still a form of love but I don't t think it will happened. Edited July 26, 2020 by RedLine Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 Quote James123 said: Love is giving people whatever they need. If cat is hungry go fed them, if flower need water give water. Love is sharing, everything till nothing left within you. Than you will realize what is the enlightenment or selfless is Thats what LOVE IS. This is UNCONDITIONAL LOVE. Additionally, dont ever get confused with non dual state and love. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 @RedLine You assume much. MEDITATIONS TOOLS ActualityOfBeing.com GUIDANCE SESSIONS NONDUALITY LOA My Youtube Channel THE TRUE NATURE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 @RedLine 6 minutes ago, RedLine said: The key question is: is suffer also love? My answer is no. Your answer is yes. Maybe I change my mind in the future if a go deep in spirituality and see reality whith new eyes so I start to believe that experience in concentration camps or the death of your sons is still a form of love but I don't t think it will happened. Is suffering also love? My answer would be it depends. If I'm the one perpetrating evil, for example killing people, then I'm in conditional love of what that brings in my experiences, yet I would be suffering prior, during and after each killing. If I'm the one victimized, of course I would be suffering from not experiencing the love that is normal to me, yet some people do derive some enjoyment in being victimized, aka masochistic desires of that suffering. Revenge cycles are also interesting cases of love, too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 2 minutes ago, Nahm said: @RedLine You assume much. just answer this simple question in a clear way please: is suffer (ego) love or is the opposite to love? and don't play language tricks. I think we are going close to the point now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 When I saw the title I was like uh oh... prepare for Leo-attack - Enter your fear and you are free - Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 @RedLine Language tricks...? All there is is love. Love is absolute, and has no opposite. Suffering is the ignoring of truth. (Love = Truth). MEDITATIONS TOOLS ActualityOfBeing.com GUIDANCE SESSIONS NONDUALITY LOA My Youtube Channel THE TRUE NATURE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 4 hours ago, RedLine said: In short: even though you may have the deepest experience / intuition that the world is love, this does not imply that the Being is love; it only implies that the Being is love FOR YOU. This is not actually the case. You see, understanding what the phrases 'Everything is Love', or 'Reality is Love' mean requires an extremely radical shift in consciousness which is far beyond your normal state, and is also far beyond even ego death. Has God realised itself through your body/mind? This is the kind of level of consciousness required. This simply cannot be understood at 'normal' human consciousness. At the highest levels of consciousness, the actual substrate of reality is recognised as Love, and that this Love is Absolute because it is Infinite and Eternal. Every happening that has ever occurred is literally Pure Love. Just because one individual is not conscious of this does not mean it isn't an absolute, or that its only true 'for you' as you say. Truth is not dependant on 'individual humans' being conscious of it, otherwise it wouldn't be absolute. "Find what you love and let it kill you." - Charles Bukowski Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 (edited) Looping back to you. Yeah always, that's how mindfuck of a thing this is. Just.... Edited July 26, 2020 by zeroISinfinity Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 4 minutes ago, Nahm said: @RedLine All there is is love. Love is absolute, and has no opposite. Suffering is the ignoring of truth. (Love = Truth). This is a logical contradiction. You are saying Love has no opposite and suffering is its opposite at the same time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 17 minutes ago, RedLine said: just answer this simple question in a clear way please: is suffer (ego) love or is the opposite to love? and don't play language tricks. I think we are going close to the point now. I don't think you are. I realize you didn't ask my opinion but the meaning of your question is anyone's guess. I think you would do better by answering Nahm's question: what do you know, except subjectively? I vehemently disagree with Nahm about the broader issues by the way. Neither do I intend to support their (mis)use of language in this thread. I only agree that it is a good question. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 2 minutes ago, RedLine said: This is a logical contradiction. You are saying Love has no opposite and suffering is its opposite at the same time. No, they said "Suffering is the ignoring of truth" and "Love = Truth". You brought "opposite" into this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted July 26, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, commie said: No, they said "Suffering is the ignoring of truth" and "Love = Truth". You brought "opposite" into this. ignorance is the same as ausence, so negation of anyways, what is ignorance then? you just change the label suffer for ignorance. It doest explain anything about the question Edited July 26, 2020 by RedLine Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
