Why must life be so counterintuitive?

[Leo Gura]

@Florian Well, just as an example, Peter Ralston awoke and then went on to become a world class martial artist and he won some world class combat tournaments.

Awakening is not as restrictive as you imagine. It frees you up to do whatever will make you happiest. God is not gonna force you to do anything you don't want to do.

[Florian]

@Leo Gura Bruh this is fucking scaring me. I don't think this will get through to me completely yet, but at least I get some better understanding of fear since I see right now how my own fears work haha

and also just wanna say thank you for your life purpose course and the other stuff you made. especially the life purpose course helped me a lot and I appreciate it. If I should become rich someday (you can read my life purpose journal to know how I plan to do it hehe) I already thought of donating a lot to you.

[Florian]

@Leo Gura Could you actually be an awokened murderer or something like that? To me it actually seems like you could and deep down I do resonate with this 

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Florian It frees you up to do whatever 

but there is still something in me doubting it immensely

[Sempiternity]

31 minutes ago, wwhy said:

So I wake from the dream, but at the same time still continue dreaming?

Also, why was it meaningless? What then, is meaningful?

An awakening is waking up from the dream to the truth of your existence, to infinity. Remembering. Then you come back to the dream, your body, your point of view. You won't have the present moment experience of infinity, but will have the knowledge of it. 

Existence is both meaningless and infinitely meaningful. There is no meaning to nothingness, yet there is meaning because you God created it. 

[Kingston]

@Florian

Everything you said and questioned is based on deep fear, but these fears are legit, ain’t nothing really wrong with that. So go do you  

but you haven’t mindfully suffer enough yet 

This path will be appealing to you if you consciously suffer a lot and try to be open minded at the same time. 
Or just go take some psychedelics, and you’ll know what it is all about, if you dare

Psychedelic has been the best fuckinggggg thing ever that I’ve encountered in my life. Thanks to Leo  
Well,  nowadays I still pursue all of my previous materialistic goals, ain’t nothing wrong about that. It’s just now I’m doing in a more conscious and loving way. Life is amazing.  cuz in the end , you’ll be God/ be in Love no matter what. Peace.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Kingston

[wwhy]

@Jed Vassallo

"Only when you wake from the dream can you understand that it was all meaningless, just an experience you dreamt up to experience."

"Existence is both meaningless and infinitely meaningful. There is no meaning to nothingness, yet there is meaning because you God created it. "

So if it is both meaningless and infinitely meaningful, why does awakening only bring about the understanding of the meaninglessness of life? Don't we already find life meaningless or meaningful in our non-awakened states? Or to put it another way, isn't meaning just another mental construct?

Edited July 24, 2020 by wwhy

[Leo Gura]

24 minutes ago, Florian said:

@Leo Gura Could you actually be an awokened murderer or something like that?

Dude, once you discover Love, all that nonsense will fly out the window.

Stop screwing around and FOCUS ON PURSUING LOVE!

LOVE!

[Florian]

@Kingston actually I'm doing that right now this mindfull suffering. I'm becoming mindfull/conscious of it and then I try to find out the roots and let it go. Idk about Psychedelics, I took a little bit of shrooms once (only half a gram or so I think) and I actually had this experience where I "got it" like what life actually is and that death is really nothing and if I would fall of a cliff that would actually not really be so terrible like I thought before. When that was on only half a gram of shrooms I guess there can be much more propably more then I can even imagine how much more, but I don't have motivation for it right now and also a lot of fear I guess. I said to myself that I will get into psychelics when I am 30 but now that I think about it again I remember one of the reasons why I didn't want to do it again was because at the time I was really worried about getting a psychosis or something from it, since I smoked some weed some weeks before and that kinda fucked with me since I was very paranoid in that time in general. (didnt smoke weed since then again) 

Edit: by right now I meant literally after writing these messages 

Edited July 24, 2020 by Florian

[electroBeam]

@Elshaddai you're so tricked that even when people on here give you the answer black and white, you're still fucken deluded!

Its like a guy telling a girl all of the pickup techniques he's using on his woman, and the woman is still attracted to him. 

[Florian]

@Leo Gura Could you take a look into my life purpose journal to just see if it's obviously not about love and I just can't see it? Because I kinda believe it is and I am giving the world my gift with it if you know what I mean, but I also still have doubt about it and believe it's just selfish and I only want to do it for my personal gain. (it's in the journal section of this forum and just called Life Purpose Journal, I don't know how to link it sry, it's also at my last post on my profile)

 

[wwhy]

@Jed Vassallo

54 minutes ago, Jed Vassallo said:

An awakening is waking up from the dream to the truth of your existence, to infinity. Remembering. Then you come back to the dream, your body, your point of view. You won't have the present moment experience of infinity, but will have the knowledge of it. 

Existence is both meaningless and infinitely meaningful. There is no meaning to nothingness, yet there is meaning because you God created it. 

I think I get what you're trying to say, allow me to rephrase:

Awakening is about gaining knowledge, a new perspective on life. You realize that this life is not the end-be-all of your existence, and every thing is alright, because one day you will awaken from it like a dream.

Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream, merrily merrily merrily merrily, life is but a dream.

Hakuna matatata!

The words of the Teacher, son of David, king in Jerusalem: "Meaningless! Meaningless!" says the Teacher. “Utterly meaningless! Everything is meaningless. - Ecclesiastes 1:1-4

I have seen all the things that are done under the sun; all of them are meaningless, a chasing after the wind. - Ecclesiastes 1:14

Edited July 24, 2020 by wwhy

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, electroBeam said:

you're still fucken deluded!

Take it easy. Don't be too aggressive here. We want to be welcoming to newbies.

[billiesimon]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

So God's trick must be extremely clever, otherwise God will see right through it and the illusion of immateriality will collapse before it even gets off the ground. This is why all of reality is so sneaky and deceptive.

I completely agree, based on my glimpses of awakening. It is a dream, but it is so damn clever and well directed that I competely fall back into Mind and believe in the story of my life again.

What I don't understand is... why is there a call to awaken? 

If god wants to play the game without knowing it is a game, why am I (and you too Leo) attracted to spiritual awakening?
In fact, I'm so attracted to it that I find satisfaction in dissolving the illusion of suffering and mind.

Why is that?

[hyruga]

Actually something is counter intuitive or not does not matter. 

For example, in Europe, more people play and watch football and the counter intuitive thing is to play/watch basketball. And in America, it is the reverse. 

So it is all based on your sets of beliefs and the cultures you are exposed to. You simply choose which one is better for you and you don't really have to care whether some thing is counter intuitive or not. Everything has pros and cons.

Edited July 24, 2020 by hyruga

[mandyjw]

@billiesimon Ever lost yourself so much in a game that you started having a miserable time, hated everyone you were playing with for being competitive with you, and completely forgot that the game was supposed to be fun and wanted to quit? 

Sometimes I think those of us who want to awaken us are just such sore losers who take everything so seriously that they ask to see through the premise of the whole thing. Once you're reminded that you're playing for sheer fun and not just your own fun, but everyone's fun, the entire game changes. 

 

[Gili Trawangan]

5 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

Sometimes I think those of us who want to awaken us are just such sore losers who take everything so seriously that they ask to see through the premise of the whole thing.

lol, I've thought about that before, certainly fits here 

[Member]

11 hours ago, blankisomeone said:

I was very scared in the dream, but then I suddenly somehow realized it was a dream and became conscious in it. I started to shout at everyone that it was just a dream and I was asking them to stop that insanity, because it's just a dream and there was no reason to be hurting themselves like that. But that didn't help, they continued doing it. I had no control over them, even though it was my own dream.

Ah lol, I had a similar dream only that I was in a classroom and two girls who wanted to commit suicide. I didn't become lucid but something even weirder happened. Despite trying to convince them that life is worth living, they killed themselves... moment when I started floating in a horizontal position like I was laying in an invisible bed and saw the whole world breaking apart (along with my body) until nothing remained. So basically what I witnessed was this:

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Unless you become so conscious that you transcend then entire domain of form. At which point it's just a pure formless consciousness.

... when I woke up, I realized that I was God imagining the entire Universe. So don't underestimate dreams because they can actually trigger huge awakenings. They aren't really that stupid and meaningless as most people think.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Member

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, billiesimon said:

What I don't understand is... why is there a call to awaken? 

If god wants to play the game without knowing it is a game, why am I (and you too Leo) attracted to spiritual awakening?
In fact, I'm so attracted to it that I find satisfaction in dissolving the illusion of suffering and mind.

Why is that?

Because the whole point of the dream was to create a foil for awakening. God cannot share the gift of Infinite Love with anyone because it is alone. Thus God can only share it with itself by forgetting it is God.

It is the ultimate act of Love.

You can only appreciate the infinite by enduring the limitions of the finite.

[billiesimon]

14 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Because the whole point of the dream was to create a foil for awakening. God cannot share the gift of Infinite Love with anyone because it is alone. Thus God can only share it with itself by forgetting it is God.

It is the ultimate act of Love.

You can only appreciate the infinite by enduring the limitions of the finite.

Well, simply amazing  

[Leo Gura]

8 minutes ago, billiesimon said:

Well, simply amazing  

Indeed, you are a-maze-in