Is Leo's view of time correct?

[remember]

@Anderz to unmanifest are only such and such probabilities which could be seen as some kind of unmanifesting warp. therefore the growing block theory would not work without the theory of now. i mean come on why does the now even exist if we have future and past?

[Leo Gura]

@Anderz Just stop. You don't know what you're talking about.

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Anderz said:

A state cannot do anything on its own.

So you're not a fan of non-duality?

[Girzo]

1 hour ago, Anderz said:

Consciousness is a state of being aware of the manifested information.

Consciousness is not a state but has the states.

If that use of the word doesn't sit with you well then use some other label, like God.

What is meant as Consciousness is that non-dual container of all matter/energy and information. The stuff that you can't get more fundamental with. The Source.

[Anderz]

@Leo Gura You mean "my" consciousness didn't imagine reality correctly? Maybe my consciousness was in deep dreamless sleep so that someone else imagined reality for me.

[DrewNows]

@Anderz this would make more sense if you could understand your astrological sign and how you view reality differently than someone like Leo. 

here's a great channel to explore in case you feeel drawn...

 

Edited July 8, 2020 by DrewNows

[Anderz]

Consciousness is not some object, field or substance nor nothing. Consciousness is an on/off state. But I will stop now.

Edited July 8, 2020 by Anderz

[Leo Gura]

@Anderz You keep digging your own hole.

[Carl-Richard]

29 minutes ago, Anderz said:

Consciousness is not some object, field or substance nor nothing. Consciousness is an on/off state. But I will stop now.

Have you met my buddy Brahman?

[Anderz]

Just one more thing: The claim that everything is relative, what does that say about that claim itself? An elephant can be larger than a mouse, but that's just a comparison, and the comparison is absolute, the elephant is absolutely larger than the mouse. The elephant is absolute and the mouse is absolute. And as an absurd yet valid example, if the mouse grows and becomes larger than the elephant, that's another comparison since it's about another point in time.

Edited July 8, 2020 by Anderz

[Anderz]

46 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Have you met my buddy Brahman?

Sorry, I couldn't resist: Yes, I have, and and I discovered that Brahman is a real number. Now I will stop.

[Leo Gura]

21 minutes ago, Anderz said:

the elephant is absolutely larger than the mouse.

Lol. You are confusing things.

The notion of "large" is what is relative. Nothing in the universe is "large" unless you specify some other thing RELATIVE TO which it would be large.

So, for example, if there only existed one object in the universe -- like one elephant -- it would be impossible to say whether it was large or not, since that notion is literally meaningless without some relative comparison.

Likewise, nothing in the universe is bad, or expensive, or upside-down, or ugly, or powerful, or hot, or fast, or heavy unless you compare it next to some other thing.

To put this very broadly: it is impossible for God to know what anything is other than by comparison to something else.

So, God himself cannot tell you how old God is because God is the only thing that exists and therefore there is no outside comparison which it could make to determine its own age. Hence God is timeless and Eternal.

Which is precisely why God is Absolute. And since God is everything, that means everything is Absolute. Which means that the relative and the absolute are identical.

[Anderz]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

... Which means that the relative and the absolute are identical.

Okay, that's an interesting point actually. I will think about it for a while.

[Anderz]

Yes, relative and absolute are both concepts I realize now. Shunyamurti talked about trans-conceptual awareness. That means awareness beyond the level of concepts that in ordinary consciousness the mind tends to get stuck in. So I will abandon my rantings about absolute and relative.

It's more useful to use the conceptual level to look at models of reality. I took another look at the Wolfram model and they define time like this:

Quote

"In our models, there is a fundamental unit of time (that we will call T) that represents the interval of time corresponding to a single updating event. This interval of time in a sense defines the scale for everything in our models.

Given T, there is an elementary length L, determined by the speed of light c according to:

L = c T

" - https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/2004/2004.08210.pdf

I like that. It means that when T gets smaller L gets shorter. And there is no limit to how small T can get. So that will work even for an insanely high "frame rate" (not some puny 240 Hz as in high-end gaming computers, haha). I will follow the Wolfram project to see what they come up with regarding this frame rate.

Edited July 8, 2020 by Anderz

[Anderz]

Another thing in the Wolfram model is that they allow the time scale to get smaller and smaller:

Quote

"An important point about scales is that there is no reason to think that elementary quantities measured with respect to our current system of units need be constant in the history of the universe. For example, if the universe effectively just splits every spatial graph edge in two, the number of elementary lengths in what we call 1 meter will double, and so the elementary length measured in meters will halve." - https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/2004/2004.08210.pdf

That explains how the amount of information in the universe can expand exponentially and higher, and still the appearance of length and time in our universe will remain stable. I think Leo mentioned an experience he had about zooming in into finer and finer scales towards infinity. That may be an actual experience of this principle.

[Girzo]

You can throw away such silly models while doing this work, they are of little help.

If the scientists working on them lack any mystical insight the chance that they will nail the problem in question is 0.00000001%.

 

[Anderz]

@Girzo That may be true from a nondual perspective but it's also important as Leo has pointed out to look at mainstream knowledge. Society has a huge inertia and needs to evolve as a wholeness. The Wolfram Physics Project is I believe a very important contribution to society.

[Member]

Last night I dreamed of a black cube floating above the infinite consciousness that absorbed information like a black hole ?

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Anderz said:

Yes, relative and absolute are both concepts I realize now.

No! Absolute is not a concept. Absolute is consciousness itself.

There is a concept of the absolute, but this is not the same as the Absolute itself. But also, it is!

Paradox here is a feature, not a bug.

Note: no amount of thinking or logic will get you to the actual Absolute.

Go take a psychedelic. It will save you a decade of deadends.

[remember]

1 hour ago, Member said:

Last night I dreamed of a black cube floating above the infinite consciousness that absorbed information like a black hole ?

this dream tells you: you need a haircut! 

trust me i‘m psychic.

 

by the way the fundamental unit of

time = T) 

is a really interesting concept. 3 minutes some people say, others give it a more emotional expanded frame with more heat involved.

Edited July 8, 2020 by remember