Absolutely no motivation at all

[rav]

Hi, I'm Matt, 38.

I've started changing my life about 9 months ago. Started "do nothing, just observe" meditation for at least 90 minutes per day, changed diet and lost like 25 kilograms already, stopped video games and TV and social media and procrastination in general, stopped PMO, installed MindLab Pro and Armodafinil.

Now I'm stuck. Weight is constant, during meditation I always "reach" the same state of mind (which is like wide, a bit unstable, bubbly, pulsating, calm), same job as before (production, manual construction of heating tubes), always tired, always demotivated, no impulse to socialize. Basically atm I'm only working - meditating - reading - sleeping, rinse and repeat.

Any advise? I don't know how to proceed.

Thank you.

[egoeimai]

23 minutes ago, rav said:

Hi, I'm Matt, 38.

I've started changing my life about 9 months ago. Started "do nothing, just observe" meditation for at least 90 minutes per day, changed diet and lost like 25 kilograms already, stopped video games and TV and social media and procrastination in general, stopped PMO, installed MindLab Pro and Armodafinil.

Now I'm stuck. Weight is constant, during meditation I always "reach" the same state of mind (which is like wide, a bit unstable, bubbly, pulsating, calm), same job as before (production, manual construction of heating tubes), always tired, always demotivated, no impulse to socialize. Basically atm I'm only working - meditating - reading - sleeping, rinse and repeat.

Any advise? I don't know how to proceed.

Thank you.

You've already done so much!

all u need to do now is to appreciate. That's what is lacking only.

[kag101]

It sounds like clinical depression. Have you ever considered going to a psychiatrist? A good one can certainly help you. 

[rav]

3 hours ago, kag101 said:

It sounds like clinical depression. Have you ever considered going to a psychiatrist? A good one can certainly help you. 

I've been to one about a year ago. They put me into a hospital for 2 weeks, gave me SSRI (Citalopram) and DBT. I was motivated to work with this and wanted to get better but somehow it didn't work. So I guess I will look for a good psychologist, then. Cuz SSRI don't do it for me.

[Artiekee]

Does your job satisfy you? Does it challenge you?

It's hard for us to give some concrete advice, but a psychologist or a life coach can certainly help you.

Do you know what you value most in life? If no, go find this out. If yes, how can you align your life more with these values?

[Nahm]

On 6/29/2020 at 6:26 AM, rav said:

Hi, I'm Matt, 38.

I've started changing my life about 9 months ago. Started "do nothing, just observe" meditation for at least 90 minutes per day, changed diet and lost like 25 kilograms already, stopped video games and TV and social media and procrastination in general, stopped PMO, installed MindLab Pro and Armodafinil.

Awesome man. Good for you. That was the hard part imo. 

On 6/29/2020 at 6:26 AM, rav said:

Now I'm stuck. Weight is constant, during meditation I always "reach" the same state of mind (which is like wide, a bit unstable, bubbly, pulsating, calm), same job as before (production, manual construction of heating tubes), always tired, always demotivated, no impulse to socialize. Basically atm I'm only working - meditating - reading - sleeping, rinse and repeat.

Now reap the rewards, if you will. “Stuck” is a perspective, a belief. You’re identifying as “the finite separate one who is stuck”, and thus are confusing experience & energy, motivation & inspiration... and therefore logically (yet unbeknownst) accommodating the individual who “is stuck”, in the truth of limitless potentiality. This stems from the illusion of “individual”, which is derived falsely (but innocently) of the very light of individuation. What the hell am I even talking about right?

Meditation ‘to’ the place of calm is...fine. It’s ok. Nothing wrong with it. It’ll do, for a demotivated tired individual doing everything as an individual. 

Meditation ‘to the middle’ is sweeter, richer, actual, uncovering the ‘dessert of the real’. There’s no tired individual there. That was let go. There’s no demotivated individual there. That was let go. There’s nobody there. “That” was let go. 

Since there’s no individual ‘there’ anymore, and since in direct experience reality has never once imposed a condition upon ‘you’...go ahead and ‘live’ as the whole you actually are. When you get “all that” out of your head, and onto a dreamboard, in front of ‘you’, clarity comes in spades. When everything and anything that you want is right there in front of you, you’re focused on it, aware of it. Unconditional reality is revealed to be precisely as it has always been, and will always be...unconditional. 

You say you’re stuck, tired and demotivated, ok. Not a bad story. Not my flavor but, cool. Can’t get it wrong, truly. I sure af appreciate having heat for my family.

You say you’re discovering what you actually want, by actually visually seeing what you want, and that reality’s effortlessly going to simply become it without any explanation whatsoever, and that you can live & love and relish in it as that story unfolds, well, fuck yeah to that. Imo. 

Give all the tension, uncertainty, and identity to God. You’ll receive in kind, inner peace & a relaxed mind, love unquestionably certain, and you’ll be the the true creator that you are. I did roofing, drywalling, and clean up on three story new constructions. It was ok. Then I discovered “prior”, and it clicked. I went prior to my story, to my bullshit story I’d been telling about “myself” for years. What I found there was that I was creating - and simultaneously experiencing - a fucking story. So I started telling the story of what I wanted. Some shit arose indeed, and I feared it not. I loved it. I sat and thrived on it. It fueled me, and filled me with purpose, inspiration, understanding, joy, and this sick twisted desire to share things like this with no one. Love you. Hope this strikes the right nerve. 

[rav]

7 hours ago, Artiekee said:

Does your job satisfy you? Does it challenge you?

It's hard for us to give some concrete advice, but a psychologist or a life coach can certainly help you.

Do you know what you value most in life? If no, go find this out. If yes, how can you align your life more with these values?

My job neither satisfies nor challenges me. I do it for the money. Yeah, that's a problem. I see. Atm I don't have the courage to quit, yet.

Catch 22: When I'm tired and anxious after work and think about quitting and working somewhere else, I project my current anxiety into the future and think things like "I will never find another job and run out of money". Gotta figure out how to break that cycle. Because when I am free of depression and anxiety on weekends or holidays, I definitely know that I would easily find a better job or start a business. But I still lack the courage to do so.

7 hours ago, Artiekee said:

Do you know what you value most in life?

Yeah, pretty much. Helping people who suffer any disability to lead a life that makes them happy.

5 hours ago, Nahm said:

You’re identifying as “the finite separate one who is stuck”

Right. I know what you're talking about intellectually, but I have not yet had any insight or awakening experience to that matter. My ego is still firmly rooted in materialism and identifying with external things, pain and pleasure and the like.

5 hours ago, Nahm said:

Meditation ‘to the middle’ is sweeter, richer, actual

How do I do that?

Atm during meditation I observe the pulsating impermanence of sensations, like the visual flickering or the auditory switching between loud and quiet (due to one of those books on Leo's list). Additionally, I sometimes "shoot aliens" - meaning I label sensations as fast as I can. I have not yet discovered who or what is actually aware of sensations. Maybe I should try Neti Neti?

5 hours ago, Nahm said:

You say you’re discovering what you actually want, by actually visually seeing what you want, and that reality’s effortlessly going to simply become it without any explanation whatsoever, and that you can live & love and relish in it as that story unfolds, well, fuck yeah to that. Imo. 

So you're saying I can just switch the story I'm telling myself around? Is it that simple?

Granted, language is one concept I use in order to label the world around me and inside me. And I've long suspected that language is the most powerful tool to achieve/change/influence anyone or anything.

But won't the ego defend itself against my simply altering its story? Will it not see through that?

Anyways, I will try to just tell a different story to myself.

5 hours ago, Nahm said:

and this sick twisted desire to share things like this with no one

Actually, I am very grateful for you sharing this. Thank you!

Edited June 30, 2020 by rav

[kag101]

@rav You only tried one antidepressant. I think should try it again.

Bupropion has worked really well with me, and it didn’t give me any sexual side effects (which was my bigest fear).  It is not a SSRI. It doesn’t act on the serotonin receptors, but on the dopamine ones — which really help boosting your vitality and motivation.

I’d suggest You ask your doctor if he thinks you can try this medication. It’s been life-changing for me...

good luck ??

[Nahm]

@rav

Why are you anxious after work? 

2 hours ago, rav said:

How do I do that?

Consciously breathing from the stomach. Let everything go. 

2 hours ago, rav said:

Right. I know what you're talking about intellectually, but I have not yet had any insight or awakening experience to that matter. My ego is still firmly rooted in materialism and identifying with external things, pain and pleasure and the like.

That’s what isn’t clicking with feeling. If meditation & letting go gets hairy, writing about how you feel. 

3 hours ago, rav said:

So you're saying I can just switch the story I'm telling myself around? Is it that simple?

Granted, language is one concept I use in order to label the world around me and inside me. And I've long suspected that language is the most powerful tool to achieve/change/influence anyone or anything.

But won't the ego defend itself against my simply altering its story? Will it not see through that?

Anyways, I will try to just tell a different story to myself.

Yes, you can. Even the story about the ego. 

[rav]

10 hours ago, kag101 said:

I’d suggest You ask your doctor if he thinks you can try this medication. It’s been life-changing for me...

Ok, I will. Thank you very much. I wasn't aware there even were meds that influence dopamine. So far I've only heard about serotonin and noradrenaline.

7 hours ago, Nahm said:

Why are you anxious after work? 

Because I know I have to go there again the next day.

[Red-White-Light]

@rav What’s your goal in life?

[Toby]

If your money / insurance allows go to a trauma therapist because you describe classic trauma symptoms:

https://www.somatic-experiencing.de/traumatherapeuten-finden/

https://drlaurenceheller.com/narm-practitioners/practitioners-germany/

https://account.sensorimotorpsychotherapy.org/home/directory-eu/prGermany.html

For reading I would recommend Peter Levine in an unspoken voice, Laurence heller healing developmental trauma and bessel van der kolk the body keeps the score.

[Nahm]

3 hours ago, rav said:

Because I know I have to go there again the next day.

How’s that thought feel?

[rav]

4 hours ago, Red-White-Light said:

What’s your goal in life?

Becoming a person opposite to my dad. Meaning: a loving, kind-hearted person who is not constantly complaining and who is not permanently measuring the world in terms of money. And who doesn't set up secret contracts in interpersonal relationships measuring said relationships on a basis of "what has he/she done for me / what can he/she do for me".

3 hours ago, Toby said:

go to a trauma therapist because you describe classic trauma symptoms:

I do? I definitely can't recall any traumatic experiences in my life so far. But thank you anyways for your suggestion. I will look into it.

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

How’s that thought feel?

It's a feeling of heaviness around my heart area, a change in frequency of my heartbeat and a slight pounding sensation in my ears.

[Nahm]

@rav

Would it make sense that it feels that way simply because it’s not true? 

[Roy]

3 minutes ago, rav said:

Becoming a person opposite to my dad.

Even if the opposite of your dad is all the positive things you listed. You're not authentically moving towards those things out of your own vision, you're doing them in spite of your father which is a negative.

If you're to get lasting motivation you need to reflect deeper on what you really want. Not what you think you want.

[rav]

13 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Would it make sense that it feels that way simply because it’s not true? 

Intellectually, yes. But it still feels that way.

15 minutes ago, Roy said:

you're doing them in spite of your father which is a negative.

Ok. I've always used him as a pole in order to repel myself.

16 minutes ago, Roy said:

If you're to get lasting motivation you need to reflect deeper on what you really want. Not what you think you want.

Alright. I will continue to contemplate what I really want. Thanks for your input.

[Roy]

4 minutes ago, rav said:

Alright. I will continue to contemplate what I really want. Thanks for your input.

Yep just make sure the contemplation is a process of independence. This is a time where you have permission to indulge your ego a bit  think about just you. That's what's important here.

[Nahm]

1 hour ago, rav said:

Intellectually, yes. But it still feels that way.

It feels not true?

[rav]

7 minutes ago, Nahm said:

It feels not true?

Sadly, it still feels genuine and true even though I intellectually know it's untrue.

I will continue to meditate and improve myself until I fully realize the story I'm telling myself.