How to avoid hell on 5meo (did it this weekend)?

[Jacobsrw]

On 29/06/2020 at 8:47 AM, upstream said:

I smoked 15mg of bufo this weekend, which I know isnt a lot, but it was still very intense. Ive done 7gs of shrooms 4x and have had ego death, and even just 15mg of bufo was WAY more intense.

During the trip, it felt like i (james) was communicating with an alien superintelligence, and it wanted me to completely surrender to it and maybe give my soul to it (idk if i believe in souls, but thats what it felt like). However, it didnt seem loving at all - it seems very threatening, like it was coercing me to love it and surrender to it ‘or else’, and it also seems like if I fucked up this exchange somehow it would sent me straight to hell forever. Im aware that this could be my ego playing tricks on me, but the threatening thing felt outside of me versus inside (maybe its still my ego though, idk).

It’s easy to downplay the gravity of this when I’m sober and say “oh thats just part of the experience / its your subconscious / etc”, but when youre in that space its the realest thing youve ever felt and the stakes are everything. I decided that even if theres a 1 in 1000th chance that i literally get sent to hell forever, its just not worth it.
 

That said, i still want to do it again (lol), but before i do that i want to make sure i dont figuratively or literally get stuck in hell forever. If anyone has thoughts on how to do this, id love to hear your thoughts and im sure this would help a lot of others too. 
 

Here are some ideas i have so far: 

-Work on overcoming this fear of hell with my therapist.

-Talk to a bunch of ppl who have experienced hell on 5meo (my key concerns are that you get stuck there for what feels like an eternity or actually for eternity, or its so unbearable that it destroys you, or you get possessed).

-Talk to more ppl in general who have done 5meo.

-Try 5meo via syringe instead of smoking.

 

Would appreciate any thoughts! And to preemptively respond to many of you, i am logically on board with “its all you!” and the general oneness argument, but that doesn’t help me solve this on an emotional level.

 

Thanks again!

I had quite a similar experience the over the weekend when smoking 5meO.

I administered a large inhalation and everything then violently disappeared with just the remains of an intense perception.

It was quite profound but also frightening. Difficult to comprehend which is the most difficult. I managed to surrender to a large degree but it was far from pleasant haha.

In your case, it seems there may be a deep seated fear that you have for complete dissolution of the self. Be prepared to disappear while on 5MEO, it’s inevitable under the right dosage. 

The best thing you can do is increase your level of capacity for the ability to surrender. I recommend cold showers for this and using them as a catalyst to enhance your tolerance for withstanding discomfort. Practice letting go whilst immersed in cold water and maintain a steady breath without resist. They’ve helped me immensely with developing the capacity to effectively surrender.

Edited July 1, 2020 by Jacobsrw

[OBEler]

@zeroISinfinity Ok I can grasp a little where you at because I was in a similar place. It is not fun. And Yeah, other worldly problems are really silly when it comes to existential one. 

The price for me: lost girlfriend, lost Job, lost my mind almost too. But it was good in the end, grewed a lot, still normal Person. 

Edited June 29, 2020 by OBEler

[zeroISinfinity]

@Nahm What it Really is. Holy just holy OMG. I understand now your "whom and what" fully now. 

Got reminded and heavy attack. Not easy. 

Relax love yourself and it's all ok. 

They really don't know they beleive they do.

Will be here no worries. Will help you out. You will need a lot of love and care. 

Love you all. I really do indeed love everything without single doubt I Really mean it and yes ofcourse I feel it. 

Infinite Love. 

[upstream]

Thanks everyone ( @Nahm @StarStruck @dimitri @Serotoninluv @Corpus @Jacobsrw ) for your advice! Greatly appreciate it.

 

@Nahm - Good question re how I'm able to do a ton of shrooms and have ego death no problem, but struggled with 5meo. A few thoughts:

1. I did the heavy doses of shrooms during the first half of 2019. I had an ego death where I became all of my surroundings, and it felt like the source of all energy was flowing directly through me and everything around me, condcuting everything in an asbolutely perfect harmony. It was easily the most beautiful and mesmerizing experience I had ever had. I also had this distinct knowingness that I was one with everything around me, and that I (my highest self) had created all of this. However, I did not experience infinity - while I sensed that I was one with my surroundings/simulation/dream, there still remained the possibility that there could exist other realities/beings outside of my current dream/simulation. My understanding of 5meo breakthroughs is that you realize that you are not only your immediate surroundings, but also literally all of existence for as far as existence extends - beyond your own surroundings / simulation / dream all the way to infinity. My experience on shrooms still left open the possibility for the existence of an 'other,' even though I did had some level of ego death.

2. A few months after this experience, I was doing some weed (I rarely smoke - maybe a few times per year) and my mind sort of got back into the space described above. I had this very strong sense of connecting directly with GOD (this was actually different from most of my shrooms experiences - where I didn't clearly identify the source energy/signal as being THE god/creator). It was profound and seemed unmistakeable - like, "OMG, it's fucking GOD." It felt like the most pure, good, all-knowing, all-powerful thing imaginable, and like it was impossible for it be anything but god. I actually started crying when I felt its presence / my connection to it, because I felt like I had been connected to this energy as a child, but society had pulled the wool so fucking hard over my eyes that I had forgotten about, and even shunned, this utmost truth. I didn't have the experience of being one with it though - it was very much the sense that "I am this puny human, interfacing with the almighty god." I called my mom in the middle of experiencing this, still very high (really bad idea - never ever do this lol), and I profusely apologized to her while crying, because her relationship with God is the most central thing in her life, and I had completely written it off and had even been dismissive and condescending about this for the past 15+ years. While I was talking to her on the phone about this, things took a turn for the worst, and this is what I think fucked me up (and culminated in me having difficulty letting go on 5meo). My mom (who is a very conservative and somewhat strict Catholic), wasn't happy that I was high, and seemed extremely concerned that I was tapping into this energy. She said something along the lines of "Yeah, James, god is real. You figured it out. But now you're REALLY playing with fire, and you better stop going down this path." I interpreted her tone as indicating that I was in dire danger (it was honestly like that though - like if she said the wrong word in the wrong way, or if I made the slightest mistake... it was all over). I also interpreted her tone and language as implying that not only were God and heaven real, but also the devil and hell were real. And now that I had poked around too much and had tapped into these things, I was on the radar of the dark energy. She also seemed to hint that if I crossed some kind of line, I could get sent to hell forever and there was nothing anyone could do to ever get me out. This was the most serious that I had ever seen my mom - as if she had known about the gravity of this my entire life, but had been playing a clandestine role to protect me (and herself) from the unfathomably awful consequences of screwing up (ie getting sent to hell forever) because the truth of what sandbox we were playing in (purgatory) was just too damn scary and the stakes were just too fucking high. She then instructed me to follow specific guidelines in case I bumped into demons / dark energy or something, and said she would send guardian angels to watch over me (she's pretty hardcore Catholic). I've been a pretty staunch atheist/agnoistic for most of my life and had completely written off the possibility of all these things being true, so the sudden realization that of all this stuff might actually being true - hitting me all at once - was a bit too big of a pill to swallow. At the same time as all this was happening, a very dark energy seemed to start honing in on me - like the polar opposite of the good/god energy that I had encountered earlier. I felt like I had been poking around the nature of reality too much, had discovered something that I wasn't supposed to know about the simulation/dream I was in and the spiritual overlords who controlled it, and now they were unhappy with me and were coming after me for my punishment (I know none of this makes any sense rationally and doesn't make sense to me at all when I'm sober,  but this is what it felt like in the moment). Over the next half hour or so, I became consumed by an increasingly intense dark energy and fear that seemed to be threatening to remove me from this sim/dream and transport me to hell now that I knew too much, and the fear became so overwhelming that I literally started to feel like I was sitting in front of a bonfire and I even called out to Jesus to protect me because fucking going to hell lol. On a subsequent weed trip a few months later, almost the exact same thing happened. I connected with this dark superintelligent/superpowerful energy again, that seemed to be threatening me to stop poking around the nature of reality or else it would send me straight to hell (I'm assuming this was my ego, but it felt a lot like the alien telepathic signal that I referred to in my OP). I think a lot of these experiences/beliefs resurfaced when I did 5meo this past weekend. Again, I was raised in a pretty strict catholic household, so a lot of these beliefs were probably ingrained in me as a kid (even though I've been atheist/agnostic for the past 15 years and don't have any awareness of these subconscious beliefs when I'm sober).

 

Pretty long-winded response, but you asked for context on how I was able to do a ton of shrooms and have ego death while struggling with 5meo, so there it is! Maybe if I hadn't done the weed and been spooked my my mom / triggered a lot of religious beliefs that were unknowingly instilled in me as a child, then the 5meo would have been smoother sailing.

 

Nonetheless, I am fucking doing 5meo again lol. I'm way too curious and it's way too profound for me to shy away from it. I'll just have to go slowly/gradually and not push myself too far out of my comfort zone each time as I build up my tolerance. Even though it was very scary, I still found it profoundly insightful and equivalent to crushing through something like 100+ layers of my psyche, which probably would have taken years of therapy to work through in a sober state. I'm also very excited and grateful to have the opportunity to figure out how to overcome the fear of hell and get to the breakthrough state of 5meo, because then I will be positioned to help many others conquer their greatest fears and radically level up their consciousness. I'm just going to take the process VERY slowly and carefully - one milligram at a time, and will be sure to give myself as much time as needed to fully integrate everything that I learn in-between sessions.

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by upstream

[Nahm]

@upstream

I feel for ya man. Hell’s just a belief though. 

[upstream]

@Nahm Good to hear! And thanks again.