There is no total enlightenment ?

[George Paul]

If some individual claims that he has been subject to a total enlightenment, like Buddha claimed, then how come that he remembers ?

If total enlightenmnet assume ego death, then who has been the subject of that experience ? How come that the same person can say  anything when he was not even in existence during the experience ? Why he remembers something from a time in which he was not existing at all ?  

 

Edited June 24, 2020 by George Paul

[Nak Khid]

 

[George Paul]

This video explains better, you can just have glimpses, not total enligtenment.

That brings up the question if otman is brahman, or we are God . Are we ? We cannnot know that because in the moment we know we are not existing anymore. So if we are not exisiting then there is not a WE who is presumend to be God. 

 

In the sentence "I am God" the words "I" and "God" are mutualy exclusive. They can't be put in the same sentence.

"I am made of God" or "I am a son of God" or "God made me" are more accurate.

If I were God and tried to tell people this , I would literally say just  "I am".

This if fucking creepy since I dont buy Christianity.

Edited June 24, 2020 by George Paul

[Sempiternity]

No one can explain this to you, you can only know through direct experience. Anything you're thinking it could be, is not even in the ballpark.  

[Codrina]

40 minutes ago, George Paul said:

In the sentence "I am God" the words "I" and "God" are mutualy exclusive. They can't be put in the same sentence.

"I am made of God" or "I am a son of God" or "God made me" are more accurate.

If I were God and tried to tell people this , I would literally say just  "I am".

This if fucking creepy since I dont buy Christianity.

I find this to be true for me as well. When I am totally immersed in existence, there is no sense of an I anymore, just awareness. Something I cannot name, and a sense of peace, love, joy, and wonder rises. 

Also, there is wisdom within all religions.

I was wondering about it one night, I was finding myself focusing on being fully in the now (Eckhart Tolle's teaching), observing what is in front of me  -  and it hit me! There is no now because the now is Nothingness, God, Love; as a human, you can only be in the past or future. To be in the Now means to not be in the world, but outside of it, through it, to be nothing, to be the space for it.  

Actually, you are both at the same time, we just choose to be human, in the world, more than we choose nothingness. 

Creation is God's will, your will. I find it more helpful to embrace it than to look for a way out. That being said, I do go into nothingness every morning for a few minutes. It helps me guide my day with love, instead of separation.

[George Paul]

 

It is Total enlinghtenmment what I am challenging here not partial or some feelings or awareness.

Intelegi Codrina ?

Edited June 24, 2020 by George Paul

[Member]

1 hour ago, George Paul said:

If total enlightenmnet assume ego death, then who has been the subject of that experience ? How come that the same person can say  anything when he was not even in existence during the experience ? Why he remembers something from a time in which he was not existing at all ?

In my experience, I was imagining the universe that started to crumble into smaller pieces along with my physical body till nothing remained. It wasn't during a psychedelic trip and I have no idea what others experience, but for me it was so intense and beautiful that for a moment I thought that I reached Nirvana. Ignore the negative vibe from the picture but when all the physicality vanishes, you/the entire universe become eternal silence. There's no blackness, no emotion, no you, no nothing.

1 hour ago, George Paul said:

That brings up the question if otman is brahman, or we are God . Are we ? We cannnot know that because in the moment we know we are not existing anymore. So if we are not exisiting then there is not a WE who is presumend to be God.

God is infinite and so is your existence. If you say that "we" don't exist, then God doesn't exist. Imo there's no such thing as non-existence - it is most likely just a state of mind.

Edited June 24, 2020 by Member

[Codrina]

@George Paul What is total enlightenment?

[Member]

18 minutes ago, Codrina said:

@George Paul What is total enlightenment?

Good question ?

[Codrina]

13 minutes ago, Member said:

you/the entire universe become eternal silence

I find this to be a good description of my experience - it comes in a glimpse, none the less 

34 minutes ago, George Paul said:

not partial or some feelings or awareness

What is partial? Feelings arise when in the body after immersed in existence. 

What is awareness? I find awareness something which can't be described

'Awareness is the state of being conscious of something. More specifically, is the ability to directly know and perceive, to feel, or to be cognizant of events.'

The definition doesn't actually define awareness, but only defines how it works, how we perceive it, the weird thing, though is that we are aware of what we call 'awareness'. 

So, in my ignorance, let me ask again, what is awareness?

[George Paul]

56 minutes ago, Codrina said:

@George Paul What is total enlightenment?

Buddha and some Leo live videos

[mandyjw]

@George Paul Awakening seems to be an experience that happens to a person. It's an experience of what's true merging with what's false in a way that it never has before. It's sort of an in and out insight, a realization for the first time that there's no you, and sheer possibility, love and bliss floods in. None of our distinctions are actually real, so I guess that's the reason for this phenomenon. The person can own this experience, or use it as a map, meant to be put away after the destination is reached. Awakening is not it, in the same way that being given a key to a treasure chest is not the treasure, even though you're incredibly overjoyed to have found that key. 

To anyone who believes that he is a self, other people will appear as selves, it doesn't matter what they've realized. Buddha or anyone else's realization is always going to be a story for the you, and part of you. 

[justfortoday]

I think we need to stop using these terms so loosely.

Enlightenment is simply realizing your true nature, that you are "nothing" looking at a projection.

There are no levels to "enlightenment".

There are infinite states of consciousness in which you can discover other facets of existence.

[Member]

3 minutes ago, justfortoday said:

Enlightenment is simply realizing your true nature, that you are "nothing" looking at a projection.

You are the projection.

[justfortoday]

5 minutes ago, Member said:

You are the projection.

Correct, but what is *experiencing* the projection is "nothing".

[Member]

6 minutes ago, justfortoday said:

Correct, but what is *experiencing* the projection is "nothing".

Imho, only everything exists. No thing does not compute.

[justfortoday]

@Member When I say nothing I simply mean subtracting all your "senses" and just being "I" — I is nothing. And "I" experiences everything.

[Member]

11 minutes ago, justfortoday said:

@Member When I say nothing I simply mean subtracting all your "senses" and just being "I" — I is nothing. And "I" experiences everything.

I know. But when you say I am "nothing" you are still something because nothing does not exist. That's why I say that you are the projection, not something inside or outside of it.

Edited June 24, 2020 by Member