Sam Harris - Police Brutality, BLM, Identity Politics

[lmfao]

Devil's advocate position relative to this forum on police brutality. Albeit there's plenty of material on all this, I think this is a pretty good depiction of what a reasonable skeptic of all this would look like. I think the video shows the importance of statistics. Even if you think the particular statistics someone provided are bad, or misleading, there's the importance of having good statistics. In contrast to bad statistics or no statistics. 

----
Sam Harris has always been a bit too status quo for me. He's painstakingly linear but meticulous with logical speech. He's boring because of it. His views on foreign policy, islam and religion show enough his lack of wholistic wisdom and his western supremacy. Since the west is stage orange, it's inevitable he propagates the west.

I think he's very low in neuroticism, and is almost the opposite of someone who thinks with empathy. He's pure reason and facts. He's a one trick pony with one lens though. But that low neuroticism is an unambiguous strength about him that makes him excellent as a clarifier, and it's a nice mentality to see. 

Quote

"Morality demands that we strive to minimize human suffering, except in the Middle East, where we should strive to maximize it."
-Ham Sarris

 

Edited June 21, 2020 by lmfao

[Preety_India]

 

That guy Sam gives me a brain aneurysm. 

He is a massive deception in the garb of spiritual development. 

I absolutely hate that guy and his views. So myopic and lacking in absolute empathy. 

He is pure symbolism of western supremacy and Stage Orange garbage and constantly using rationality and reason and all bullshit facts to come up with his weird thought experiments and scenarios that are perfect for his selfish goals. 

He shouldn't have visited India. He gives Indian spirituality a bad name and is banking on it by marketing his meditation brand to people. 

Someone should tell him that meditation is not a business. 

He is not living in the richest neighborhoods for nothing. He has reduced to selling Sam Harris t shirts and mugs at conferences to generate money. 

I feel pity for those who follow Sam Harris in the name of rationality. 

Sam Harris is dangerous to humanity, his ideas are. He is a motherload of bad ideas and it's just a fact and it will corrupt the youth.. He is worse than Trump in my opinion, at least Trump signed the police reform executive order and Trump shows some empathy when police brutality happens. 

 

Humanity can do way better than all that logic nonsense. He doesn't even know what morality means. For him morality is so cutthroat and he has this horrible mentality of painting an entire race or culture with one brush. 

He will go down in history as the most myopic person in a modern century. 100 years later people will laugh at whatever he wrote. 

He is the sanitized version of George Zimmerman with a nice suit and a neuroscientist hat. 

Ben Affleck was very very right when he said to Sam Harris on the show "dude, you made a career out of Islam." 

People need to open their eyes to all this YouTube propaganda against race and religion . It's misinformation propaganda machine that he is a part of. 

 

Last time he was suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome TDS on Twitter. After that I never followed his Twitter feed again. It wasn't worth following in the first place. 

If you really want to follow someone on YouTube, first of all you have Leo Gura who is an excellent example of a very balanced person. 

And I'll suggest Carl Benjamin aka Sargon of Akkad, he is pretty balanced and not very extremist in his opinions. 

There is a difference between Sam Harris and Leo. Leo is awake. Sam Harris is not awake. 

Leo has even opened this politics segment on Actualized.org that didn't exist before because Leo understands the needs of the youth. Lots of young men and women like me and others who have political curiosities which is very healthy. The whole world talks about politics now, not just a group of men with beards. Leo understands the pulse of the youth. He doesn't want the young guys to be brainwashed leaning into mainstream political hogwash. He wants the youth to learn the right way of looking at politics, a holistic approach. 

This is helpful because if political curiosities of young people like 18 year olds is not addressed here, then they will go to places like Reddit or 4chan or lean into extremist opinions on YouTube. Thus they will get brainwashed by people with agenda and propaganda. Leo doesn't want that 

In a sense, Leo is doing God's work here. 

 

That's why Leo even allows trivial questions on politics from teenagers because he doesn't want to discourage them from thinking or questioning 

Sam Harris teaches you the lower truths. Leo teaches you the higher truths. 

It's important to learn the higher truths because we all serve a higher purpose. We are not simply surviving but also living and thriving 

And thriving needs true love and empathy for all in this world. 

 

Edited June 21, 2020 by Preety_India

[ParanoidAndroid]

I listened to this podcast when he released it and found it Rea;ly interesting. I think he brings up lots of valid concerns about what's happening and makes a good argument although I think he maybe misses the big picture a little in getting caught up in particular facts. It's definitely worth a listen to gain another perspective. I like Sam Harris quite a lot and respect his logical and clear thinking on all sorts of topics. He's a breath of fresh air. That doesn't mean I agree with everything he says but I think it's important to listen to other perspectives. Also, I don't find him boring at all. I find his podcasts and conversations really interesting and I find his voice quite calming and soothing ahah. I also think he has more empathy than you're giving him credit for. I think he just deliberately tries to stay unemotional when discussing things because getting emotional tends to get in the way of the facts. Not that emotion has no place of course.

I think his views on religion are good for what they are but somewhat limited in that he doesn't seem to understand the real reasons behind religion, that the core of them is spirituality and mysticism and that comparing them to the flying spaghetti monster or whatever is kind of missing the point. 

However, his views are often misrepresented too. He's often painted as islamophobic just because he points out the flaws in Islam, which is ridiculous. 

I don't know where that quote at the end comes from but I'm pretty sure Sam Harris has never said that...

[ParanoidAndroid]

8 hours ago, Preety_India said:

He is worse than Trump in my opinion, at least Trump signed the police reform executive order and Trump shows some empathy when police brutality happens. 

"Trump shows some empathy when police brutality happens"...is that why he cleared a square with tear gas and rubber bullets so he could take a propagandistic photo op?
 

8 hours ago, Preety_India said:

he has this horrible mentality of painting an entire race or culture with one brush

If you're referring to his views on Islam...well Islam is not a race. In fact his respect for westerners who've become Islamic fundamentalists is even lower than for Islamic Arabs. It has nothing to do with race. He has a problem with the ideology of Islam, not people from Islamic countries. He also criticises Christianity just as much, is there a problem with that? I do disagree with lots of his views on US foreign policy. He's not well educated on it and so he too often just agrees with the mainstream narrative. I'd love to see him debate Noam Chomsky.

 

8 hours ago, Preety_India said:

Ben Affleck was very very right when he said to Sam Harris on the show "dude, you made a career out of Islam."

Ben Affleck was totally ridiculous in that interview. He didn't engage with Harris' arguments at all. He just branded him a racist and got all angry over nothing.

Also, can you explain what Trump Derangement Syndrome is? lol

8 hours ago, Preety_India said:

Sargon of Akkad, he is pretty balanced and not very extremist in his opinions. 

Is that a joke?

Edited June 21, 2020 by ParanoidAndroid

[Preety_India]

@ParanoidAndroid  I can't have counter arguments for you. All I'll say is that you're just skimming the surface and that's fine. 

 

 

[tenta]

This is all you need to know about Sam Harris:

And yes he doesn't realize that others are just preaching sadism for the "strong" and masochism for the "weak". The "strong" according to him being a privileged billionaire who cannot admit it's not just hard work that caused him to succeed.

[JosephKnecht]

I found a summarized version of his podcast. Here it is... 

 

[Preety_India]

 

To all the people who chime in with Sam Harris and talk about logic, rationality and statistics, here's a good riddle for y'all, use your logic now. 

 

 

[Jacobsrw]

13 hours ago, Preety_India said:

 

That guy Sam gives me a brain aneurysm. 

He is a massive deception in the garb of spiritual development. 

I absolutely hate that guy and his views. So myopic and lacking in absolute empathy. 

He is pure symbolism of western supremacy and Stage Orange garbage and constantly using rationality and reason and all bullshit facts to come up with his weird thought experiments and scenarios that are perfect for his selfish goals. 

He shouldn't have visited India. He gives Indian spirituality a bad name and is banking on it by marketing his meditation brand to people. 

Someone should tell him that meditation is not a business. 

He is not living in the richest neighborhoods for nothing. He has reduced to selling Sam Harris t shirts and mugs at conferences to generate money. 

I feel pity for those who follow Sam Harris in the name of rationality. 

Sam Harris is dangerous to humanity, his ideas are. He is a motherload of bad ideas and it's just a fact and it will corrupt the youth.. He is worse than Trump in my opinion, at least Trump signed the police reform executive order and Trump shows some empathy when police brutality happens. 

 

Humanity can do way better than all that logic nonsense. He doesn't even know what morality means. For him morality is so cutthroat and he has this horrible mentality of painting an entire race or culture with one brush. 

He will go down in history as the most myopic person in a modern century. 100 years later people will laugh at whatever he wrote. 

He is the sanitized version of George Zimmerman with a nice suit and a neuroscientist hat. 

Ben Affleck was very very right when he said to Sam Harris on the show "dude, you made a career out of Islam." 

People need to open their eyes to all this YouTube propaganda against race and religion . It's misinformation propaganda machine that he is a part of. 

 

Last time he was suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome TDS on Twitter. After that I never followed his Twitter feed again. It wasn't worth following in the first place. 

If you really want to follow someone on YouTube, first of all you have Leo Gura who is an excellent example of a very balanced person. 

And I'll suggest Carl Benjamin aka Sargon of Akkad, he is pretty balanced and not very extremist in his opinions. 

There is a difference between Sam Harris and Leo. Leo is awake. Sam Harris is not awake. 

Leo has even opened this politics segment on Actualized.org that didn't exist before because Leo understands the needs of the youth. Lots of young men and women like me and others who have political curiosities which is very healthy. The whole world talks about politics now, not just a group of men with beards. Leo understands the pulse of the youth. He doesn't want the young guys to be brainwashed leaning into mainstream political hogwash. He wants the youth to learn the right way of looking at politics, a holistic approach. 

This is helpful because if political curiosities of young people like 18 year olds is not addressed here, then they will go to places like Reddit or 4chan or lean into extremist opinions on YouTube. Thus they will get brainwashed by people with agenda and propaganda. Leo doesn't want that 

In a sense, Leo is doing God's work here. 

 

That's why Leo even allows trivial questions on politics from teenagers because he doesn't want to discourage them from thinking or questioning 

Sam Harris teaches you the lower truths. Leo teaches you the higher truths. 

It's important to learn the higher truths because we all serve a higher purpose. We are not simply surviving but also living and thriving 

And thriving needs true love and empathy for all in this world. 

 

Sam Harris is not as sadistically insidious as you have stipulated here.

I do agree, however, that he is extremely naive and myopic and really suffocates spirituality. Though, you have to consider his position. He is a stage orange scientist not a mystic. He cannot he expected to exemplify high levels of consciousness since the paradigm from which he functions is inherently limited and deluded in itself.

He is doing okay for a stage orange dogmatic scientist. He just requires more radical insights so he can ascend more openly.

Personally, I’m not really a fan of Sam Harris as he is too mainstream and mechanical. Almost like the CNN of rationality. However, for those who need an introduction to basic mediation and mindfulness he may be helpful. One should then dispose of him quickly once they realise the limitability of his material.

Edited June 21, 2020 by Jacobsrw

[Leo Gura]

Can you imagine how Sam Harris has sex?

He sits there calmly talking to the woman until he cums from the magnificence his own logical conclusions 

[AtheisticNonduality]

[lmfao]

@Preety_IndiaSam Harris has been very good on the subject of Trump in my opinion. As in he's slapped a bit of sense to stage orange teens on the internet who might have otherwise supported Trump. 

The only thing I'll strongly disagree with there as well is saying Carl Benjamin is better than Sam Harris. 

@ParanoidAndroid

5 hours ago, ParanoidAndroid said:

I think he brings up lots of valid concerns about what's happening and makes a good argument although I think he maybe misses the big picture a little in getting caught up in particular facts. It's definitely worth a listen to gain another perspective. I like Sam Harris quite a lot and respect his logical and clear thinking on all sorts of topics. He's a breath of fresh air. That doesn't mean I agree with everything he says but I think it's important to listen to other perspectives. Also, I don't find him boring at all. I find his podcasts and conversations really interesting and I find his voice quite calming and soothing ahah. I also think he has more empathy than you're giving him credit for. I think he just deliberately tries to stay unemotional when discussing things because getting emotional tends to get in the way of the facts. Not that emotion has no place of course.

I think he gets a bit too caught up in just facts as well.

Yeah I respect it too. The thing about him is that he's very good at is walking you through things with logic that anyone can follow. So he's a great communicator by being so meticulous. 

He has more empathy than I gave him credit for, you're right. There's a bit of a clash of temperaments of me and him I think is what it is. If I perceive someone to be going through details very slowly or perceive them to be "missing the point" I get impatient. I can have impulsive and whimsical tendencies which will make me get annoyed when I see someone as meticulous as him. 
I think what it also is is that I perceive Sam to be dense the same way a woman might perceive their male partner to be dense. 

His low neuroticism is his trusty shield in battle. 

@Leo Gura Yes, exactly. He's so comically composed and flat.

Edited June 21, 2020 by lmfao

[AtheisticNonduality]

Or we all going to ignore that Sam Harris is a huge McKenna fan?

[Eren Eeager]

@Leo Gura fuck Leo, what is this lolll

Edited June 21, 2020 by Eren Eeager

[Preety_India]

6 minutes ago, lmfao said:

His low neuroticism is his trusty shield in battle

I don't understand how you say this. Maybe his calm demeanor hides his inner neuroticism. Neurotic behavior is not always fly off the handle Alex Jones style behavior. It can also manifest in people who look calm on the outside but turbulent on the inside.

Sam Harris is far from what you're thinking. I followed his Twitter throughout 2016 and he was completely obsessed with Trump to the point of pathological level. He had a mental breakdown on Twitter the day Trump won.. His views on religion are extreme and phobic. All of this while calling himself a Stanford educated neuroscientist and meditator. Even an 8th grader will show more composure and maturity than him. Sorry but in my opinion, he is completely not what she shows. He puts on a calm look for people but if he was really that calm, he wouldn't be obsessively tweeting his hate on Twitter. 

. 

[Epikur]

47 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Can you imagine how Sam Harris has sex?

He sits there calmly talking to the woman until he cums from the magnificence his own logical conclusions 

In Germany we say quiet waters are deep and dirty. 

Sam Harris is a martial arts and Brazilian Jiu Jitsu guy. So I guess his striking and grappling game is top notch. 





 

Edited June 21, 2020 by Epikur

[Epikur]

7 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

I don't understand how you say this. Maybe his calm demeanor hides his inner neuroticism. Neurotic behavior is not always fly off the handle Alex Jones style behavior. It can also manifest in people who look calm on the outside but turbulent on the inside.

Sam Harris is far from what you're thinking. I followed his Twitter throughout 2016 and he was completely obsessed with Trump to the point of pathological level. He had a mental breakdown on Twitter the day Trump won.. His views on religion are extreme and phobic. All of this while calling himself a Stanford educated neuroscientist and meditator. Even an 8th grader will show more composure and maturity than him. Sorry but in my opinion, he is completely not what she shows. He puts on a calm look for people but if he was really that calm, he wouldn't be obsessively tweeting his hate on Twitter. 

. 

Yes he is obsessed with Trump in a weird way but most progressives are like that. 

Islam is one of the most problematic religions out there and many people suffer under it. My background is from that religion.
 

 

Edited June 21, 2020 by Epikur

[remember]

17 minutes ago, Epikur said:

In Germany we say quiet waters are deep and dirty. 

but never at the same time - the dirty is probably more for mud holes, never heard that as a saying. a little lie goes a long way. even through muddy waters huh?  gotcha

Edited June 21, 2020 by remember

[Roy]

I know it's not completely happening in this thread but I see a lot of it on this forum. Why so much Sam Harris and Jordan Peterson hate? They help millions people through their discussions and knock so much sense into the endless stupidity in our society.

So what if they're rationalists or too happy to talk about science? That's just what they know, and that's what most people need these days, which is precisely why it's resonating so much.

You help people where they are at. Proselytizing about Stage Yellow systems thinking or preaching State Turquoise spirituality just flies over the head of Blue and Orange masses. If you aren't being mindful of who you're trying to help it's just ego masturbation about how woke and smart you are and it's no wonder communities like this get laughed at so much for being "crazy".

If you think people like Sam and Jordan aren't doing good things and should be ignored you need to go back to the drawing board of your world view, because you've lost the plot.

[Raptorsin7]

@Roy  Because it's a self help forum, and the vast majority of people here need more help than they are willing to admit to lol

Edited June 21, 2020 by Raptorsin7