psychedelic states through meditation?

[Applegarden]

Just now, Nahm said:

@Applegarden

I suppose one’s liberation is another’s dead end...?

Not exactly sure what you’re asking.

I simply don't think "those direct statements that make you stop and be" don't really help much to the discussions about the possibilities of various topics which people want to explore and get other inputs and therefore by knowledge or some organization of tought and different perspective achieve the same empowerment without having a subtle sense that it is wrong to spend time wandering about universe and some topic in the universe which people find interesting and are passionate about, as enlightenment is not the only purpose, but the very exploration of all the posibilities is the purpose or it is the purposleness including enlightenment. However liberation is important, yes. What works for me i found is that some part of renounciation helps however if want to be active in the world, this has not helped me, so i am also spending time being involved in the maya intensly, (playing, researching about music) and combination of that works best for me, while i have this body.

It might be a dead end in the context that its a dead end for people's desire to be creative, wanting to know something, rather than discarding it and putting what they wanted to do aside and therefore making them miserable for not achieving anything while they could, meanwhile being blissful that they achieved what they wanted for lifetimes. The dark night of the soul comes later if the spiritual work is not done, and this approach HELPS FOR THAT DESPERATION THO.

[Nahm]

@Applegarden

No offense I hope, but I don’t really resonate with the perspectives you’re suggesting. I feel everybody should explore freely and love & live to the fullest. 

[Applegarden]

@Nahm Its okay, i don't want to be too much of an idiolouge either... still whatever i said is my projection about these cliche phrases i mentioned earlier, so it was kinda my subjective rant. 

[Nahm]

@Applegarden

? I hope there’s some peace felt in seeing it came and went.  

[AlwaysBeNice]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I can confirm that it is certainly impossible.

You ain't gonna reach a salvia or DPT state even after 40 years of meditation.

Psychedelics states are so intense, powerful, and diverse that you will never access all of them without pumping your brain full of new chemicals.

Through meditation perhaps you can access 1% of the full range of psychedelic states.

This doesn't make meditation bad. It's still an important practice. But don't fool yourself into thinking you'll access a DMT, DPT, or saliva breakthrough via meditation. You will not. Also, don't confuse ego-death, samadhi, and awakening with the full range of possible states of consciousness. The range of states that consciousness can take is astounding in its diversity and intensity.

I can confirm personally that this is absolute nonsense.

You can access all these states, it's not even that hard if you are serious about it, which of course only a few are, consistent and committed meditation especially through falling asleep awake can do it.

Being seriously with a real master can also open the doors enough.

There's nothing special about psychedelics despite being very effective, dream objects.

[Leo Gura]

Just because you can access a certain high state of consciousness thru meditation or yoga does not mean that you can access the full range of states that consciousness is capable of. You will miss 99% of possible states that way, and as a result your understanding of consciousness will be limited.

There is no substitute for states. States are all there is. There are states which you cannot even imagine and which cannot be described in language or even stored in human memory once you've been there.

[StarStruck]

With Joe Dispenza's stuff I reached high trance states. Almost felt like I felt asleep but I was awake and when I ended the meditation it took 20 minutes to become sober again. 

[NorthNow]

I had not done drugs in a year, I had an incredibly intense meditation experience. More intense than on some psychedelics. 

[Spiral Wizard]

20 hours ago, StarStruck said:

With Joe Dispenza's stuff I reached high trance states. Almost felt like I felt asleep but I was awake and when I ended the meditation it took 20 minutes to become sober again. 

@StarStruck That’s amazing! Dr. Joe Dispenza always resonated with me. Which techniques, books or courses have you applied or which do you recommend?
 

21 hours ago, AlwaysBeNice said:

You can access all these states, it's not even that hard if you are serious about it, which of course only a few are, consistent and committed meditation especially through falling asleep awake can do it.

Being seriously with a real master can also open the doors enough.

There's nothing special about psychedelics despite being very effective, dream objects.

@AlwaysBeNice love it! Could you define what “consistent and committed meditation” means to you? (Ex.: 1h every day for at least 1 year before one can expect such results?)
 

May I ask you to also elaborate on your techniques? (“especially through falling asleep awake can do it”)

I experimented with deep meditation before falling asleep and concentration during the day when I am most alert. Not sure yet which brings more value into my life...

 

PS.: Thanks in advance! 

Edited June 20, 2020 by Spiral Wizard

[StarStruck]

@Spiral Wizard Breaking the Habit of being Yourself: what is your favorite spirituality book?

[AlwaysBeNice]

3 hours ago, Spiral Wizard said:

@StarStruck That’s amazing! Dr. Joe Dispenza always resonated with me. Which techniques, books or courses have you applied or which do you recommend?
 

@AlwaysBeNice love it! Could you define what “consistent and committed meditation” means to you? (Ex.: 1h every day for at least 1 year before one can expect such results?)
 

May I ask you to also elaborate on your techniques? (“especially through falling asleep awake can do it”)

I experimented with deep meditation before falling asleep and concentration during the day when I am most alert. Not sure yet which brings more value into my life...

 

PS.: Thanks in advance! 

On 6/19/2020 at 11:03 PM, Leo Gura said:

On 6/19/2020 at 11:03 PM, Leo Gura said:

As long as it takes, meditation/self-enquiry or devotion should be constant.

Yes, laying still on your back is the Nr. 1 technique to stay awake while falling asleep, it's pretty hard tho. But it's also a reason to meditate laying down, often it should be nice.

-

I disagree Leo, it won't be the same as blasting yourself in the face, and some states should be less likely perhaps, but it's all the same pretty much in a way.Though yes, my most lasting extreme was also on psy's, but sober is possible and not as fkin hectic.

[GreenWoods]

On 6/19/2020 at 10:42 AM, Leo Gura said:

I can confirm that it is certainly impossible.

You ain't gonna reach a salvia or DPT state even after 40 years of meditation.

Psychedelics states are so intense, powerful, and diverse that you will never access all of them without pumping your brain full of new chemicals.

Through meditation perhaps you can access 1% of the full range of psychedelic states.

This doesn't make meditation bad. It's still an important practice. But don't fool yourself into thinking you'll access a DMT, DPT, or saliva breakthrough via meditation. You will not. Also, don't confuse ego-death, samadhi, and awakening with the full range of possible states of consciousness. The range of states that consciousness can take is astounding in its diversity and intensity.

I also believe that you can't reach such states through meditation.

However, I do believe that you can reach any psychedelic state in OBEs. I would even say that you can reach more through OBEs. If you take psychedelics your experience depends on what a physical human body is capable of. It is limited to the number of chemicals that exist on earth and limited to how they can interact with a physical brain. Once in a OBE, you have bypassed these physical limitations. 

But it takes a lot of practice till you can do that with OBEs, so it might not be worth it. Taking psychedelics is far more time-efficient. But if you want to do it with OBEs, I recommens first learning how to enter the Esdaile State within a few seconds. Then you have overcome the biggest obstacle.

Edited June 21, 2020 by GreenWoods