It's not possible to unconditionally love someone. Here's why.

[Nak Khid]

3 hours ago, John Doe said:

 

@Nak Khid If unconditional love is directed at an object, then the argument absolutely allows for transformation of said object, in order to test and see if the "unconditional" nature of the love still holds.

No no, that's not correct at all. "Unconditional love" is not a "vow", unconditional love is unconditional love. No offense, but I feel your understanding of even the surface of the argument is very limited. The core of my hypothesis has completely flown over your head. It's probably my fault, maybe I didn't make it clear enough.

 In psychology, unconditional love  refers to a state of mind in which the individual has the goal of increasing the welfare of another, despite any evidence of benefit for themselves.  The term is also widely used in family and couples counseling manuals. Your interpretation is that unconditional love is loving somebody who transforms into something else and therefore you fail to see how someone can unconditionally love someone or something.

Now instead of an alien we look at a mother and child.   The child grows up and becomes a mass murderer.   And as is sometimes the case the parent still loves the child - unconditional love according to your definition. 
If the child turns into a lizard the love doesn't apply the lizard has no attributes of the child and it is just like the child has died. (unless it's a talking lizard)  Still the parents feed the lizard thinking that it might transform back to the child. 

Here's the better test case. The child turns out to be a psychopath and they also turn on the parents, curses them continually and threatens to kill them.   Do the parents still love them? 
Maybe. They  might think its a mental illness that can one day be healed, unconditional love at it again 

Edited June 12, 2020 by Nak Khid

[nistake]

When your love is truly unconditional, you love him whether he's Leo, a serial killer, an alien or just a thought in your mind.

[Leo Gura]

@John Doe The problem is way worse than you think.

You are right in your conclusion that it is impossible for your finite mind to love a thing unconditionally, but the real reason for this is because a finite mind must have conditions otherwise it will cease to exist.

Only an infinite mind which has zero attachments is capable of unconditional love. And another word for an infinite mind with zero attachments or conditions is God. Hence God is Love, and no human will ever be as loving as God until it literally becomes God, at which point it is no long a human being.

BTW, if your mind became infinite you would realize that Leo's shape is irrelevant because all form is fundamentally just a fluctuation of your own consciousness, so the issue isn't about how to love Leo when his form is totally changing but how to love YOURSELF when your form is constantly changing. Since God has no form, it is able to identify with all form and therefore love all form unconditionally no matter how much it changes. From God's POV there is literally no difference between Leo looking like a human vs Leo looking like an alien. God's love is not applied at the level of individuals or objects, it's the entire field of consciousness itself, which is ONE.

You could say that the recognition that all individuals and objects are ONE field, is Love itself.

You  = Me = God = Love

[Nak Khid]

8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@John Doe The problem is way worse than you think.

You are right in your conclusion that it is impossible for your finite mind to love a thing unconditionally, but the real reason for this is because a finite mind must have conditions otherwise it will cease to exist.

Only an infinite mind which has zero attachments is capable of unconditional love. And another word for an infinite mind with zero attachments or conditions is God. Hence God is Love, and no human will ever be as loving as God until it literally becomes God, at which point it is no long a human being.

_____________________________________________________________________________________
You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

If  God is Love, and no human will ever be as loving as God then why does it say "You are God" at the bottom of all your posts? 

[Leo Gura]

20 minutes ago, Nak Khid said:

If  God is Love, and no human will ever be as loving as God then why does it say "You are God" at the bottom of all your posts? 

You forget the second part of that sentence: "no human will ever be as loving as God until it literally becomes God, at which point it is no long a human being"

It is possible to reach unconditional Love. But there is a price to pay, which is surrendering all form. You call this death.

You are only able to love as deeply as your attachments allow.

The logic of love is simple: zero attachment = infinite love, infinite attachment = zero love.

You find yourself somewhere in the middle of those two extremes.

[Spaceofawareness]

Could you unconditionally love the aspect of Leo that is his awareness? Whenever his presence shines through the layers of crud that mostly make up a person, and you get a glimpse of that, can you love that unconditionally? If it is the same in every being, then can you love the presence and not the person? That is what mooji speaks of when talking of love.

[Leo Gura]

8 minutes ago, Spaceofawareness said:

Could you unconditionally love the aspect of Leo that is his awareness? Whenever his presence shines through the layers of crud that mostly make up a person, and you get a glimpse of that, can you love that unconditionally? If it is the same in every being, then can you love the presence and not the person? That is what mooji speaks of when talking of love.

You could love any part of reality.

But if you're picking between good and bad parts, that's conditional love.

Unconditional love doesn't pick good parts.

There is a Love that's higher than what Mooji talks about.

It is wrong to say that Leo's "awareness" is pure and good while his crud is bad and evil. The truth is that the good and the crud are identical. What's necessary here is to become conscious of that identity, not to cherrypick parts.

Love is simply the inability to see "bad".

[Nak Khid]

17 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Love is simply the inability to see "bad".

That's why Hitler came to power

[Leo Gura]

39 minutes ago, Nak Khid said:

That's why Hitler came to power

Yes! Love, exactly.

[Nahm]

6 hours ago, John Doe said:

I still don't see it

Seeing & and there being an it, are conditions. 

[ivankiss]

Love knows no effort.

[SoonHei]

2 + 2 = Love

[John Doe]

@Leo Gura I see.

Why do you think it's Love instead of something else? Why not Neutral? I understand why "Why" questions might be hard here since I assume God preempts Causality.

One more question, is God's love towards His creation implicative of other things that we normally associate with love? For example, if you love someone, it means you might take care of them, protect them, feed them etc. But I notice, to my horror, that Love can be independent of such things. Is God capable of being a mass-murdering psychopath whilst simultaneously being infinitely loving to His victims?

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, John Doe said:

@Leo Gura I see.

Why do you think it's Love instead of something else? Why not Neutral? I understand why "Why" questions might be hard here since I assume God preempts Causality.

Because Love is Infinity and Infinity is the only thing which can exist.

Love is an Absolute.

This must be directly realized.

[WaveInTheOcean]

23 hours ago, John Doe said:

@Leo Gura I see.

Why do you think it's Love instead of something else? Why not Neutral? I understand why "Why" questions might be hard here since I assume God preempts Causality.

One more question, is God's love towards His creation implicative of other things that we normally associate with love? For example, if you love someone, it means you might take care of them, protect them, feed them etc. But I notice, to my horror, that Love can be independent of such things. Is God capable of being a mass-murdering psychopath whilst simultaneously being infinitely loving to His victims?

Love is neutral :-)

It's intelligent. The Godhead, The Universe. Of course, it loves itself.

Of course, it is not hate?

[John Doe]

On 6/16/2020 at 4:21 AM, WaveInTheOcean said:

Love is neutral :-)

It's intelligent. The Godhead, The Universe. Of course, it loves itself.

Of course, it is not hate?

@WaveInTheOcean Love is not neutral. Neutral would be neither loving not hateful, correct me if I'm wrong.

I suspect I'm just wasting time with word games at this point. 

@Nahm I am getting rusty, and feel like I'm stagnating and not getting anywhere. What in your opinion would be the most efficient way to move forward? I'm not in a position to be able to access psychedelics safely. Would appreciate any advice. 

Edited June 19, 2020 by John Doe

[Nahm]

@John Doe

The first question would be what is it which you are really wanting, honestly, at this point in your life. Maybe it’s spiritual, maybe not, idk. What’s the priority for you? Why do you want it? 

[zeroISinfinity]

On 12.6.2020. at 8:00 AM, Leo Gura said:

@John Doe The problem is way worse than you think.

You are right in your conclusion that it is impossible for your finite mind to love a thing unconditionally, but the real reason for this is because a finite mind must have conditions otherwise it will cease to exist.

Only an infinite mind which has zero attachments is capable of unconditional love. And another word for an infinite mind with zero attachments or conditions is God. Hence God is Love, and no human will ever be as loving as God until it literally becomes God, at which point it is no long a human being.

BTW, if your mind became infinite you would realize that Leo's shape is irrelevant because all form is fundamentally just a fluctuation of your own consciousness, so the issue isn't about how to love Leo when his form is totally changing but how to love YOURSELF when your form is constantly changing. Since God has no form, it is able to identify with all form and therefore love all form unconditionally no matter how much it changes. From God's POV there is literally no difference between Leo looking like a human vs Leo looking like an alien. God's love is not applied at the level of individuals or objects, it's the entire field of consciousness itself, which is ONE.

You could say that the recognition that all individuals and objects are ONE field, is Love itself.

You  = Me = God = Love

Thanks for clarification really wanted that answer. 

So I am not capable of mahasamadhi because I hold attachments. There must be a reason I can't stay as such forever. Dunno do I really want that anymore. 

Also need answer to this. Well need to continue dream. 

All love from humans is conditional and have to take it as such. Which I do accept have no problems with that. But can't delude myself or beleive in lies. Need that discernment. 

It's all Love I will give you that but well still have to live and have wisdom. 

Plug off supply line and see how "human love" fades away. I mean I am not stupid. Or maybe I am making a mistake. I mean why I wouldn't I love everything including Hitler all me ain't no problem but possible spiritual bypassing issues etc. 

Dunno maybe Jed will say cleverness but it really is a big question. 

Edited June 20, 2020 by zeroISinfinity

[zeroISinfinity]

On 20.6.2020. at 3:21 AM, Nahm said:

@John Doe

The first question would be what is it which you are really wanting, honestly, at this point in your life. Maybe it’s spiritual, maybe not, idk. What’s the priority for you? Why do you want it? 

Ok. Ok. Ok

 

 

[Nahm]

@John Doe

Yes of course. Anytime.