The Dao Of Love

[Eren Eeager]

It is actually silly that you believe fear is absolute. love extinguish every fear there is.

[Leo Gura]

26 minutes ago, The observer said:

@Eren Eeager I'm not denying love, but you're denying fear.

It's not either or. It's both. The absolute is not love. Love is a half-truth. Love is yin, fear is yang. Or vice-versa. It doesn't matter.

☯️

[The observer]

Keep denying suffering and explaining it away as ego attachment. That doesn't change God. That doesn't make God all loving. It only shows your narcissistic bias.

[Eren Eeager]

@The observer wow !!

[ivankiss]

@The observer In my experience; fear is because of Love. Or better yet; fear is of Love. Fear only fears Love, ever. And it fears it because it gets evaporated by Love's magnificence and beauty. Light has no shadow, really.

Love is that which enables any experience at all. Fear is an experience. It is not Absolute. Love is.

Love always prevails.

Edited May 31, 2020 by ivankiss

[TheAlchemist]

The insistence on the reality of fear and suffering is precisely what keeps it alive. We must hold on to the reality of it or otherwise it dies. And of course the fear is like an entity of itself, it is afraid of losing it's identity.

A month ago I experienced something I would say is a miracle. I was extremely deep in anger and suffering in my apartment almost breaking stuff because I was so intensely furious. 

But then, suddenly I realized (thanks to A Course in Miracles <3) . That anger was only there because I insisted on it being real. I insisted on holding on to it and I could feel something in my mind being threatened when I started questioning the reality of the anger. I kept questioning and suddenly all the anger just instantaneously disappeared like it was never there and I started laughing and I was suddenly completely filled with absolute joy, peace and love.

I just wanted to share this beautiful experience here. For me, fear always feels like a closing down, fear requires resistance and fighting to keep it alive, to keep it real. Love is expansive, it requires only letting go of the illusions. It seems to be more like the base state of everything. 

[The observer]

2 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer In my experience; fear is because of Love. Or better yet; fear is of Love.

This is rhetorical. I could say that love is because of Fear. Or better yet, love is of Fear. 

2 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer Fear only fears Love, ever. And it fears it because it gets evaporated by Love's magnificence and beauty.

Love fears Fear, always. And it fears it because it gets evaporated by Fear's awe and dread.

2 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer Light has no shadow, really.

Love is that which enables any experience at all. Fear is an experience. It is not Absolute. Love is.

See. I could view the duality from this angle or from the opposite one. Light arises from the shadow. Shadow is that which enables any experience at all. Shadow has no light, really. Close the doors and the blinders. Remove all light sources, and tell me again how love is absolute. If it was absolute, it wouldn't change or disappear.

Really, what you're doing here is that you're taking one side of the duality and emphasising it until you confuse it for non-duality, while rationalising away the other side. I could do this everytime. No offence to you or to anyone, but it's pointless to keep coming up with these silly rationalisations. We could recontextualize anything so that it fits whatever narrative we want. The narrative does not describe reality. The map is not the territory.

2 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer

Love always prevails.

Until you're threatened and fear kicks in.

[ivankiss]

@The observer Shadow is loved, no worries.

Sorry, but you have no idea what you're talking about. Or you do, but still, it's all just ideas - not actuality.

Love has no duality. Fear is not "the opposite". That's nonsense.

There are no opposites.

Edited May 31, 2020 by ivankiss

[The observer]

Yes, yes. I have no idea and you guys are God the omniscient. Go experience hell and show me how much you will love it. Your ignorance and arrogance is creating mockery of the people who suffer. Stay on your comfortable armchair, inject 5-Meo, and keep philosophising about love all you want. Keep your heads in the sand. You are deluding yourself, big time.

Peace, I'm out. Now I know that you guys are a bunch of narcissists.

[ivankiss]

2 minutes ago, The observer said:

Yes, yes. I have no idea and you guys are God the omniscient. Go experience hell and show me how much you will love it. Your ignorance and arrogance is creating mockery of the people who suffer. Stay on your comfortable armchair, inject 5-Meo, and keep philosophising about love all you want. Keep your heads in the sand. You are deluding yourself, big time.

Peace, I'm out. Now I know that you guys are a bunch of narcissists.

You obviously know nothing about real, actual hell. Otherwise you'd show more respect, appreciation and gratitude for the very breath you've been blessed with at this precise moment.

What you're doing here is just jerking off to the idea of hell. 

Peace be with you.

[The observer]

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

You obviously know nothing about real, actual hell. Otherwise you'd show more respect, appreciation and gratitude for the very breath you've been blessed with at this precise moment.

You're only proving my point. You're afraid of hell, obviously, like everyone else.

[ivankiss]

@The observer I am absolutely afraid of hell, yes. Real hell, not your little fairytales. But hey, I've already survived it a few times, I trust I could survive it again.

Even hell burns down in the presence of pure, divine Light.

May it find and humble you too, someday.

Edited May 31, 2020 by ivankiss

[DreamScape]

1 hour ago, ivankiss said:

You obviously know nothing about real, actual hell. Otherwise you'd show more respect, appreciation and gratitude for the very breath you've been blessed with at this precise moment.

?

People don't know how good they have it. 

Edited May 31, 2020 by DreamScape

[TheAlchemist]

@The observer I do see what you're saying and I think it is entirely possible. Honestly we have no idea, just arguing at the level of words is never going to result in anything. Only experience can tell us the reality of it and if what you said is your experience, who are we to dispute your direct experience? I am open to the possibility of what you are saying to be true, but I also think it would be fair for you to entertain the possibility that there is a deeper level of understanding. But of course it's your choice. I wish you all the best on your journey!

[ivankiss]

@DreamScape ❤

@TheAlchemist Beautiful.

[The observer]

10 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer I am absolutely afraid of hell, yes.

And yet, here you are arguing that love is not equal to fear, ironically.

14 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer But hey, I've already survived it a few times, I trust I could survive it again.

Arrogant. "You" haven't survived anything. Hell is eternal, just like heaven. It's not something you survive. It's an essential part of life.

19 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer 

Even hell burns down in the presence of pure, divine Light.

Smh. You don't understand. It's not that one removes the other. There's no war. There's nowhere to fly. You can't escape hell, nor heaven. Hell and heaven are both pure and divine, each in its own magical way, and they complete each other.

24 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer 

May it find and humble you too, someday.

May you stop playing God and stop arrogantly assuming things about me. You don't know me.

[The observer]

@TheAlchemist You're assuming I'm the one with a closed-mind here, but what can I say? Why do you not assume they are the ones that are closed-minded? If you're unbiased, why are you pointing your finger only at me and not at anyone else? You said that we honestly have no idea, that means we're all equally subject to the trap of closed-mindedness. And yet, you're only mentioning me in your comment. Stop acting slick. You have no idea, but I might have.

[ivankiss]

@The observer You're right, I don't know you. Sorry if I came off rough. But also not.

Do you love hell?

If hell is eternal - as you say... And so is heaven...Where are you right now, eternal being?

...What are you really trying to prove and who are you proving it to? 

Is our little debate here of fear or of Love, in your eyes? Is it not something to be enjoyed?

May you stop playing not being a divine, loving being. - God.

[TheAlchemist]

@The observer My intuition based on some spiritual experiences is more on the side of love being the fundamental thing, that's why I spoke to you because you have a different view, my aim was to not be confrontational in any way but I guess I didn't succeed in that. I just felt like you were being completely dismissed by everyone so my aim was to point out that your view could also be right and bring some kind of balance between the two sides here.

Edited May 31, 2020 by TheAlchemist

[The observer]

12 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer You're right, I don't know you. Sorry if I came off rough. But also not.

No problem. I'm sorry too. We're humans, we tend to forget.

12 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer 

Do you love hell?

I still fear it. My work is not over yet. For me, the ideal is not to either love hell or fear it. It is to perceive it as it is: Hell. Without denial, and without distortion.

12 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer 

If hell is eternal - as you say... And so is heaven...Where are you right now, eternal being?

I'm somewhere near the middle. Not yet in the ideal place, like I said above, not too close, but also not too far.

12 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer 

...What are you really trying to prove and who are you proving it to?

I'm speaking what I "know" is the truth because I think you are missing it. There's nothing to prove, and no one to prove it to. Examine your direct experience. Try to be as objective as possible. Do you think I don't want love to be equal to the absolute truth?

12 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer 

Is our little debate here of fear or of Love, in your eyes?

Both love and fear are one. I can't separate them from each other. That's the whole point. Oneness is not only love, and not only fear. It's both. 

12 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer Is it not something to be enjoyed?

We can't control what we enjoy. At least, I can't.

12 hours ago, ivankiss said:

@The observer 

May you stop playing not being a divine, loving being. - God.

Haha ?

Edited June 1, 2020 by The observer