how to disprove solipsism ?

[Corpus]

"How to disprove solipsism?" is a question, framed in words, composed of that "stuff" called "language", asked of others (in which case the question makes no sense) or of oneself in ones own "mind"-another term made of the same language-stuff. The blank-slate which is the childs "mind" requires interaction and others to develop language and the notion of "mind" which later overlooks this foundational structure to ask such questions.

If there are no others then why the need to develop language, and how else can one explain the "questions-in-words" in ones "mind"? If solipsism is true then why bother talking to yourself, when talking cannot form via language without others exisiting? Could it even be possible to have the voice in ones head?

[Someone here]

23 minutes ago, Corpus said:

"How to disprove solipsism?" is a question, framed in words, composed of that "stuff" called "language", asked of others (in which case the question makes no sense) or of oneself in ones own "mind"-another term made of the same language-stuff. The blank-slate which is the childs "mind" requires interaction and others to develop language and the notion of "mind" which later overlooks this foundational structure to ask such questions.

If there are no others then why the need to develop language, and how else can one explain the "questions-in-words" in ones "mind"? If solipsism is true then why bother talking to yourself, when talking cannot form via language without others exisiting? Could it even be possible to have the voice in ones head?

All that happens effortlessly in your dreams at night with no problems. 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Someone here

[peachboy]

9 hours ago, Someone here said:

In your dreams no one is real other than you.. 

 

Isn't that an assumption though? Is there a method of proving that the characters in your dreams aren't sentient?

[Someone here]

9 minutes ago, peachboy said:

 

Isn't that an assumption though? Is there a method of proving that the characters in your dreams aren't sentient?

That's the whole point!  You can't ever prove or disprove the sentient of anyone but yourself.  

 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Someone here

[Someone here]

He misunderstood solipsism "the belief that only my finite mind exists".   That's not what solipsism says. To be me more accurate and this is a very important addition "only my finite mind is certain to exist".  When presented this way.. This argument is impossible to refute because since you were born untill you die you don't have access to anything other than your own finite mind. 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Someone here

[Gesundheit]

18 minutes ago, Someone here said:

He misunderstood solipsism "the belief that only my finite mind exists".   That's not what solipsism says. To be me more accurate and this is a very important addition "only my finite mind is certain to exist".  When presented this way.. This argument is impossible to refute because since you were born untill you die you don't have access to anything other than your own finite mind. 

Only problem is that what you're referring to as 'my finite mind' is not certain to exist whatsoever. You're completely making that up without proof.

Edited August 14, 2020 by Gesundheit

[wwhy]

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

That's the whole point!  You can't ever prove or disprove the sentient of anyone but yourself.  

 

Just curious - how do you prove or disprove your own sentience to yourself?

Edited August 14, 2020 by wwhy

[Scholar]

Haven't read much in this thread, so I am not sure if this has been brought up.

 

The problem of solipsism is a good example for the necessity of Faith as a grounding principle for interacting with the Self. People have not solved the problem of solipsism, yet all of them go on with their lifes with an underlying faith in the fact that what they assume about the world is true.

Faith is necessary for the human condition, because it gives direction where no direction is given. It is a miracle that we can have faith, because otherwise we would be lost. Anyone who has experienced a loss of faith in reality will know how disturbing it is and how difficult it is to survive.

 

The problem of solipsism is fundamentally a problem of survival. To be truly uncertain about reality means to abandon all ideas of survival. This is fundamentally why we cannot truly be uncertain, or why it is so difficult to achieve.

 

This is why the christian and the atheist are fundamentally the same. Both have faith that cannot be justified, to ensure mental well being and survival. However most christians nowadays have a belief in the god, but lack faith in the god. Faith is different from belief.

 

And this is why the path towards enlightenment requires in most cases Faith. Because only Faith is that which is not a belief, yet can give direction.

[Nahm]

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

since you were born untill you die you don't have access to anything other than your own finite mind. 

No!!!!!!

[Javfly33]

26 minutes ago, Nahm said:

No!!!!!!

22 hours ago, Nahm said:

 

No? @Nahm

[Nahm]

@Javfly33

No!!!!!!

[allislove]

@Nahm should be like: http://nooooooooooooooo.com/

 

[Nahm]

[Someone here]

@Nahm prove to me for certain that you are an aware being. Or prove to yourself that I'm an aware being. Or prove to yourself that you aren't dreaming at your bed right now. Or prove to yourself that your whole life is not an ant dreaming during  the sunset nap. 

If you don't and you won't.. You haven't disproved solipsism. 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Someone here

[Nahm]

@Someone here

No!!!!!!!

 

[Someone here]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

No!!!!!!

Oh so you can have access to my finite mind?  You Can look through my eyes right now?  You can penetrate people's subjective world and verify who is human and who is a robot?.   Ofcourse you can't. 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Someone here

[Someone here]

3 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Someone here

No!!!!!!!

 

I can just say "yes"  as well and goodbye.  Either explain to me why "no" or you didn't say anything valuable.  

Edited August 14, 2020 by Someone here

[Someone here]

2 hours ago, wwhy said:

Just curious - how do you prove or disprove your own sentience to yourself?

I am sentient because here I am here it is. It's an experience not a matter of proof.  However are you sentient?  How the fuck am I supposed to know?  This requires proof since it's not In my experience. 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Someone here

[Nahm]

24 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Oh so you can have access to my finite mind?  You Can look through my eyes right now?  You can penetrate people's subjective world and verify who is human and who is a robot?.   Ofcourse you can't. 

I have complete and total access of ‘your’ finite mind. I AM ‘your’ finite mind lol. It’s an appearance of me! Solipsism is a limiting belief. It limits actual self realization. That’s what “you’re” not getting, while you’re too busy making a case for it. It’s avoidance, not progress. Suppression, not liberation. It’s not a fault thing, “you” can’t understand this because a thought about transcending the finite mind is not at all the actuality of it. You’re believing rather than doing the work and transcending, imo, and appear to be stuck on mistaking the belief for the actuality. This is also why you struggle to distinguish thought & feeling properly. Scrutinize reactionary behavior and research defensive mechanisms. Just a suggestion of course, but that’d be the ideal start imo. You’ll be feeling like you’ve never experienced feeling before. That and daily morning meditation, and writing about how you feel when emotions come up and empty out. Then start considering retreats, trips, etc. Again, always up to you. Suggestions are like a buffet. Take what helps you where you’re at and leave the rest. 

If you read this thread from the beginning, as well as your other thread, with an open mind, you can spot the reactions and behaviors. There is more than ample evidence for you to see. 

 

“This requires proof since it's not In my experience.“

Gotta let go of “proof”. It’s no more than thoughts being believed about what is prior to thoughts.  

[traveler]

Nothing can be proven, because nothing is real. The subject object reality of me here and someone else over there experiencing another reality, is a dream. There is no actuality to it other than in the dream of the words. The words are appearing from apparent separate users on the forum, but they are all equally empty of an actual doer behind them writing them and empty of actual meaning and substance, because what is pointed to is not in that dream of understanding something, it is the actuality of this unknowable everything appearing as these words, this chair, etc. Whatever is, is all there is.

Edited August 14, 2020 by traveler