Death is final materialist argument.

[Dylan Page]

How would you argue for or against Sean Carroll here? Is there something he is missing? Serious, thoughtful replies only please. 

 

[Leo Gura]

Lol, yeah, he's missing that death is imaginary.

He might as well be talking about the unicorns.

Death is as real as unicorns.

There is zero scientific proof of death.

[WHO IS]

Does it make sense that the brain which is made of dead matter is you which is a living conscious person?

In other words, something dead gives rise is the source of something alive? lol

Edited May 15, 2020 by WHO IS

[Fran11]

He's bought into the materialist paradigm and assumes an external reality that science has never and will never prove.

When you awaken you realise that your body and mind are not "alive" even now in the way materialists think, but that they are appearences inside life (consiousness). Would you say that the body and mind you had in a dream ever really lived? 

Edited May 15, 2020 by Fran11

[EternalForest]

4:40 Oh dear...

The most intellectually honest scientific standpoint would indeed be to say "We have no way of knowing if there is life after death". How does he know that the afterlife doesn't play by the laws of physics as we currently know them, including what we know about dark matter? Compared to the information we'll likely have 500 years from now, science is still in the stone age. He's speaking like he understands things about metaphysics that, in reality, he has no way of knowing!

15:48 It would seem pretty blasphemous wouldn't it?

18:20 Actually, all aspects of science should be held to scrutiny. How do we know that one day our understanding of atoms doesn't turn out to be false?

Edited May 15, 2020 by EternalForest

[Preetom]

 

 

[Preetom]

He seems enthusiastic. But I wish he drank his own medicine and applied skepticism on fairy tales of atoms, molecules, science, objective knowledge.

But alas! His faux skepticism can only go so far to shoot down only the comical notions of an old man in the sky and an  airy spirit in a fleshdoll.

"We have figured out the basic reality" nothing could be more deluded than this. Its like saying I know who I am. I got my job, partners, kids, hobbies, my certain fetishes and fears and thus I know myself perfectly and in next 50 years that wont change at all. 

What a bad joke ?

 

[Dylan Page]

@Leo Gura

What aspect of death are you referring to when you say that death has not been scientifically proven? The non-existence part, the entire notion that there is a thing that is dying, both, or something else?

My general view on death is that judging it as good or bad is taking it too far. We don’t know what it means or if it happens for a reason or whatever, and many assume the worst about it. Would you agree or disagree with this view? 

 

[Dylan Page]

@Preetom @EternalForest He definitely talks as if atoms are the most basic fundamental particles. He seems to think that if we understand atoms, then we in theory understand all macro phenomenon. I can see the logic behind the idea that if you understand how the basic blocks of something work, you understand how all possible combinations of those blocks would work, but the problem is assuming that there is a basic block in the first place, and that there are blocks at all that have rules. I suppose this is the fundamental assumption behind all of his arguments that is really taken on faith. What do you think?

Edited May 15, 2020 by Dylan Page

[Preetom]

4 minutes ago, Dylan Page said:

@Preetom He definitely talks as if atoms are the most basic fundamental particles. He seems to think that if we understand atoms, then we in theory understand all macro phenomenon. I can see the logic behind the idea that if you understand how the basic blocks of something work, you understand how all possible combinations of those blocks would work, but the problem is assuming that there is a basic block in the first place, and that there are blocks at all that have rules. I suppose this is the fundamental assumption behind all of his arguments that is really taken on faith. What do you think?

In addition to that, he is making what is known as a category error in philosophy.

Death is subjective. All knowledge is subjective. Anyone any realm knowing anything is subjective.

But he is trying to explain or argue against that with an objective magic particle called atom. 

He is a smart man. But not keen enough to see that he imagined that objective atom in his subjective knowledge in the first place.

 

[Dylan Page]

@Preetom @Leo Gura When you say that knowledge, death, and all forms of knowing are subjective, do you mean that they are all experienced or had from a point of view? I can look at someone in a palliative care unit pass away and say that they died. This is a seeming fact in my mind, just as I assume it is a fact in their mind as well. I suppose I can’t actually know if there is anyone actually dying there, but if that is true, I can’t assume there is anyone witnessing someone dying there as well. Which is to say that there is no subject at all. However, from a sort of experiential perspective, this makes no sense. I am here, you know what I mean? So to say that everything is subjective assumes there is a subject to begin with, which I’m not sure is even true. What do you think?

Edited May 15, 2020 by Dylan Page

[Leo Gura]

36 minutes ago, Dylan Page said:

My general view on death is that judging it as good or bad is taking it too far. We don’t know what it means or if it happens for a reason or whatever, and many assume the worst about it. Would you agree or disagree with this view?

See my video: What Is Death?

Death cannot be proven because identity cannot be prove.

Prove to me that you are a body.

[Dylan Page]

@Leo Gura I just made a comment to @Preetom about the “prove you are the body” comment you just made and tagged you in it. Is this what you are talking about? There is no subject? 

[Leo Gura]

30 minutes ago, Dylan Page said:

@Leo Gura I just made a comment to @Preetom about the “prove you are the body” comment you just made and tagged you in it. Is this what you are talking about? There is no subject? 

All finite identities are relative. In a sense, you are whatever you believe you are. So death cannot be a fixed thing because it depends on what you believe yourself to be.

And if you realize that the only true identity is Infinity, then you become immortal.

[zeroISinfinity]

Wow nailed it. 

Well it's True. 

No self =God/LOVE for sure it's felt. 

But still I am a billionaire. 

 

[Someone here]

33 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

All finite identities are relative. In a sense, you are whatever you believe you are. So death cannot be a fixed thing because it depends on what you believe yourself to be.

And if you realize that the only true identity is Infinity, then you become immortal.

Let's say I started to believe that I'm my coffee table.. I'm not this body-mind but rather I'm that coffee table.  Will I actually become the coffee table..? If someone comes tomorrow and just destroys the coffee table into pieces I won't feel that "I" am being  destroyed. 

Edited May 15, 2020 by Someone here

[zeroISinfinity]

@Someone here I can't be some black Void, right? 

Pure Infinite Love? 

Ring some bells deep down? 

No, ok. 

Edited May 15, 2020 by zeroISinfinity

[Someone here]

5 minutes ago, zeroISinfinity said:

@Someone here I can't be some black Void, right? 

Pure Infinite Love? 

Ring some bells deep down? 

No, ok. 

Don't ask me what you are because I don't even know what I am (specifically). 

[Member]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

See my video: What Is Death?

Death cannot be proven because identity cannot be prove.

Prove to me that you are a body.

What are your thoughts on panpsychism?

[zeroISinfinity]

11 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Don't ask me what you are because I don't even know what I am (specifically). 

Spiritual practises and yes these psychedelics. 

All of this your (❤️) Breadcrumbs to remember what you (❤️) are. 

You are doin' it well no worries.