Confusion about "appearance is reality".

[Consept]

@Someone here

Awakening is your direct experience being expanded so yes there will be more to your current direct experience if you had an Awakening experience. 

Saying that there are atoms doesn't add something and isn't 'more' it's just a way to explain and understand something that is there using structures your mind could comprehend. 

It's like if you eat an apple and have that experience, the experience itself is the thing and will give you the best understanding of the taste of an apple. Not a book that describes the molecular structure of said apple. These descriptions are limited and more of a tool than anything 

[Someone here]

16 minutes ago, Consept said:

@Someone here

Awakening is your direct experience being expanded so yes there will be more to your current direct experience if you had an Awakening experience. 

Saying that there are atoms doesn't add something and isn't 'more' it's just a way to explain and understand something that is there using structures your mind could comprehend. 

It's like if you eat an apple and have that experience, the experience itself is the thing and will give you the best understanding of the taste of an apple. Not a book that describes the molecular structure of said apple. These descriptions are limited and more of a tool than anything 

Intersting perspective. Thank you! 

[Galyna]

6 hours ago, Someone here said:

In what sense is there "no Leo"?  Do you mean it in metaphorical way?  Or do you mean it physically actually? If I fly to Las Vegas and go to your address I won't find you in there? Really? 

@Someone here This is so funny, I've read it about ten times on this forum, these exact words. It is actually cute. 

Every single newbie is flying to Vegas to give Leo a punch in the face to prove he is real, LOL 

[Galyna]

@traveler I was reading your comments in this thread and I have a question, since moderators and you gave a pretty solid explanation about some terms.

Intellectually I can fathom that I am not my body and I am NOT a human being. I took this principle and ran with it for years, so I meditated last night thinking about it. Here is what I came up with, I will try to explain this as clear as I can. 

I imagined an absolute void, in this void (please do not be very pedantic about the word "void) there are a lot of perceptions that constitute to make this illusion of my body. However, there is no way my body exists fully. Because I can only perceive some parts of it. There is no body, per se...correct? Right now I am sitting and typing this. I can see my hands, they are real, however, I can not see my  back, almost don't feel it, only when putting my awareness on it!!! So, does it mean by back physically does not exist. According to Leo and your comments, it does not exist, I know this. Things that manifest through perception are the only things that are real in this direct experience. ( when say "real" I mean that they have some existence not only in my thought, but also in this present moment) 

I imagine it as a soup of various perceptions that makes this illusion of my body.

Actually, this thread made me understood more what was going on. I still can not break the illusion that I am not real. I am stuck here, it is very solipsistic. I need to transcend it on the another level. I am working on this now:

I am not the human being and this body is just an illusion. 

I am sorry if I sound silly. I do not know how to put this into words to show you my understanding. I am using something very close to how I see it.

There is this PRESENT MOMENT in which consciousness is floating and manifesting itself via various perceptions, creating this illusory reality. Nothing outside of it, I got it.

 

[traveler]

@Galyna

Nothing is real. Nothing actually exists. This is emptiness, you're speaking to it. You are emptiness conversing with itself. Out of time, no meaning, nothing to find, you are it already. This is emptier and fuller than an appearance in it could ever imagine or "intellectually understand" haha. Obviously. But not for the dream character, of course.

This isn't happening, this never happened, this IS. You cant know it, you cant have it, you cant find it, because it is all there is and will ever be and simultaneously it never was and will never be. 

 

[Galyna]

@traveler Can we talk from the imaginary person point of view, LOL? It would be easier for me to imagine this, hahahah

 

[James123]

6 minutes ago, Galyna said:

@traveler Can we talk from the imaginary person point of view, LOL? It would be easier for me to imagine this, hahahah

 

You are doing it right now. Lol

[Someone here]

2 hours ago, Galyna said:

@Someone here This is so funny, I've read it about ten times on this forum, these exact words. It is actually cute. 

Every single newbie is flying to Vegas to give Leo a punch in the face to prove he is real, LOL 

LOL! 

[Someone here]

1 hour ago, traveler said:

@Galyna

Nothing is real. Nothing actually exists. This is emptiness, you're speaking to it. You are emptiness conversing with itself. Out of time, no meaning, nothing to find, you are it already. This is emptier and fuller than an appearance in it could ever imagine or "intellectually understand" haha. Obviously. But not for the dream character, of course.

This isn't happening, this never happened, this IS. You cant know it, you cant have it, you cant find it, because it is all there is and will ever be and simultaneously it never was and will never be. 

 

Is this your direct experience of life or is it just a belief that you hold?  Because I seem to live in a totally different reality than what you are describing here! 

[Osaid]

@Someone here Well, how do you separate consciousness? What does it even mean to separate consciousness? There is only the illusion of duality but in the end God cannot truly separate itself from itself. It all comes back to one consciousness.

11 hours ago, Someone here said:

is stuff behind the scenes (hydrogen and oxygen atoms etc) that make up the body or not. Because they are not in direct experience.. Is is there more to reality than just direct experience (appearances)? 

Think of it as a dream. When you see a chair in a dream, you can extrapolate and say "oh the chair is made of wood that was cut down", but in reality you know that you simply imagined the chair out of nothing and that the only thing there is the appearance of the chair. That appearance of the chair is the only thing that exists in the dream. Sure, thinking of these ideas helps you to survive and predict what is happening in reality, but it is not the case that they exist in that moment. They only exist as you become aware of them.

 

 

 

[Galyna]

@traveler Thank you for your explanation.

[Galyna]

9 hours ago, Someone here said:

Is this your direct experience of life or is it just a belief that you hold?  Because I seem to live in a totally different reality than what you are describing here! 

Read another thread about debunking solipsism, Leo gave a very good explanation there, hold on, let me find it for you.

"There are no others. Period. It's only you imagining stuff.

But awakening is far more radical than simple solipsism." - LG

Your reality is the only valid reality, please read this:

 

"There is nothing whatsoever outside your present moment. You are just still in denial about that. If you look very precisely and carefully you will notice that all other people have been your imagination 100% of the time. Even to deny what I'm saying you must imagine a Leo!

Notice that you are talking to yourself, not Leo.

Awakening is a radical thing. Keep deconstructing your reality." LG

So!!!! When you say that you have a very different reality from other people, do you realize that there is only one reality, right, and this reality is in your direct experience, it is yours!!!.

Now! The hardest part: there is no one or nothing to lean on, there can not be any backup, do you realize this? You are alone in this work. 

This is one way street, my dear.

[Nahm]

@Galyna True, yet, is there something wrong with someone receiving some help? What if, given where one’s at on their path, getting assistance is part of their journey, and contributes to healing, or maybe understanding, and the very self realization in which Truth is revealed?  Admittedly though, I’m probably biased about that. Maybe not. I dunno. Dunno > solipsism. 

[Galyna]

@Nahm After I've posted that message I had a similar thought.

 I've posted it and thought to myself: what was the point of that forum, all those messages, people, replying them back, communicating that way, asking others, answering... Then, another thought had popped up: it is a part of my growth, with all its pain and suffering, probably to make me strong and to lead to some big realization. 

Edited May 10, 2020 by Galyna

[Nahm]

@Galyna All nice & mindbending isn’t it? 

♥️

[Nahm]

@Galyna ??☺️??

[Inliytened1]

13 minutes ago, Galyna said:

@Nahm After I've posted that message I had a similar thought.

 I've posted it and thought to myself: what was the point of that forum, all those messages, people, replying them back, communicating that way, asking others, answering... Then, another thought had popped up: it is a part of my growth, with all its pain and suffering, probably to make me strong and to lead to some big realization. 

Yeah and when you awaken you realize the whole time that you were pointing yourself towards awakening.  That all of this is just you guiding you.  Haha.  The ultimate mindfuck.  But that's Oneness.  That's Self Love.

[Nahm]

@Galyna We’ll have to agree to disagree. 

@Inliytened1 Yep. Lol. 

[Galyna]

8 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yeah and when you awaken you realize the whole time that you were pointing yourself towards awakening.  That all of this is just you guiding you.  Haha.  The ultimate mindfuck.  But that's Oneness.  That's Self Love.

Yes, I know, right! 

Gosh, but I want you to be real, guys! I want to be weak sometimes and want to lean on. I do not want to be a warrior all my life.

[Inliytened1]

4 minutes ago, Galyna said:

Yes, I know, right! 

Gosh, but I want you to be real, guys! I want to be weak sometimes and want to lean on. I do not want to be a warrior all my life.

That's the beauty of it.  All you have to do is imagine it and it is.  That's how our perspectives are generated.  Through shifts in consciousness