Dirty Bulking - Is It Too Good To Be True?

[Sleepwalker]

Does anyone have some experience with dirty bulking, or in other words - eating junk food to build muscle? 

I've recently been involved into bodybuilding and stumbled upon this information. The idea seduced me really quickly  I'm female and my body is very pear shaped, therefore I'm currently working to build muscle in my upper body to look more proportional. 

As far as I'm concerned, to build muscle, you need to be in a caloric surplus and this is the initial bulking phase. But during that period, you'll necessarily gain some fat. Now, does it really matter on what kind of food I'm bulking, as long as I track my macros and make sure I get the proteins, carbs and fats necessary for muscle gain? Why would I have to cut bread and sweets on a bulk, as long as they stay in the range of my macro intake and I don't go overboard with the surplus? Do they prevent or interfere with the muscle growth, or have some other negative effect on the process? What exactly makes the difference between someone who bulked on healthy food and someone who bulked on junk food, besides, obviously, that the first way is much healthier?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but even if you're eating all healthy (with the intention to gain muscle), you'll get fat no matter what diet you're eating, simply because you're in a caloric surplus. I think that muscle gain comes always with at least a little fat gain. Now, there are some ways in which you can gain muscle and lose fat at the same time, but in the rule, this is the fastest and most effective way for muscle growth. Yes, this way I'll probably look really bulky and shitty for myb half a year, before I go on a cut, but the other method would take me probably as twice as long. I've been struggling with my body shape for quite a long time, so I'm kind of really needy for some tangible results. 

Don't understand me wrong, I don't want to go all crazy with dirty bulking, hell no. I care about my health, but I'm asking if it's ok, for example, if only 500 calories of my overall daily intake is junk food (as long as it suits my macros). 

Thanks in advance, I'm veeery curious whether this shit really works!  

[ChimpBrain]

What you're proposing is called flexible dieting aka IIFYM aka if it fits your macros. It was originally popularized by Layne Norton but has since been bastardized to a large degree by people using it as an excuse to live off of crap food every day all day. His original proposal was that you get 80-90% of your calories from healthy sources and the remainder from "fun" foods. The idea being that this would allow for greater adherence to the  diet by keeping you from getting burned out on chicken and broccoli 5 times a day lol. This is what I do. 

Edited July 4, 2016 by ChimpBrain

[Siim Land]

The biggest mistake people make with bulking is that they eat whatever. If you're not tracking your macros it's very easy to consume too big of a surplus with junk food. 

What's wrong with consuming too many surplus calories? Well, muscle is built very slowly and you're not really helping building lean body mass after a certain point. After you've hit a point of diminishing returns you'll be using those surplus calories solely for fat gain. Also, you can't lose fat cells. They will only shrink or increase according to your body fat percentage. Dirty bulking may cause some metabolic damage and may leave you fatter than you would normally be.

To build as much muscle and as little fat as possible you have to eat only a small surplus, about 500 calories would be sufficient. The longer you do this the better your gains are going to be. Also, you don't have to kill yourself with cardio later when cutting as well. Keep it controlled.

As far as calorie quality is concerned, then it doesn't matter for body composition. However, IIFYM isn't optimal for long term health. The 80/20 principle still works and isn't that bad. 

For muscle building you actually need:

• adequate stimulation (train hard enough)
• protein synthesis (eat enough protein)
• energy (calories to build new tissue)
• the necessary hormones (mainly mTor and HGH, including others)

I've managed to actually build muscle and strength on a ketogenic diet by following these guidelines. 

Hopefully, it helps you in your decision making.

Edited July 6, 2016 by Siim Land

[Sleepwalker]

@Siim Land Now you got me really curious.. I was dabbling with a ketogenic diet for a couple of weeks in the past. 

Let me ask you, how did you manage to gain muscle on a ketogenic diet? I decided to quit it exactly because the diet seemed NOT to be appropriate for putting on muscle mass. It is very effective for fat loss, though. But building muscle?

What about carbohydrates? I've researched this so deeply and in detail, that I simply cannot emphasize enough how important it is to eat lots of carbs when trying to build muscle, carbs that a keto diet cannot provide. Yes, protein is a key factor, but it isn't enough. You HAVE TO take in carbs along with it. They fuel your workouts and give you the energy to maximize muscle growth.

I'd like to hear your opinion since you've managed to break these facts.. I suppose that you probably can build muscle on a keto diet, but very slowly and just up to a certain point, after which the muscle gain starts to platoe. or maybe you just have really good genetics, so the diet could work out for you in such a way. I don't know what exactly the composition of your diet did look like, but the most accurate ketogenic diet contains about 25% protein, 5% carbs and 70% fat.. Well, how did you feel? Did you ever feel dizzy or without energy on your workouts due to the lack of carbs? I experienced that a lot on my keto diet. I felt very very weak and tired.. Therefore I concluded that it isn't optimal for building muscle, because I wasn't able to lift heavy..

[Siim Land]

@Sleepwalker The 4 variables necessary for muscle growth listed above are independent of carbs. 
Of course, you can't expect to perform at your best during the adaptation phase. Ketosis will work only if you do it long term. At first I also experienced fatigue but after having done it for 1 year, I don't feel tired at all. The longer you stay in ketosis the better you get at utilizing fat for fuel. Your performance may get slightly worse. But only initially. Your endurance will definitely increase, but after adapting your anaerobic performance will get back to its baseline.

Building muscle in ketosis is yes slower than with carbs. However, the muscle you'll be putting on will be PURE lean body mass and basically no body fat whatsoever. The other aspects of longevity and mitochondrial density of ketosis make it all worth it.

 

The main driver of muscle growth on keto is the training stimulus. You don't need carbs to get stronger. To train hard enough you simply have to have enough will power and muscle glycogen. Muscle glycogen doesn't need carbs. Glycerol, which is the backbone of triglycerides can be converted into glycogen by the liver. It might just take slightly longer. To be honest, you actually need to train like a professional athlete to NEED carbs. I don't think you have Crossfit WODs every day. 

You can also read my blog post about how to build muscle on keto. I go into more detail about the science and physiology aspect of it. As well as my personal experience. http://siimland.com/how-to-build-muscle-on-keto/ 

[Sleepwalker]

@Siim Land Cool, you've got some damn good results using this diet. Still, I wonder why there's so much information out there that stresses a high carb intake for building muscle mass. But thank you, this was so helpful and resloved a lot of my confusion about this topic. I'll definitely give it a try