Jordan Peterson Delusion

[IJB063]

@UnconsciousHuman It's just fake manipulative bullshit that retards fall for 

[UnconsciousHuman]

@IJB063 Alright dude, your true colors be showing.

 

Edited April 18, 2020 by UnconsciousHuman

[UnconsciousHuman]

@IJB063 No I think you just want to dismiss the guy entirely. Dude, the guy is a doctorial psychologist with years of clinical experience, he's pretty knowledgable and good at handling basic psychological issues like laziness, depression, relationships... 

You're not being realistic, you just want to paint him a fool. 

[DivineSoda]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Well, for starters, you could tone down the hateful and judgmental tone.

It's possible to rebut someone's false worldview with compassion and detachment. Without making it personal. Without totally rejecting him.

For the love of God (I mean Leo), please take your own advice. Your tone around here is very often exactly that. This is your self-deception. 

[Commodent]

30 minutes ago, DivineSoda said:

For the love of God (I mean Leo), please take your own advice. Your tone around here is very often exactly that. This is your self-deception. 

Hmm, I think he has changed a lot lately.

[IJB063]

@UnconsciousHuman

The man has some good lectures

Some good stuff on psychology e.g. the big five factors

I like how he's popularized Fyodor Dostoyevsky

Good analysis of Jungian archetypes

I hadn't even heard of the Gulag Archipelago until JBP mentioned it a few years ago

He does a lot of good stuff on mythology

Some good stuff on Nietzsche (although he butchers him occasionally)

I could go on but overall the mans a force for good

I just wish he'd stop trying to elevate himself to a position he doesn't deserve via his manipulative tactics

I don't believe the man does it consciously, I'm just sick of his preaching and his white eyed followers who say things like that hes greatest thinker of all time

There are plenty of others just as intelligent and articulate as JBP, alive currently 

And then you have historys geniuses before him that he makes reference to

But unlike JBP, they haven't won the popularity contest through their manipulation

I think that they deserve more attention and JBP should step off his pedestal and he shouldn't of been put up there in the first place

He's now been forced off the pedestal anyway with the blanant hypocrisy of a man telling you how to live your life, while he's had manic depression his entire life and is now in rehab for a benzo addiction, completely collapsing underneath the weight of this relatively unearnt fame 

Now him being famous is better than some alternatives but I think its a sad reflection of people, that JBP is the one that they have chosen

And remember you're the one who titled this thread originally Fuck Jordan Peterson

I shit on his idiot followers and suddenly my

5 minutes ago, UnconsciousHuman said:

true colors be showing.

I'm not hiding anything, neither am I dismissing him entirely

I'm just pointing out that he's human like all of us, so shouldn't be turned into some hero

 

[DLH]

4 hours ago, UnconsciousHuman said:

But again my point being is that his world view that he imposes onto people in a sense justifies and solidifies him as a very worthy and valuable human being.

Good topic, I was one of those individuals that blindly followed someone else’s perceptions, POV and beliefs.  Over the years, I eventual recognized my propensity to resonate with like minded people that validated my current healthy or unhealthy feelings and emotions. 

Every thought, idea, imagination, belief, feeling and emotion that attracts our attention and focus, is either a direct or indirect thought, perception and belief that we consciously or unconsciously allowed “freely” into your “physical mind consciousness”.

To “impose” means to force or inflict something on someone else.  The Antonyms for Impose are: “remove” and “disburden” (Google) ones-self from the belief, POV, perceptions.  Imposed or otherwise.

Jorden Peterson is in no way imposing on his followers.  People that are attracted to Jordan Peterson, or any other person for that matter, are consciously or unconsciously resonating with similar perceptions, beliefs and frequencies, and are “freely” buying into the reality that is being created.  The lesson that the human mind needs to learn from this experience is to “remove” and “disburden” the perceptions and beliefs they have freely attached themselves with.

There is no right or wrong.  People are exactly where they need to be for their human experience and development.  When they are ready, and only when they are ready, will they break free from those beliefs and feelings.  Hopefully when they do break free, they will formulate newer healthier beliefs and emotions.

The same applies to those that do not resonate with Jordan Peterson, but are still attract to him.  The question they should be asking themselves is; why are they still focusing on Jorden Peterson?   Could it be an invoked personal feeling and emotion they are not aware of?  Could it be that they are unconsciously resonating with perceived judgmental attitude, lack of integrity, lack of consciousness, arrogance, self importance, victimization, helplessness, narcissism etc.?  Or are there some positive truths that they have not recognized?

Again, there is no right or wrong.  They are exactly where they need to be to learn how to become more aware of their thoughts, ideas, beliefs, feelings and emotions.  When they do become aware of their own projections, hopefully they will realize that they have the freedom to remove or disburden themselves from the beliefs etc., that no longer serve them, using love, compassion and understanding.   

Having said that, whenever I feel a good, or uncomfortable feeling, or emotion, I now know I have an attachment to a good or uncomfortable belief, thought or idea that either serves, or hinders my conscious expansion and growth. 

A student sharing thoughts, ideas, and beliefs!

Edited April 17, 2020 by DLH

[IJB063]

@DLH

Saying that there is 

Just now, DLH said:

no right or wrong

Is such a cop out

If there is no such thing as right or wrong then there is no such such thing as truth

Just now, DLH said:

There is no right or wrong

Is a truth statement

So you've just created a logical paradox

Why do people take things to such epistemological extremes so that they can avoid saying that something is bad

It destroys the entire point of discourse and this forum 

Lets just assume that there is a right and wrong so we can actually communicate

You assume it anyway with

Just now, DLH said:

or hinders my conscious expansion and growth. 

If there is no right or wrong than there is no place to expand or grow to

You should be perfectly content with your current situation/experience

[UnconsciousHuman]

@IJB063 The title was clickbait. 

Yeah, good job clarifying the positive, I agree with that 

[DLH]

26 minutes ago, IJB063 said:

@DLH

Saying that there is 

no right or wrong

Is such a cop out

An experience is an experience!  A perception is a perception!  Who are "you" to declare what is right or wrong?

Edited April 17, 2020 by DLH

[IJB063]

@UnconsciousHuman It was good clickbait

It got me and others to read your post

Look how many replies and views its got

I would change the name back to it

[UnconsciousHuman]

@IJB063 Not interested in doing that.

[IJB063]

@DLH

Just now, DLH said:

An experience is an experience!  A perception is a perception!  Who are you to declare what is right or wrong?

I'm someone who actually wants to communicate a point instead of just taking things to esoteric meaningless extremes so that I can avoid saying that something or someone is bad

@UnconsciousHuman

Well you already did it 

Edited April 17, 2020 by IJB063

[DLH]

9 minutes ago, IJB063 said:

I'm someone who actually wants to communicate a point instead of just taking things to esoteric meaningless extremes so that I can avoid saying that something or someone is bad

@UnconsciousHuman

Maybe and maybe not, I don't necessarily agree with your statement, but that's okay because it's neither right or wrong!  It's your POV.  ✌

Edited April 17, 2020 by DLH

[UnconsciousHuman]

@DLH

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

5

Quote

Good topic, I was one of those individuals that blindly followed someone else’s perceptions, POV and beliefs.  Over the years, I eventual recognized my propensity to resonate with like minded people that validated my current healthy or unhealthy feelings and emotions. 

Every thought, idea, imagination, belief, feeling and emotion that attracts our attention and focus, is either a direct or indirect thought, perception and belief that we consciously or unconsciously allowed “freely” into your “physical mind consciousness”.

To “impose” means to force or inflict something on someone else.  The Antonyms for Impose are: “remove” and “disburden” (Google) ones-self from the belief, POV, perceptions.  Imposed or otherwise.

Jorden Peterson is in no way imposing on his followers.  People that are attracted to Jordan Peterson, or any other person for that matter, are consciously or unconsciously resonating with similar perceptions, beliefs and frequencies, and are “freely” buying into the reality that is being created.  The lesson that the human mind needs to learn from this experience is to “remove” and “disburden” the perceptions and beliefs they have freely attached themselves with.

There is no right or wrong.  People are exactly where they need to be for their human experience and development.  When they are ready, and only when they are ready, will they break free from those beliefs and feelings.  Hopefully when they do break free, they will formulate newer healthier beliefs and emotions

Haha, Imposed isn't the right word you're right, yes, Jordan isn't a dictator forcing his followers to believe his ideas but these ideas are indeed implanted implicitly and explicitly in the minds of his followers and those ideas do not lead to truth or joy in-fact they stutter the spiritual growth of his followers. 

Sure from the perspective of God, there is no right and wrong, but there is a good and a lesser good, the lesser good being anything that results in fear, suffering, resistance, ego. To suit your terminology it is a lesser good to delude your followers and trap them in ego structures that they suffer (What jordans does). 

You implied that people go through a natural growth process and that it is not Jordan that traps them but that they choose to resonate with Jordan... so in a sense, they trap themselves through Jordan. 

An example I'm gonna give you is, say your wife and I got to know each other and I had a sense of humor and some big-time charisma and she was into me so I lured her down to my laboratory and brainwashed her using a new brainwashing technology into believing that you are an evil demon and that nothing you say can be trusted. Would you blame your wife if she came back the next day demonizing you? No!!! I in this story represent Jordan Peterson, and your wife represents his followers. What I've done is a lesser good if it hadn't been for me your wife would have not been brainwashed and deluded. See what I'm saying with this example? 

Stay healthy bro  

Edited April 17, 2020 by UnconsciousHuman

[DLH]

5 hours ago, UnconsciousHuman said:

An example I'm gonna give you is, say your wife and I got to know each other and I had a sense of humor and some big-time charisma and she was into me so I lured her down to my laboratory and brainwashed her using a new brainwashing technology into believing that you are an evil demon and that nothing you say can be trusted. Would you blame your wife if she came back the next day demonizing you? No!!! I in this story represent Jordan Peterson, and your wife represents his followers. What I've done is a lesser good if it hadn't been for me your wife would have not been brainwashed and deluded. See what I'm saying with this example? 

Stay healthy bro

Yes, I understand what you are saying.  Having said that, it all depends on an individual’s level of consciousness and awareness and it also depends from what POV one decides to perceive reality.  In the example you provided, your POV, my wife’s POV and my POV will play its self out depending on how conscious, unconscious or aware each person is.  There are infinite variables and probable realities that could play out and occur in this example.  So, the basic point I am trying to convey from POV is that we create our own realities and experience in the physicalness of this reality with our thoughts, beliefs etc.  There is no right or wrong with your reality and experience, my reality and experience or the collective reality and experience.  Any form or formless state of reality is just a perception and an experience of grace! 

Those that follow, judge, or resent Jorden Peterson are exactly where they need to be, and if they are conscious enough will explore their beliefs, thoughts and feelings as to why they are attracted or are focusing there attention on this particular reality that they themselves are creating within the collective reality?  In fact, isn’t our exploration of our thoughts, ideas, imagination, beliefs, feelings, emotions the essential cruxes of this reality and our experience with the All-That-Is?  

Take care!

 

Edited April 17, 2020 by DLH

[RendHeaven]

5 hours ago, The Don said:

When I think about the future, nobody will surpass Jordan Peterson when it comes to articulating understanding.

Without a shadow of a doubt, nobody can beat Jordan Peterson intellectually. And I'm not saying that the purpose of life is to be the best intellectual ever, but when it comes to succces, intelectuality matters a lot.

The ancient Greeks called these kinds of people "sophists."

Masters of rhetoric - yet fundamentally self-deceived.

A pretty tongue does not equate to intellectual mastery.

[Roy]

You are reaching so hard for something that doesn't exist here @UnconsciousHuman. Jordan's worldview has it's flaws but it certainly isn't downright evil or destructive, or being used by him as some malicious architecture to get power, fame, or "fuck" people over (that just wreaks of resentment and paranoia).

The reason he is resonating with people so much right now is because that's apparently what they want. Our culture is swinging too radically and at too fast a pace towards progressivism at the moment. He represents a rationalist reactionary movement against that. To bring that pace more to a level where it can be integrated with ease. I'm pretty far left in many regards and even I can see this.

I'd like to bring up another extremely relevant point though that is getting overlooked here;

Everyone has such unrealistic expectations of their teachers, to the point it hinders their growth. Subconsciously you see someone that gets famous or is revered in some way and you go to them expecting them to be perfect and all inclusive. If they don't fit the mold of your worldview, don't pay constant lip-service to it, or don't fight your intellectual enemies at every opportunity you get resentful and angry at them. You expect everything from them. You expect they are going to teach you everything you need to know from here and lead you to the promise land.

People think they are immune from doing this but it's happening all the time. It's just cloaked by their ego under the idea that they are "learning" and being "critically thinking individuals looking for truth!"

There is one problem however; Every teacher, worldview, mode of thought, idea, rationalization............... is partial.

Jordan Peterson is partial. He teaches some useful and interesting things about responsibility and morality, but is dismissive about many other things.

Leo Gura is partial. He teaches some useful concepts and big picture ways of understanding the world, but doesn't include many practical exercises or road maps on how to execute those things.

Stop demonizing and demanding so much. If someone doesn't have what you want, go look for the next teacher. Learn what you need to learn from them and ignore the rest.

Edited April 17, 2020 by Roy

[Jacobsrw]

@UnconsciousHuman Similar to what @Leo Gura stated, he holds intellectual integrity, however, this a function of the psychological community he adheres. JP is not necessarily a malicious man, he is somewhat unsure of himself and uses his scientific endeavours to try and rectify this. Of course science is limited and this one of the delusions I feel he does not acknowledge. He is good at compartmentalising material, just not so effective at broadening and expanding upon it.

Yet, the point is that his apparent deception, myopicness or dogma is more of an innocent misunderstanding than an intentional act of misguidance. Almost like a dog vehemently chasing it’s tail, not realising the tail it’s chasing is it’s own.

Edited April 17, 2020 by Jacobsrw

[Edan]

7 hours ago, The Don said:

In my opinion, Jordan Peterson is one of the greatest intellectuals of all time; if not the greatest one. I'm following him since 2018.

Jordan Peterson never ceases to amaze me when I see the way he speaks to people. His speeches are so coherent that it makes me hard to believe a human being can be so articulate. He's very concise when he formulates sentences.

That's just tells you that you need to be extra suspicious towards him.

When you meet a charismatic person like that a red warning light should immediately pop up in your mind because these could be extremely dangerous and manipulative people. When someone has great persuasion skill, that means he/she can be highly manipulative, egocentric, narcissistic, etc... They could convince you of so many things... They know exactly on which buttons to push. Your description matches Every cult leader and tyrant throughout history. Of course I'm not saying that JBP or every charismatic person is a psychopath, but admiring people for their charisma and communication skills could lead you into great delusions